Where is the 1080p Setting under HDTV Setup?

delanewf

SatelliteGuys Family
Original poster
Jan 20, 2005
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There have been 1080p televisions out for some time now. Why don't the receivers have a 1080p setting for TV type under the HDTV setup?

Since they don't have such a choice, which is the better one to use if you have a 1080p tv, 720p or 1080i? Does it make a difference?
 
Short answer is there isn't a setting for 1080p on any current Dish Network receiver. Set your receiver to output the highest resolution your TV supports for the best picture. The receiver has circuitry that converts the different HD resolutions out there to match what it is sending to your TV.
 
The long answer is...

Dish Network does have some 1080p programming, but it is VOD movies that are downloaded to your receiver, and there aren't many of them. When you play one of those movies the receiver does a check through the HDMI link to your TV to see if it supports 1080p. If it does, it sends the content through (1080p/24 hz refresh, cinematic frame rate). If your TV does not support it then it sends the content through at the highest resolution that it does support.

They do not support live 1080p broadcasts, and currently there are no channels out there that broadcast more than 1080i.
 
There is missed one high priority key - HDCP handshake; if your TV will not satisfy Dish request, then regardless of supporting 1080p/24 input signal by your TV, you'll never see it in 1080p, but 1080i or 720p :(.

It would be disaster for Dish if somehow you'll manage to write the movie to PC or BR disk, so HDCP will prevent it.
 
As to 1080i vs 720p, most Dish programming is sent down in 720p, so if you set your receiver out to that there will be no conversion. Furthermore, 1080i is interlaced, meaning every other line is repeated information... so 1080i is roughly equivalent to 540p. (this is a simplified explanation, but will do for you Earthlings)

Most ppl think 1080i is the best, but oh well. You will see a definite improvement with 720p.

Sorry, but everything you said is wrong.

Most Dish programming is 1080i by a landslide.

In 1080i everyone other line is not repeated, nothing is repeated, and it is not the same as 540p. 1080i has more information/detail than 720p.

Do some research and you will find most people agree 1080i is the best. Even the theoretical idea of 720p is better for motion/sports doesn't even hold up. If you compare what CBS can do with 1080i for sports to what you get from ESPN/ABC you will see CBS wins hands down. Not saying this is entirely because of resolution, but CBS, NBC and NFLNetwork have much more detail during NFL games than FOX and ESPN, no comparison.
 
Of course 720p looks better. It is higher resolution than 1080i, and is a superior presentation. Those who don't know this... haven't actually looked. They are just going by the number, like all the other cattle.

My explanation that every other line in 1080i is repeated, is simplified, as I said above. In motion there is slight new info in alternating lines, but the consequences of interlacing far overwhelm this.

There is nothing, I repeat nothing, that is repeated in 1080i. Not sure where you got that from but it is wrong.

As for higher resolution, again 1080i wins. A full frame of 1080i is 1920x1080i pixels (nothing repeated). 720p is 1280x720. You do the math.

The difference is 720p shows a new frame 60 times per second. 1080i shows a new frame only 30 times per second since every 1/60 of a second it updates only 540 lines. But again, nothing is repeated.

If 720p is superior why didn't Blu-Ray use it?


It's give and take. 1080i has more detail, 720p is better for motion (only shows full frames rather than half fields)...but again this is in theory. In practice most agree that 1080i is better...even for sports/motion if done correctly...and correctly is the hard part.

720p networks = FOX, ESPN, ABC and just a handful of others. All other channels are 1080i.
 
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Add to that - 720p format came from low end HD TV sets and production video equipment what manufacturers rush to bring to stores and catch the market early.
 
So if one has an HDTV which is native 768p, should the Dish receiver be set to 720p or 1080i full-time? Or is it best to manually select based on the programming (e.g., ABC 720p/CBS 1080i)? Does incorporating one of these strategies make any discernible difference?
 
So if one has an HDTV which is native 768p, should the Dish receiver be set to 720p or 1080i full-time? Or is it best to manually select based on the programming (e.g., ABC 720p/CBS 1080i)? Does incorporating one of these strategies make any discernible difference?

Depends, just have to try both and see. Since most channels are 1080i I set my 622 to 1080i for my 768p set and let my TV do the de-interlacing and scaling.
 
Quamtum, Give it up!

1080P BlueRay is slightly better than 1080i.

760p is not better than 1080i, period.

fred
 
ABC
ABC
Prime-time shows: Cavemen; Pushing Daisies; Boston Legal; Brothers & Sisters; Desperate Housewives; Grey's Anatomy; Lost; Men in Trees; Ugly Betty; made-for-TV movies; theatrical films
News, reality, and late night: Dancing With the Stars; Good Morning America
Sports: Selected NBA games, selected NCAA football
Specials: 2008 Academy Awards
Resolution: 720p
Schedule


CBS
CBS
Prime-time shows: Cold Case; The Big Bang Theory; Cane; CSI: Miami; CSI: NY; Criminal Minds; NCIS; Numb3rs; Two and a Half Men; The Unit; Without a Trace; The Young and the Restless (daytime); made-for-TV movies; theatrical films
News, reality, and late night: The Late Show with David Letterman
Specials: The Grammys
Sports: NFL (AFC), NCAA Final Four, selected NCAA football
Resolution: 1080i
Schedule


Fox
Fox
Prime-time shows: 24; Back to You; Bones; House; K-Ville; Prison Break; Til' Death
News, reality, and late night: American Idol, Fox News Sunday
Sports: NFL, MLB, NASCAR
Resolution: 720p
Schedule


NBC
NBC
Prime-time shows: 30 Rock; ER; Heroes; Law & Order: Special Victims Unit; The Office; Chuck
Specials: Macy's Thanksgiving Day Parade
News, reality, and late night: The Tonight Show with Jay Leno; Late Night with Conan O'Brien; Saturday Night Live
Sports: Sunday Night Football, NHL, NASCAR racing
Resolution: 1080i
Schedule


PBS
PBS
Shows: Highlights include American Masters; Austin City Limits; Frontline; Tracks Ahead; Chefs A'Field; Soundstage; American Experience; Nova
Sports and specials: N/A
Resolution: 1080i
Schedule


The CW
The CW
Prime-time shows: Everybody Hates Chris; The Game; Girlfriends; One Tree Hill; Smallville; Supernatural; Aliens in America; Reaper; Gossip Girl
Resolution: 1080i
Schedule


A&E HD
A&E HD
Prime-time shows: Dog The Bounty Hunter; Criss Angel Mindfreak; Gene Simmons Family Jewels, Cold Case Files; The First 48; CSI Miami; The Sopranos
Resolution: 1080i
Schedule


Animal Planet HD
Animal Planet HD
Prime-time shows: Meerkat Manor; The Blue Planet; It's Me or the Dog
Resolution: 1080i
Schedule


Cinemax HD
Cinemax HD
Selected movies
Schedule


Discovery HD
Discovery HD
Prime-time shows: MythBusters; Dirty Jobs; Man vs. Wild; Build it Bigger; Survivorman
Resolution: 1080i
Schedule


Discovery HD Theater
Discovery HD Theater
Shows: Selected programming from the Discovery Channel library
Resolution: 1080i
Schedule


ESPN HD
ESPN HD
Shows: SportsCenter; Monday Night Countdown; NFL Countdown; NFL Live; NFL Primetime; Baseball Tonight; selected episodes of SportsCentury; Playmakers; ESPN original programming; other studio shows
Sports: Monday Night Football; Sunday Night Baseball; other selected NFL, MLB, and NBA games; college football and basketball; numerous other HD sports events yearly
Resolution: 720p
Schedule


ESPN2 HD
ESPN2 HD
Sports: NBA; MLB; college football, baseball, and basketball; tennis; rodeo
Resolution: 720p
Schedule


Food Network HD
The Food Network HD
Description: HD version of Food Network; will also feature programming from Fine Living. Shows include: Barefoot Contessa; Everyday Italian; Good Eats; Iron Chef America
Resolution: 1080i
Schedule


Golf Channel HD
Golf Channel HD
Shows: The Big Break; Fore Inventors Only; Golf Central
Sports: Selected golf events all year long
Resolution: 1080i
Schedule


HBO HDTV
HBO HDTV
Shows: Big Love; Entourage; Rome; The Sopranos; The Wire; Tell Me You Love Me
Sports and specials: Original HBO programming; World Championship Boxing; selected HBO comedy specials; Inside the NFL
Resolution: 1080i
Schedule


HDNet
HDNet
Shows: Original HDNet series include True Music; HDNet World Reports; HDNet Concert Series; Bikini Destinations; Get Out; Art Mann Presents; Deadline; Sound Off with Matt Pinfield; Dan Rather Reports; other TV series include The Fugitive; Hogan's Heroes; Smallville; Hack; Wiseguy; Charlie's Angels; The Agency; Odyssey 5; The Handler
Sports and specials: NASCAR Grand National Division; selected games from the NHL; USOC; CART; Major League Soccer; boxing; and horse racing
Resolution: 1080i
Schedule


HDNet Movies
HDNet Movies
Shows: Movies include Boiler Room; Species; Silence of the Lambs; The Hunt for Red October; etc.
Sports and specials: N/A
Resolution: 1080i
Schedule


HGTV HD
HGTV HD
Shows: World's Most Extreme Home; Small Space, Big Style; Design Remix; Decorating Cents
Resolution: 1080i
Schedule


The History Channel HD
The History Channel HD
Shows: Simulcast of regular History Channel programming including: Boneyard; Cities of the Underworld; Dogfights; Ice Road Truckers; Modern Marvels; Lost Worlds
Resolution: 1080i
Schedule


MHD
MHD (aka MTV-HD)
Shows: MTV Unplugged; MHD Roadie Trip; MTV Life & Rhymes; MTV2 $2 Bill concerts; VH1 Storytellers; CMT Crossroads; MHD Top Ten; MHD Video Stew
Specials: MTV Video Awards; CMT Music Awards; Music with Attitude concert specials
Resolution: 1080i
Schedule


Mojo
Mojo
Prime-time shows: London Live; I Bet You; Three Sheets; Timeless; Uncorked with Billy Merritt; Dr. Danger; The Show
Resolution: 1080i
Schedule


The Movie Channel HD
The Movie Channel HD
Movies: Includes D2: The Mighty Ducks; Ghostbusters; Blue Steel; Who's Harry Crumb?; Beyond Borders; Agent Cody Banks 2: Destination London; Muriel's Wedding; Saw; Uptown Girls; Amityville 3D; Houseguest; Last Action Hero; Soul Plane; Marci X
Sports and specials: N/A
Resolution: 1080i
Schedule


National Geographic Channel HD
The National Geographic Channel HD
Description: HD simulcast of National Geographic Channel
Resolution: 720p
Schedule


NBA HD
NBA HD
Shows: N/A
Sports and specials: More than 200 games in 2007-2008 season, including the NBA, WNBA, International and Euroleague, and the Entertainer's Basketball Classic
Resolution: 1080i
Schedule


NFL Network HD
NFL Network HD
Shows: NFL Films (TBA)
Sports: Selected regular-season NFL games in 2007 season
Resolution: 1080i


NHL HD
NHL HD
Sports: Selected games from the 2007-2008 season
Resolution: 1080i


Showtime HDTV
Showtime HDTV
Shows: Brotherhood; Californication; The Tudors; Dexter; The L Word; Weeds; selected movies
Resolution: 1080i
Schedule


Starz HD
Starz HD
Shows: Simulcast of Starz channel with movies in HD
Resolution: 1080i
Schedule


The Science Channel HD
The Science Channel HD
Shows: Simulcast of The Science Channel with selected programming in HD; Mars Rising
Resolution: 1080i
Schedule


TLC HD
TLC HD
Shows: Simulcast of TLC with selected programming in HD; Little People, Big World
Resolution: 1080i
Schedule


TNT-HD
TNT-HD
Shows: Without a Trace; Alias; Cold Case; ER; Law & Order (selected episodes); The Closer; selected movies
Sports: NBA games and All-Star weekend, NASCAR
Resolution: 1080i
Schedule


Universal HD
Universal HD
Shows: Law & Order: SVU; The Equalizer; Monk; Battlestar Galactica; Medical Investigation; selected movies
Sports: NCAA football, Dew Action Sports Tour; various Extreme Sports competitions
Resolution: 1080i
Schedule


Versus HD
Versus HD
Shows: Simulcast of Versus programming, selected shows in HD
Sports: Selected games from the regular 2007-2008 NHL season and playoffs, selected NCAA Football games, various PBR events
Resolution: 1080i
Schedule

Taken from HDTV Listings - HDTV World - CNET.com

I know this list is missing a few and has a couple extras that E* doesn't have but it's a pretty good list. By my count I have 5 for 720p and 28 for 1080i from this list. I know ESPNews is missing and is 720p so you can make that 6, but TBS is another missing and it is 1080i. I know there are more than that missing but I don't think it's enough to make up the difference.
 
Give what up? I am not trying to sell you anything. I don't care which mode you use. Use 480i for all I care.

But don't tell me that most channels are 1080i when it contradicts what I have from a reliable source, unless you can prove it. Show me evidence.

Or is this a religion?
Source please ?

Anyone will bring easy proof a) your source unreliable b) wrong.
 
You also left out the resolution of Cinemax. They made a big public announcement awhile back that all their movies would be native 1080i, so it's pretty safe to assume that their HD channel is 1080i.
 
And for you spitballers, I suggest you actually consider what is happening to the signal as it is processed, and to carefully consider exactly what shows are transmitted in 720p. I am not going to help you out here owing you the attitude of some of you, but certain people have figured it out.

You'll have to elebarate more because I don't get it. It is not show dependent, it is channel dependent that determines the format you receive it in.
 
You also left out the resolution of Cinemax. They made a big public announcement awhile back that all their movies would be native 1080i, so it's pretty safe to assume that their HD channel is 1080i.

It wasn't my list. I just copied it from CNet. I did notice that the resolution for Cinemax was not there but it wasn't really important to the point so I didn't bother looking it up.
 
Most of you are partly right. :)

The problem is that mostly no signal is broadcast at 1080i x 1920 since most of the programming is dumbed down in the recording distribution format of HDCAM to horizontal 1440, not 1920 unless it was done using the latest HDCAM equipment which does offer enhanced hor resolution. There are some that may offer the full ATSC Horizontal spec since the video was studio produced and recorded with equipment capable of this higher standard. The reality is there is far more equipment in use today that is HDCAM standard. e.g. HDNET uses older cameras that are 1080i x 1440. There is no putting back extra digital information when it wasn't captured in the first place. But on top of this production standard, the fact is that all network programming regardless of whether it was shot with new or older cameras, or even on film, is all CONVERTED to a single limit standard as a matter of network or station policy. They have to do this for technical reasons to prevent the transmitter from going nuts everytime a different bandwidth enters the TV production.

But the real answer to the dilemma between 1080i and 720p is that 1080i is indeed an interlaced format that was invented to first offer the highest quality signal and remain within the original 6Mhz channel spectrum and be properly displayed on a CRT analog monitor. 720P x 1280 was an equivalent set of standards to produce a progressive frame image that is better displayed on a digital pixel based monitor and still offer the highest image for that monitor type. Conversions of 1080i to progressive for the purpose of display on a digital monitor will indeed reduce the line base to 540 V pixels as the odd and even scan lines are combined to meet the frame rate. 1080i is 60 fields per second. But the complete 1080 screen frame takes full two fields to make and that is still 30 FramesPS ( note these are color corrected for timing in NTSC / ATSC to 29.97 fps for sync match on the real time clock but we don't need to get into that here as it relates to another complication of the exact timing of video. If you wanrt to know that, it is a topic for a different thread.)

So the end of the story here is that in effect, when viewed on their own high end intended display system both will have about equal image quality with respect to vertical and horizontal detail. Unfortunately, the 1080i x 1920 requires an extremely expensive monitor system to display that resolution as it was designed. Today most people have switched to digital displays that are pixel based and progressive ( progressive means that the image gets flicked on in an instant on the screen rather than being painted left to right, top to bottom twice (interlaced) over a length of time. The image remains on screen as it is painted like this due to a chemical property of the screen called phosphor persistence). But TV Networks still transmit with interlace so you need to do a conversion and whether you do that in the receiver or the monitor is the real question. Regardless of where you do the conversion to progressive it is a given that Progressive is ultimately where you will end up in the signal just before you see it as light on your screen. :)
Now enter the latest 1080p60 x 1920. This is a newer format that represents the highest current TV standard offered only in Blue Ray and some camcorders. No tape format currently offers this level of bandwidth we can buy. Blu Ray disk is your best option to see this. It will offer the highest quality video and can only be displayed on an appropriate digital monitor.
So what about 24P. The main purpose of 24P is to achieve the high resolution quality of BluRay format ( 1080p x 1920 but reduce the frame rate to 24 frames per second to match celluloid film which is always at 24 FPS for presentation. BY not converting the original program film from 24 fps to 60 fps ( 59.94) certain conversion artifacts are eliminated and you see the film in not only the highest resolution but also the least amount of conversion artifacts because there is no conversion from film to your display.
So what are the conversion artifacts that you get when watching a 24 fps film at 60 progressive video frames? Ever notice the right to left pan blurriness in a film on Blu Ray? If you don't ever see tyhis it is likely you are viewing at 24 P. If you do see this you are viewing at either 30 p or 60 p on your monitor. contrary to what some believe, there is no gain to resolution with 24p, only eliminate motion artifacts.

So the end story on best quality today is this-

Best Blue Ray Video is at 1080p60 x 1920
Best Blue Ray from films is at 1080p24 x 1920
.
Most 1080p24 monitors will have an automatic switch when connected by HDMI to a BluRay player. The PPV 1080p24 movies that Dish is doing work much in the same way by testing your connection and if allowed, you'll will see the movie film at 1080p24. If not it comes in at the Video rate. ( I'm not sure if they do p30 or p60 as the only one I have watched was a film and it was appropriately seen here at p24.)
 
The problem is that mostly no signal is broadcast at 1080i x 1920 since most of the programming is dumbed down in the recording distribution format of HDCAM to horizontal 1440, not 1920 unless it was done using the latest HDCAM equipment which does offer enhanced hor resolution.

Agreed, but I think for the purposes of this discussion it was assumed this to be 1080i, I could be wrong. But if someone is using this for the arguement that there are fewer 1080i channels than 720p then I give up. :)

Conversions of 1080i to progressive for the purpose of display on a digital monitor will indeed reduce the line base to 540 V pixels as the odd and even scan lines are combined to meet the frame rate.

But that's the cheap way out and modern sets don't do this anymore, correct? All in how the de-interlacing circuit is really being done.

Rescaling 1080i to 720p
 

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