wireless internet interfering with C Band

[jmag487]

Hi there. A month or so ago I posted about my signal stuttering and freezing up and I checked every connection, bought another LNBF and swapped out receivers, but no change. Well, as it turns out, I also had gotten setup with a wireless internet provider (with a small dish and transmitter) that is apparently what is interfering with my signal. As soon as I powered that down my signal looked fine. Is there anything I can do that might allow these to coexist? Any kind of filter or something? I live in a rural area and am thrilled to get decent internet finally, but I like watching my c band stuff too! Any ideas?
Thanks,
Jim

 

[FaT Air]

List of all FTA equipment in use??
Provider is using which band for your wireless, 2.4 or 5ghz or 'something else' and specify?
Is their dish aimed towards your FTA dish(es)?

 

[Titanium]

Definitely check the bands for your local provider's WiFi. Likely you will find it is just below the North American C-band frequencies of 3.7 - 4.2GHz.

Not usually one to suggest that one of my products will fix a problem, but you may benefit from the Titanium Satellite C1-PLL with a soft filter at 3.65 and hard filter at 3.6GHz. This filters out much of the FCC licensed wide-area WiFi that is operating below 3.7GHz. The LNBF that you mention in your previous posts covers 3.4GHz - 4.2GHz and will be susceptible to wide area WiFi operating >3.7GHz.

 

[jmag487]

I'm not sure what frequencies the internet provider is using, so I'll have to ask. As far as the location goes: The internet dish is more or less at a right angle to the C Band and about 60 ft or so in front and off to the left. And I did buy one of the Titanium C1-PLL's after seeing the reviews and it works well, but the interference is still there when the internet stuff is powered on. How is the filtering done on that or is that a separate device? The receivers I have that I have swapped back and forth are the Micro HD and an OpenBox s10. Thanks again!
Jim

 

[ftageekyyc]

To identify the frequency in use, do you have admin rights or a login of some kind on the router/gateway? If so, it wiil be indicated somewhere in the administrative interface.

If not, you should be able to confirm the frequency used from information on the hardware, or searching the model # of the equipment on your premises.

 

[jmag487]

ok, the router indicates 2.4ghz.
Jim

 

[radio]

I'm finding this one interesting. Are you using a wireless "local" 'net or a satellite provided one?
When I had "starband" back in it's early days, if someone with a radar detector parked in front of my storefront apartment, service went away.
I can't believe that "standard" satellite internet from any brand would interfere with C-band!

Interesting thread to follow!

 

[jmag487]

It is a small local company that is just getting started in my area. I don't really understand the technology, but it is some kind of radio/line of sight that works pretty well for me.
Jim

 

[Titanium]

Just to follow-up on the C1-PLL. The filter is built into the hardware. If looking at a spectrum analyzer you would see the RF cut off at 3.6GHZ and soft slope above.

Need to determine if the RF is getting into the cable drops or via the reflector/feedhorn. Would be easy to see if you had a spectrum analyzer, but we can investigate a few other ways.

Are the coax lines close to each other? It might be easy to run another drop out to your satellite system at a distance from the internet drop. If this fixes the problem, and the drops must be run close to each other, snake one cable over the other in a repeating "S" pattern for the length of the run. This may cancel out interference between the two drops.

As an experiment, just have someone get close behind the WiFi antenna between the WiFi and the dish. This might show if RF blocking will keep the WiFi signals from getting into the feedhorn.

Could you temporarily move the WiFi antenna to an area behind your dish or better yet around a corner use the building to shield the dish from the WiFi antenna?

We used to erect chicken wire fences to shield C-band dishes from terrestrial interference, like point to point telephone links or radar from local airports. If the WiFi antenna cannot be moved, try building an "RF Fence" behind the WiFi, between the WiFi and the dish. A single layer of chicken wire fence material attached to metal fence posts or to a ground rod if using wood posts.

 

[ftageekyyc]

I've probably just confused things with my previous post when I wrote router/gateway, sorry.

Typically with most Wireless Internet Service Providers, there will be a box of some kind outside, either on a tripod on the roof or attached to a mount on the side wall of your building.

Then, from that unit 1 or 2 pieces of cable will run to a box inside. If you can get a part/model number from whatever box the WISP installed inside when you got your internet installed, we should be able to confirm what frequency they are using to communicate to their tower. Common names for manufacturers of this equipment would be Motorola, Huawei, and ZyXEL.

With the name of the equipment and the name of the service provider we should be able to figure out what frequency they are transmitting on.

 

[jmag487]

I have yet to hear from my internet provider regarding the frequencies, but the cable for the C Band dish is buried and enters into my basement, so the cables shouldn't be the problem. I am attaching pictures of the setup if that helps clarify things. Thanks again for your help!
Jim

 

[jmag487]

And this looks like the device NanoBridge 365.
http://www.balticnetworks.com/ubiqu...65ghz-21-5-22-5-dbi-dish-bridge-solution.html

 

[migold]

If the yellow 'circle' indicates the WiFi antenna, then the C-Band dish is almost pointing directly at it. Titanium's idea of a chicken wire or other metal mesh screen may be the easiest way to stop the interference. You will probably want to wait til the weather is better to get on the roof and try the idea.
Alternatively, remounting the WiFi antenna dish on the chimney, out of sight of the C-Band dish may also prove to solve the problem, if it can still get the Line of Sight to the provider while not be in the line of sight of the C-Band dish.
Good Luck!

 

[Titanium]

Agree with migold and jmag487. There is a terrestrial C-band transmitter installed in front of your satellite dish!

The smaller C-band dish will not have a very tight beamwidth and the WiFi signals are probably reflecting directly into the feedhorn. The C1-PLL is at a soft cut at that frequency and will attenuate pesky side lobes, but this is head-on.

Little that can be done to build a RF fence without limiting the performance of the WiFi. I would have the WiFi antenna relocated.

 

[jmag487]

Yes, the yellow circle is the location of the wireless setup. And unfortunately I don't have a lot of flexibility with the wifi setup and that is about the only location where I have line of sight to the tower for that. I did a quick search and was wondering if any of these C-Band filters (eaglecomtronics, dawnsat) would help at all? As you can see from the pictures we are kind of buried in snow right now and the diagnostics are a little more difficult!

 

[Titanium]

A dedicated mechanical filter cut for the specific offending frequency mounted on a feedhorn with LNB(s) would provide more attenuation, but anything near the band edge will have some attenuation for your lower C-band frequencies. A large dish with tighter beamwidth would also help.

But the real problem is that the position of the WiFi antenna will likely always cause a problem! Changing your satellite system components is only applying a bandage.

 

[jmag487]

Looks like this is going to be difficult! The only other spot that I MAY be able to still hit the wifi tower with the antenna is located about 15 to 20 ft north of the C Band dish. It would be pointing at more or less right angles to the C band dish, but I imaging that will probably still interfere I'm not really clear on the whole fence thing. Where would that be located with my current setup?

 

[wallyhts]

Perhaps see if your power company with come drop a pole next to your driveway and install a light. Then have the wisp come install on the pole. I seen this before here in Kentucky. It's less then $100 and just a few bucks for the light a month.

 

[FaT Air]

I'd be gettin some 'hardware cloth'. ~1/4 inch mesh and mount it right on the side of the I-Dish. Rivet or screw it to the lip. Ground is 'taken care of'.

EDIT: 'N hope there's no trouble with snow filling it up.
EDIT 2: Maybe just clamp it on to see if it works?????

 

[ftageekyyc]

It looks like Brian's initial thoughts were correct.

Your internet is operating at 3.65GHz.