Where to put preamp for OTA Antenna

[farm]

I'm installing a DB4 and Channel Master 7778. I am trying to split the antenna signal with 1 side going to a super home node which incorporates tuner 2 of a Dish Network reciever. The other side is going to be split once more into a networked HD dual tuner antenna for a computer.

The antenna only has about 6 feet of RG6QS coax before reaching the box where the connection will be made.

The super home node is amplified, but I'm not sure where to amplify the antenna with the 7778. Before the first splitter? Before the second splitter?

Thanks,

 

[farm]

A Picture might help.

 

[farm]

Please see next reply for photo.

 

[farm]

 

[Jim5506]

There should be no splitters between the power injector for the pre-amp and the pre-amp.

The pre-amp should be located as close to the antenna as possible (<1 ft is optimum).

 

[farm]

Thanks for the reply. The preamp has about 1.5 ft. of coax between it and the antenna input. I will mount the power supply for the preamp in-line next, before any other splits. Any other tips, I'm all ears. Thanks.

 

[Jim5506]

Have the antenna as high as physically possible.

Lean back with a cold one.

 

[farm]

Well, it's all hooked up and "sort of" working. The Super Home Node (SHN) is cutting the OTA signal quite a bit. Without the node I am getting 95-100% on all channels using just the preamp on the antenna. If I send that signal through the SHN a couple OTA channels drop to 40% and most are 60-70%. 40% is on the fringe of being able to maintain a signal and watch the channel.

The SHN is amplified with the included amplifier. I'm not sure what to do at this point, since the purpose of the SHN was to be able to combine the OTA and dish tuner 2 signal to distribute it to multiple locations. It is doing that, but rendering a few OTA channels unwatchable.

Also, no matter what channel I output from the Dish Tuner 2, the signal is has some snow. I have tried channels in the 20s, 30s, 40s, up to 60s. The higher I go, the grainier the signal from the Dish tuner. I don't have a low pass filter and didn't think I needed one,.

Ideas?

 

[farm]

I should also mention that I am not splitting the OTA antenna signal at all at this point. The only splits are occurring within the SHN. The signal from the OTA antenna goes directly from the preamp into the SHN.
Thanks,
Chris

 

[KenSoren]

Look real close at which channel your 722 TV2 is using. It defaults to channel 60 and it sounds like you have some OTA coming in on that channel. The ota can be both digital and analog so you need to check both. Check out tvfool.com and see who is currently using what channel frequencies in your area. You will probably find one of the 2 thru 13 channels temporarily using a channel that is close to the one you are trying to use for TV 2.

I had the same problem in the LA area and found our CBS channel 2 using channel 60. Once I changed the TV2 channel to 63 everything worked fine.

 

[Jim5506]

I might run the cable directly to the 722 and the two channel output from the 722 to the SHN.

 

[farm]

I have tried almost every channel for the TV2 output. My options for the modulator setup are Air 21-69 and Cable 73-125. I have been using the Air channels for the modulated output since I am combining with OTA antenna rather than cable. I'm wondering if the TV2 modulated output from the Dish 625 is interfering with the OTA signal to the point where the TV2 output is "snowy" on all channels and the OT signal is weak. I've read up on low-pass filter, but I'm not sure that would help my issue.

Since I have the home node installed, I'd like to try and figure out how to make it work. My alternative would be to combine and cmplify separately, that is, combine the TV2 modulated output and OTA antenna input with a combiner and then run that through a separate 4 or 8 port amplifier. I'm not sure why this would work any differntly than the home node, which just seems to combine the 2 functions in one.

 

[KenSoren]

Try the reverse splitter with no amplification to one line and see what happens. If that works add the other lines. I am not familiar with home node but you might have a problem with too much amplification - do a search in the dish network forum and see what you can find about home node - I recall reading about problems in getting them to work properly.

The snowy problem is exactly what I had until changing the TV2 output to 63, then everything cleared up. Did you check TVfool.com? You might be suprised what channels are being used in your area.

 

[harshness]

Contemplate skipping the SHN altogether. Sometimes a DA makes things worse.

 

[farm]

Contemplate skipping the SHN altogether. Sometimes a DA makes things worse.

The appeal of the SHN is the ability to combine the modulated output of the Dish Tuner and the OTA antenna signal and send those combined signals to multiple locations so I can watch OTA or switch to the Dish output channel and watch the Dish.

I will try bypassing different legs to see if it is the OTA antenna affecting the Dish or the opposite. I don't get a lot of locals, but here are the channels I get with the OTA antenna (real channel numbers listed rather than virtual):

10
19
23
28
31
44

I've contemplated saying to heck with the Dish Tuner 2 output and leaving that setup how it was prior (using diplexers, which worked fine). I could then just run a new coax line to the locations for the OTA antenna. The problem is that I would still have to find a way to combine things at each TV since there is only 1 RF input on the TVs.

 

[KenSoren]

You really don't need the home network - just reverse a splitter and use it to combine the dish TV2 and the OTA lines, then connect one of your remote TV lines and see if it works. If it does work, then put a splitter after the combiner (backwards splitter) and hook up the other TV's lines. You can see if you need any type of additional amplifer at that point.

Did you check TVfool.com out yet? Print both the digital and analog lists to see whats in use. This will probably explain your problems.

 

[farm]

I tried the power supply on the modulated input and 2 of the outputs and it made no difference. It actually made no difference if installed or not on the quality of the modulated signal output (snowy). I tried every channel for modulated output from 23-60 and some were better than others, but all had a significant amount of noise and snow. I tried unhooking the TV input from the SHN to see if it was overpowering the modulated input and the signal was still grainy.

When I unhooked everything and just ran the OTA TV signal to my main TV I was at 100% on every channel. I then inserted a splitter and still, 100% on every channel. With the SHN, my highest channel was 86% and my lowest was 15% (unwatchable). I don't understand why the home node, which splits the signal 4 ways (~7 dB loss) , would cut it down so drastically and a single, non-amplified splitter (~3.5dB loss) keeps everything still at 100%.

I'm starting to think that the home node isn't functioning properly or the power supply if defective. Does the power supply addition (amplification) have any affect on the signal strength of the TV input? My signal strength when everything was setup did not change if the power supply was used or not.

The power supply is connected exactly like the Dish distribution diagrams.

I'm wondering if THIS might help???
Chris

 

[harshness]

The problem is that I would still have to find a way to combine things at each TV since there is only 1 RF input on the TVs.

This is where a splitter is used. OTA on one leg, distribution on the other leg and send the combined signal to the TV.

 

[farm]

This is where a splitter is used. OTA on one leg, distribution on the other leg and send the combined signal to the TV.

Yeah, I thought of that, but if the home node, which is essentially a combiner for multiple outputs is creating such an issue, I was not confident that using a splitter as a combiner would work either.

 

[boba]

Invest a $1 and find out sometimes the simplest methods do work and it is a lot cheaper than your SHN.