BD titanic taking on water?

vurbano

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http://www.cdfreaks.com/news/14109

Xbox360 HD DVD drive recognized as optical drive on PCs
Posted by Dan Bell on 13 October 2006 - 17:40 - Source: Gizmodo

This could be interesting, especially if you have a HTPC. It seems Gizmodo was in attendance at a Microsoft-Toshiba demo of the Xbox360 HD DVD player and Toshiba 2nd gen HD DVD players. The article said that at the demo, the reps there had some new HD DVD movie discs that blew away the ones sold at retail at the moment as far as quality goes. They said the films played over component connections were of a stunning quality. Interestingly, the output to the display from the external HD DVD drive was of course 1080i, but they said it was de-interlaced by the 50" Pioneer 1080p display and it looked great. But, read below for a tantalizing tidbit, that is even more fun to ponder about:
1049111413
Some things I found out, and can talk about is the 360 HD-DVD drive can be plugged into a PC and it will be recognized as an optical drive, but will not play HD-DVD movies. I asked what if you have the proper HD-DVD software on the PC, to that [redacted] said that he didn't know, it hadn't been tried yet- maybe there's something there...

Well, wouldn't it be interesting if these $199 dollar HD DVD external drives would work on a PC with a software addition? It might entice some home theater PC owners to make the leap to HD optical! Most already have a 720p or 1080i display and I bet there are some component connections available for such a device.
 

chicagofilms

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Jun 15, 2004
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The free BD or HD disc is not a bad sig at all. I think it is the opposite.

Anyone remember the early days of DVD? Same thing happened. After the first year or so there were even deals "Get 5 free DVDs with the purchase of a player". It helped people get a library started, get movies out there and feed the addiction.

Best Buy is like that shady guy in the schoolyard, "Here kid, the first one's free" :D
 

JoeSp

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Vurbano, usually you are pretty right on but I think you have slipped a cog here. First, for the home theater owner there was no need to purchase a XBOX360 for movie viewing as it could not play HD-DVD movies. When the HD-DVD drive comes out then yes, but until then there was no need too. However, it will be cheaper and more functional to purchase a Toshiba HD-DVD drive for $499 then the 360 and the MS HD-DVD drive -- $299 + $199 = 498 with no support for HD audio -- this is called a no brainer here. The PS3, on the other hand, will be seen by early BluRay adopters as a less expensive buy in at $499. That's right, fully fuctioning, HDMI 1.3 equiped, TrueDolbyHD encoding 20GB model.

Second, all of the BluRay supporting studios including Disney will be bringing their films out on BluRay in both the 25gb and 50gb discs, and for now that is the only format they are supporting. Families with children will be buying into this simply because of Disney. And by February there will be twice as many BluRay titles as HD-DVD titles on the market. When spring hits the number game will really begin to favor the BluRay camp. All the wishing in the world is not going to change this.

Third, As I have stated earlier, no add-on for any console has ever done better than 5% of installed owners. If you say that by December there will be 6 mil 360 units sold in the US that only equates to 300,000 HD-DVD drives sold. Let me know when MS hits that number for installed HD-DVD units. I think it will be next year before you see those kind of numbers on the add-on. Remember , that 5% is for the lifetime of the product. There will be 400,000 PS3 sold with BluRay on Nov 17th -- more to follow.

Now having said all that, if a High Def Picture is all you are interested in and you own a 360 right now then this HD-DVD drive is a very good Xmas present for you. However, I don't see this being used by Home Theater owners who have invested as much or more into their sound systems as their HDTV's (I have over $6000 in sound equipment and speakers alone and counting). There is no way to pass the HD sound codecs without HDMI 1.3 or analog out. Let me know if there is analog out on the MS HD-DVD drive. If it is not there, the drive will only be able to deliver the HD picture not the HD sound. If it is there then I will stop throwing up the warning light for individuals out there who think the MS HD-DVD drive will be a cheaper solution to Toshiba's HD-DVD drive. For picture only yes -- for the complete Home Theater experiance -- no.
 
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vurbano

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JoeSp said:
Vurbano, usually you are pretty right on but I think you have slipped a cog here. First, for the home theater owner there was no need to purchase a XBOX360 as it could not play HD-DVD movies.
Just stop right there. You have abandoned all logic you may have had in the second sentence of you post!!!!!!!!. The reason for the 360 was to play HD games. HDTV owners with HDTV's bought it to play HD games. Now those without an HD-A1 etc will buy the add on drive. Sony will be lucky if potential HD gamers havent already purchased a 360 this year.:rolleyes: The HD DVD add on drive sales Directly translates into HD DVD movie viewers and buyers. The PS3 sales DO NOT!!!!!!!
 
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JoeSp

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How about i interject "for the Home owner there was no need to purchase a XBOX360 for movie viewing as it could not play HD-DVD movies. This is what I meant -- sorry. I am talking about playing HD movies. And as a sidebar to that, the M$ HD-DVD drive would make an excellent introduction into HD movie viewing for those interested in the HD-DVD platform IF you already own the 360. In this respect I agree with you. However, if you think PS3 sales are not going to spike sales for BluRay products you are dead wrong. You must not have read any finacial speculation this past week on BluRay movie sales after November 17th. They all say that with all the new movies coming out and the sale of the PS3 and shortly thereafter of the release of other manufacturer's BluRay players that BluRay movie sales will tripple! Using your logic, why would someone buying the PS3 for the same reasons folks bought the XBOX360- to play HD games not buy the BluRay movies just like those 360 owners who purchase the M$ HD-DVD drive?
 
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JoeSp

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vurbano said:
http://www.cdfreaks.com/news/14109

Xbox360 HD DVD drive recognized as optical drive on PCs
Posted by Dan Bell on 13 October 2006 - 17:40 - Source: Gizmodo

This could be interesting, especially if you have a HTPC. It seems Gizmodo was in attendance at a Microsoft-Toshiba demo of the Xbox360 HD DVD player and Toshiba 2nd gen HD DVD players. The article said that at the demo, the reps there had some new HD DVD movie discs that blew away the ones sold at retail at the moment as far as quality goes. They said the films played over component connections were of a stunning quality. Interestingly, the output to the display from the external HD DVD drive was of course 1080i, but they said it was de-interlaced by the 50" Pioneer 1080p display and it looked great. But, read below for a tantalizing tidbit, that is even more fun to ponder about:
1049111413
Some things I found out, and can talk about is the 360 HD-DVD drive can be plugged into a PC and it will be recognized as an optical drive, but will not play HD-DVD movies. I asked what if you have the proper HD-DVD software on the PC, to that [redacted] said that he didn't know, it hadn't been tried yet- maybe there's something there...

Well, wouldn't it be interesting if these $199 dollar HD DVD external drives would work on a PC with a software addition? It might entice some home theater PC owners to make the leap to HD optical! Most already have a 720p or 1080i display and I bet there are some component connections available for such a device.


HEY, if this works with a PC then it will work with the PS3!!!!:haha
 

vurbano

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HEY, if this works with a PC then it will work with the PS3!!!!:haha
the software for that hasnt been developed yet. But if it does work on the PS3 it will only sell more HD DVD's and let consumers compare crap BD PQ to superior HD DVD PQ. :D
 

T2k

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HEY, if this works with a PC then it will work with the PS3!!!!:haha

Umm how so? On PC I can install devices, on PS3 you can't install anything, especially not hardware+drivers. PS3 is NOT a PC, just a locked-down OS running on a crippled PC-like hw, period.
 

JoeSp

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You are wrong oh evil one. The PS3 can use any USB drive, it can also use and bluetooth enabled PC products. This has not been readily bandied but that BlueTooth being used by the PS3 opens up alot of possiblities. And with Yellow Dog Linux for the PS3 being released at the same time I am sure there will be plenty of drivers to use PC bluetooth addons.

In case you are wondering it is the XBOX360 that has the closed OS system not the PS3. M$ has never made an open source OS in the entire history of their company. As a matter of fact, they might not be able to release Vista in Europe because of it being very closed in alot of its offerings. Right now if it is not M$ it is not necessarily working.

Another fact, on a recent report of Sony's online service with a popular magazine they were talking about using a bluetooth enabled PC keyboard with the PS3. If that is the case then the PS3 will have some nice expandability.
 

T2k

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You are wrong oh evil one. The PS3 can use any USB drive, it can also use and bluetooth enabled PC products. This has not been readily bandied but that BlueTooth being used by the PS3 opens up alot of possiblities. And with Yellow Dog Linux for the PS3 being released at the same time I am sure there will be plenty of drivers to use PC bluetooth addons.

Which has nothing to do with what I'm saying. Joe, for God's sake, at least try to follow my words and stop mumbling things you don't have the slightest clue about like Bluetooth or USB or even computers. :cool:

In case you are wondering it is the XBOX360 that has the closed OS system not the PS3. M$ has never made an open source OS in the entire history of their company.

Which, once again, has zero to do with the point...

As a matter of fact, they might not be able to release Vista in Europe because of it being very closed in alot of its offerings. Right now if it is not M$ it is not necessarily working.
[

ROFLMAO, yeah because Sony is an open source type guy, uhu? :D :D

EU story is about giving equal opportunity and stop MS monopoly-based abuse - Jesus, Joe, you are truly clueless. :D


Another fact, on a recent report of Sony's online service with a popular magazine they were talking about using a bluetooth enabled PC keyboard with the PS3. If that is the case then the PS3 will have some nice expandability.

Boohoo, BFD. Surprise: Xbox had keyboard from the beginning...
 
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JoeSp

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Oh, I see how you do this T2k. If anyone disagrees with you we can't read and we don't understand. And If you disagree with us, we don't know what we are talking about, we are passing BS.

Did you ever think that every time you state that the PS3 cannot do something you are wrong. Your statement about not being able to install on the PS3 shows your lack of understanding of Bluetooth technology and Linux!

Every time you open your mouth I wonder if you ever read about anything before you make a comment. So let me help you just a little here.

Bluetooth is a wireless technology that lets different products using Bluetooth connect and 'talk' with each other. Linux is an open sourced (unlike anything M$ has ever made) operating system that comes with hundreds of drivers (once again unlike anything M$ has ever made) to run differant things with.

To break that down just a little more for you Tk2, anything that can be connected to a PC using Bluetooth technology can be connect to the PS3 when using Yellow Dog Linux. Is that simple enough for you Tk2?

Does that mean the PS3 is a computer -- not neccesarily so -- does that make the PS3 an HTPC -- maybe -- does this make your statements lame -- not to you -- but it should.
 

T2k

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Oh, I see how you do this T2k. If anyone disagrees with you we can't read and we don't understand. And If you disagree with us, we don't know what we are talking about, we are passing BS.

Did you ever think that every time you state that the PS3 cannot do something you are wrong. Your statement about not being able to install on the PS3 shows your lack of understanding of Bluetooth technology and Linux!

Every time you open your mouth I wonder if you ever read about anything before you make a comment. So let me help you just a little here.

Bluetooth is a wireless technology that lets different products using Bluetooth connect and 'talk' with each other. Linux is an open sourced (unlike anything M$ has ever made) operating system that comes with hundreds of drivers (once again unlike anything M$ has ever made) to run differant things with.

To break that down just a little more for you Tk2, anything that can be connected to a PC using Bluetooth technology can be connect to the PS3 when using Yellow Dog Linux. Is that simple enough for you Tk2?

Does that mean the PS3 is a computer -- not neccesarily so -- does that make the PS3 an HTPC -- maybe -- does this make your statements lame -- not to you -- but it should.

Blatant, loud, self-confident - and totally and utterly clueless... perfect public embarrassment.

Priceless. :D

PS: I'm using linux since before Hurricane came out - go figure, Jeo*...:cool:
 
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NOHDjunkie

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Sounds like joe SP is correct.

http://ps3.ign.com/articles/739/739688p1.html

Terra Soft today announced that it will bring its Yellow Dog Linux v5.0 to Sony's forthcoming PlayStation 3. This news
makes Sony's announcement of Linux support via the console 100% official and means that users will essentially be able to turn their gaming system into a fully-functioning computer, replete with whatever applications they feel like installing, be it for entertainment or business. According to Terra Soft's website, Yellow Dog Linux v5.0 will be available in mid-November for the PlayStation 3, and then a version for Apple PowerPC systems will follow shortly thereafter.

Following the company's standard release system, v5.0 will be made available in a three-phase product rollout. At launch, users of the company's YDL.net service (which comes at a cost) will be able to download the OS to their computer and burn a bootable disc for installation on the PlayStation 3. Two weeks later, the company will offer ready-made installation discs for purchase through the site. Two weeks after that, it will be made freely available on public mirrors. In short, if you're willing to wait one month after the system's release, you'll be able to download Linux for it for free.

Yellow Dog Linux v5.0 will come with both a single-click installation mode for casual users and an advanced installer for power users. In other words, Terra Soft aims to allow even Linux novices an extremely easy entry point to the OS, while also allowing veterans the ability to customize the system to their liking.

The OS, which is based upon Fedora Core 5, will ship with the following components:
# kernel 2.6.16
# gcc 3.4.4 and glibc 2.4
# Cell SDK 1.1
# OpenOffice.org 2.0.2
# FireFox 1.5.0 and Thunderbird 1.5.0
# Nautilus 2.1.4
A number of "personal accessories; development tools; sound and video, Internet and networking applications" will also ship with the package, though the press release does not disclose any specifics.
 

T2k

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Sounds like joe SP is correct.

About what? Sounds like you don't have a clue either...

http://ps3.ign.com/articles/739/739688p1.html

Terra Soft today announced that it will bring its Yellow Dog Linux v5.0 to Sony's forthcoming PlayStation 3. This news
makes Sony's announcement of Linux support via the console 100% official and means that users will essentially be able to turn their gaming system into a fully-functioning computer, replete with whatever applications they feel like installing, be it for entertainment or business. According to Terra Soft's website, Yellow Dog Linux v5.0 will be available in mid-November for the PlayStation 3, and then a version for Apple PowerPC systems will follow shortly thereafter.

Following the company's standard release system, v5.0 will be made available in a three-phase product rollout. At launch, users of the company's YDL.net service (which comes at a cost) will be able to download the OS to their computer and burn a bootable disc for installation on the PlayStation 3. Two weeks later, the company will offer ready-made installation discs for purchase through the site. Two weeks after that, it will be made freely available on public mirrors. In short, if you're willing to wait one month after the system's release, you'll be able to download Linux for it for free.

Yellow Dog Linux v5.0 will come with both a single-click installation mode for casual users and an advanced installer for power users. In other words, Terra Soft aims to allow even Linux novices an extremely easy entry point to the OS, while also allowing veterans the ability to customize the system to their liking.

The OS, which is based upon Fedora Core 5, will ship with the following components:
# kernel 2.6.16
# gcc 3.4.4 and glibc 2.4
# Cell SDK 1.1
# OpenOffice.org 2.0.2
# FireFox 1.5.0 and Thunderbird 1.5.0
# Nautilus 2.1.4
A number of "personal accessories; development tools; sound and video, Internet and networking applications" will also ship with the package, though the press release does not disclose any specifics.

... so after you or Joe dreamed up how any distro suppose to decode AACS, (let alone writing drivers for a yet-to-be-released drive) wake me up, fellas.

Until thenI'll simply call Joe's comment on its name: BS.

PS: and before another clueless player posts it, yes: HD-DVD players run linux. However decoding is done on proprietary silicone, not software.
 
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NOHDjunkie

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From the article I posted it appears the PS3 is configureable.

Maybe the article is full of it. I don't know. I assumed as you did that there would be no portal to the OS. The article says it will.


Umm how so? On PC I can install devices, on PS3 you can't install anything, especially not hardware+drivers. PS3 is NOT a PC, just a locked-down OS running on a crippled PC-like hw, period.
 

BobMurdoch

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Joesp,
Your assuming all the game console people will use that for HD content. I don't think they will. With stand alone units the HD DVD is still a better value.

Since most of these units will in all liklihood be hooked up to analog TVs, I don't see a mass adoption of BluRay, followed by a flood of media sales. Not unless they start selling it for the same discounted price as DVD.

Talk to me in January and February when the real numbers start showing up. I think both HD DVD and BluRay will be niche items only until the quality of the media ratchets upwards, or teh price comes down. If neither occurs we've got another SACD/DVD Audio and standard DVD lives on for another 10 years uncontested (at least until digital downloads via IP hit our home theaters)
 

T2k

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From the article I posted it appears the PS3 is configureable.

It's not a question of that.

Maybe the article is full of it. I don't know. I assumed as you did that there would be no portal to the OS. The article says it will.

I did not assume anything and I don't know what "portal" stands for - please elaborate.
 

vurbano

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http://yahoo.businessweek.com/globalbiz/content/oct2006/gb20061026_545666.htm

Sony's Singed Reputation

Sony Energy may have fessed up in the battery caper, but it reflects the missteps that have dogged the company recently

by Cliff Edwards and Kenji Hall

For months, the news out of Sony (SNE) read like a classic whodunit: Dell Laptop Ignites. Apple (AAPL) notebook computers overheat and burn users. Airlines react with fear, banning certain laptops from flights. PC makers then begin falling like dominoes, issuing recalls of millions of batteries made by Sony.

Just how damaging is the great laptop battery caper? Plenty, it turns out. On Oct. 24, Sony executives issued a formal mea culpa. Facing reporters in Japan, with chagrined expressions top executives of subsidiary Sony Energy Devices said engineers first became aware of a problem with lithium ion notebook batteries supplied to Dell (DELL) about a year ago, suspecting tiny metallic contaminants had entered the line during production.

Executives contend they thought the issue was limited only to batteries manufactured for Dell and had been resolved soon after it was discovered. What's more, they said, they had confirmed only one overheating problem in 3.5 million batteries. "This is not about safety," Sony Senior Vice-President Naofumi Hara insists. "It's about responding to concerns. We made a managerial decision that a recall was needed." To fix the battery problem, Sony installed replacement caps on some equipment to prevent metal dust from getting into the batteries. And executives say they have toughened safety inspections.

The Proverbial Straw?

Rather than putting an end to the matter, though, Sony's explanations for the problem continue to raise troubling questions about the electronics manufacturer. More than a year after Howard Stringer became chief executive officer and was tasked with turning the company's flagging fortunes, the list of Sony corporate blunders is getting as long as the number of divisions he controls.

In the past year, Sony BMG Music Entertainment was forced to admit it embedded more than 2.1 million CDs with software that installed spyware on users' computers. Sony Computer Entertainment has had to backpedal several times on when it would release its new PlayStation 3 game console and how many units it would have available worldwide. The consumer-electronics division also admitted that manufacturers in the rival HD-DVD next-generation player market were right after all, and that production of Blu-ray drives was not going as smoothly as Sony had let on.

Even the company's new Sony Reader digital books device, touted by Stringer as one of the hot products to watch, came to market months late. And it has suffered from lukewarm reviews because of what many call onerous content restrictions.

Big Stakes

Brand-management experts say any one of those problems could happen to anyone. But with so many issues across different divisions of the same company, Sony now faces the potential of permanent damage to its reputation. "Sony seems to have missed the point again," says Rob Enderle, principal analyst of tech consultancy the Enderle Group. "This wasn't a little quality problem, it was something that caused fires. Had an airplane come down, or someone lost their life, right now we would be discussing the end of Sony."

To be sure, Dell, Apple, Lenovo (LNVGY), and Toshiba (TOSBF) share some of the blame. "Product safety isn't only the battery maker's responsibility," says Yoshiharu Izumi, senior tech analyst at JP Morgan Securities Asia (JPM). "My guess is Sony waited [to respond] because of the negotiations with PC makers over how to divide the responsibility, the cost."

Sony also likely faced internal concerns over another wave of embarrassing negative publicity. In an era where such news spreads quickly on the Web, "there's a danger in responding too quickly," says Shinichi Okamoto, former vice-president and chief technology officer for Sony's games division, who now heads a tech-consulting firm in Tokyo.

Costs and Consequences

Sony's fixes may not be enough to placate PC makers. Computer manufacturers say Sony gave them repeated reassurances that the problem was limited—and now they're furious. Toshiba has even said it is considering legal action to win compensation for lost business and damage done to its brand (see BusinessWeek.com, 10/16/06, "Are Sony's Battery Woes Bound for Court?").

Sony is already feeling the impact. The recall will cut its quarterly earnings by about $430 million when it reports results Oct. 26, the company announced earlier this month. Sony says it will ride out the negative publicity, but the losses are likely to be just the beginning. Batteries account for about 2% of company revenues, and PC makers are already turning to other suppliers such as Sanyo (SANYY) and Matsushita (MC).
 
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