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Last reply · posted in C-BAND Satellite Discussion
Been talking a little about this over at Satforums. What do you guys think? Would you want one? If someone could actually get it de-commercialized and to the consumer for home use. A Hdd-200/201/1000 will be required. I myself don't even know it will work. But..........................:)
Here's a letter i sent to Mike Kohl. Who i heard works for Skyvision. And, we all know Skyvision came up with the Dsr 410 out of the blue. So who knows?

Hello,
We got word that Motorola is building a transcoder to allow cable head-ends still using Mpeg2 set-top boxes to utilize the new S2 DC2 feeds by transcoding the mpeg4 feeds into mpeg 2 . I'm thinking this transcoder could be slaved and intergrated into a 4dtv system seamlessly and with very little headaches. In fact it would operate no different than a current 4DTV system and HDD-200 decoder. Only, the transcoder feeds the data into Hdd-200/201/1000 instead of the 4DTV. Mapping of the channels will still be handled by the 4DTV. So when you land on the S2 channel shown in the 4DTV guide. The transcoder starts feeding the S2 data into the Hdd-200 and then the Hdd-200 displays the picture on the users TV. The AC3 audio can also be outputted by the HDD-200 to the users Home theater system. See this link for more information. http://irdrollout.com/StarzHD/includes/install_guide.pdf A de-commercialized transcoder will be ideal and most likely less expensive as the end users will not need 8 lnb inputs, aux relays for alarms and what not. Most likely it won't even need a front panel or even a on-screen display.

I realize subsciption cband is fading fast due to lost channels and very limited HD. But, the FTA hobby is growing as more and more people turn to Cband for High Quality HD feeds. I think those same people would pay for it too. If there was a means to access the current S2 DC2 lineup. Rather than just settling on Dishnet or DirecTV for their main TV fare. Maybe Skyvision could look into this?


Thank You


If anybody wants to throw around this idea to the programmers like STARZ, HBO, ect.......Feel free to email away.
I think we need the programmers behind this too. They might even collect a higher sub fee from us cband users. Because, i doubt Charlie and DirecTV pays them much per subscriber.:)
47 Replies · 6993 views
T
The problem with ALL the pizza and cable providers is that everyday they are thinking of ways to cram more so called HD content for there subscribers. As time goes on they will get down to 3 mb per channel and thats just enough to support SD. I don't care what new wizbang codec they are using it will look like crap. I've seen Direct tv and Dishes HD and Im not impressed. I was at the goodie store the other day watching Blu ray on an LED Tv and wasn't all that much impressed. Lets face it all this HD stuff is hype in one way or another to sell tv's and piss poor quality content to the sucker.

Maybe Im looking for too much out of HD. It could be because Im conditioned to the best quality pictures for so many years on the bud. To me an old analog master was better than most of the HD there trying to sell today. What is the sense of making these displays with a ton of resolution (1080P) and feeding it 200 lines or less of compressed crap. May as well dig out an old 1950 Dumont B&W tv and watch that. That's where were headed.
truckracer
If you ever heard a vinyl record on a top notch turntable (assuming you hearing is sharp and un damaged), through a high end harmon kardon amplifier or something high end, it makes mp3's sound like crap where mp3's are a lossy codec ripped at 128 kbs.

Society is slowly getting used to this fuzzy digital compression. Same for tv watching.
P
If you ever heard a vinyl record on a top notch turntable (assuming you hearing is sharp and un damaged), through a high end harmon kardon amplifier or something high end, it makes mp3's sound like crap where mp3's are a lossy codec ripped at 128 kbs.

Society is slowly getting used to this fuzzy digital compression. Same for tv watching.

One of my other early ambitions was to run a sound company that did very high-end recording and live concert broadcasts in the late 1970s through the mid 1980s. I still have one of those high-end vinyl setups from back then and have been showing friends for the past couple of decades that digital audio (not just MP3s), at least initially, was a step backwards. MP3-style compression makes this into a horror movie.

What was even more impressive were the 30 ips, 1/2" two channel analog tape recorders made at that time. I have a roomful of 30-year-old master tapes that would give many modern digital audio setups a run for their money. Up until the advent of well designed 24 bit ADCs, I used to enjoy shootouts with the latest studio ADC/DACs. Playing back from a 30 ips analog master, the idea was to compare a ADC/DAC to the original, and in some cases a second generation analog recording. It wasn't until about 2000 that the digital chain was competitive.

It's been very sad to see the availability of high quality source material in both the sound studio and broadcast worlds in parallel to what the public is offered. There is high-end audio and video available, but it is being marginalized and may well die. Lowest common denominator strikes again.
T
I have compared mint records on my turntable using a Stanton Epoch 1989 vintage cartridge, and a Carver Magnetic Field Power Amplifier 1988 vintage to the same CD's. The record had warmth and overtones that lacked in the cd. Analog will always be the best in my book. What people forget is we see analog and hear analog. Once you turn it into ones and zero's and use switching transistors to re create it it never is the same. Digital can be pretty good to a point unbutchered, but the consumer never see or hears that much anymore.
emuman100
May as well dig out an old 1950 Dumont B&W tv and watch that. That's where were headed.

As a person who appreciates the beauty of old TV technology, I'd glady bring out the old Dumont. :)

Those new transcoders from Motorola are the DSR-6050 and the DSR-6030. They are basically Motorola IRDs with DVB-S2 demodulators, mpeg4 decoders and mpeg2 encoders. They can receive DCII encapsulated in DVB-S2, and transcode mpeg4 into mpeg2. The transcoding bitrate and such is controlled completely by the uplink, so the cable operator has no control over the output bitrate. HBO and Starz now uplinks all HD services in mpeg4 DCII encapsulated in DVB-S2, offering 8 or so channels per transponder. The transcoders are the DSR-6050 which can transcode only one service (channel), and the DSR-6030 can transcode up to 3 services. The point of these units are for support for existing STBs or headend equipment that can't decode mpeg4. Since these are commercial, they only are made for one multiplex, and not for the home. NPS can use these units and reuplink as mpeg2, if they wanted to, but of course they won't. Both these transcoders also have gigE output for transport stream output over IP, unicast or multicast, and can output both original mpeg4 and transcoded mpeg2 over IP as well as DVB-ASI.

Motorola also has a multi-decrypt receiver (not transcoder) that can decrypt up to 24 services in a transport stream and output the whole transport stream unencrypted. The older model, the DSR-4400MD, only demodulates DCII QPSK and OQPSK. The newer model, the DSR-4410MD can demodulate DVB-S2 encapsulated DCII transport streams, and also output via gigE IP as well as DVB-ASI, the older DSR-4400MD only supported DVB-ASI. The DSR-4410MD can be used with HBO and Starz too. It'll output a completely decrypted transport stream of mpeg4 services.

I play with commercial satellite receivers as a hobby, mainly from Motorola. I enjoy when broadcasters change to fixed key so my IRDs can decryrpt those services, and I can output them via gigE IP multicast, as the two Motorola IRDs I use are DSR-4530s. I plug them into my Cisco 2960 switch with "ip igmp snooping querier" and can watch the transport streams with VLC and poke around with them with TSreader on my laptop.

I invested a lot of money in this stuff (almost all used ebay deals), but I just think it's so neat. I can talk about commercial IRDs with IP output all day! :)
C
Fixed key boadcasters?

I play with commercial satellite receivers as a hobby, mainly from Motorola. I enjoy when broadcasters change to fixed key so my IRDs can decryrpt those services, and I can output them via gigE IP multicast, as the two Motorola IRDs I use are DSR-4530s.

We too have a DSR-4530 that can output via GigE IP multicast and be recorded using TSreader. We also have a DSR-4410 that can daisy-chain through the ASI input of the 4530 to its GigE output.

Can you mention which programs you have found that use a fixed key?
Scott Greczkowski
Staff member HERE TO HELP YOU! Cutting Edge
Last reply · posted in The Chit Chat Club
Sometimes a thread gets so many posts in it that is can cause issues for the server so that why today we introduce The Song Name Game Part 3!

So let the game continue!

The last song was added by Bobby who posted...

One Meat Ball - Andrews Sisters

CONTINUE ON AND HAVE FUN! WELCOME HOME TO SATELLITEGUYS.US!

Here are the original rules for the game as posted by WebbyDude back in 2006. http://www.satelliteguys.us/threads/68645-Song-Name-Game

Just name a song title and the band who performed it. The next person does the same thing, but needs to list a song title or band name which includes a word from the previous entry. Pick songs from any genre.

Example:

Long Live Rock and Roll -- Rainbow

Rainbow in the Dark -- Dio

Another example:

Ride the Lightning -- Metallica

Lightning Strikes -- Ozzy Osbourne


Get it?


An additional note: we all know that song titles, sometimes, use profane words. Because this is a family friendly website it is advised that you clean up that title up a bit. This is accomplished by using something like sh!t instead of the real word. Thanks....
68506 Replies · 2671308 views
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gms49ers
High Water - Rush
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long_time_Dish
Smoke On The Water - Deep Purple
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EatMyVolts
Smoke! Smoke! Smoke! (That Cigarette) -- Tex Williams
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long_time_Dish
Don't Do Me Like That - Tom Petty & The Heartbreakers
H
I LIKE It LIKE THAT-The Dave Clark Five
Anony55
Last reply · posted in DISH Network Support Forum
For quite a while now, people with a VIP211k have been losing their recordings on their activated external HDDs... even when there's nothing physically wrong with HDD. I believe this is an intentional and underhanded tactic that Dish is pulling in an attempt to force users away from the VIP211k.

They are obviously regretting that they ever let users have a "non-dvr" dvr in the first place. You would think they would be happy charging you a $40 one time fee... and then be happy letting the customer be the one responsible for HDD failures.

Dish clearly hates the 211k bitter-clingers. This recording deletion problem is intentional (IMO), and I think it is just one more tool that they are using. Hopper and a 2-year agreement... that's what they want you to have. Think about that... a 2-year agreement... with a company $30 Billion in debt (that's with a B). What happens when all that debt causes them to drop the channel that may have been your whole reason for having Dish in the first place? Guess who's stuck with a service that no longer suits their needs... for the remainder of the 2-year agreement.

On top of that, they don't want you to install it yourself. I purchased and installed all my equipment myself. That used to be common. Now, they lie to me and tell me that my dish must be updated to use a Hopper. Funny thing is... they don't even know what dish I have because they didn't install it, and I didn't tell them. If you ask what type of dish/LNBs the hopper needs... good luck getting an answer. All they know is that whatever you have needs to be upgraded by an installer.

It is quite apparent to me that they care much more about staying in their box, than they do working with the customer. That's too bad, because it hasn't always been that way. It's like they are totally unaware of the current business environment that they are trying to compete in.

I have been a customer since 2010. I will be cancelling my service before the next period. Yeah, I know, my $1,200 a year won't make a difference to them. It just seems like they have forgotten who needs who, especially when you consider the competition in today's streaming world. But hey, they will have succeed in forcing me off the 211k.
168 Replies · 7496 views
Nebugeater
Got a 211k that works fine, and I no longer need it if someone wants to throw me a few bucks and pay shipping. Not tied to my account as of last week. Used with a tailgater and got a wally
T
Got a 211k that works fine, and I no longer need it if someone wants to throw me a few bucks and pay shipping. Not tied to my account as of last week. Used with a tailgater and got a wally
Is the 211k still available? If so, I'm interested.
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Nebugeater
Is the 211k still available? If so, I'm interested.


Actually, it is. A couple of people PMed me when I posted this, and when I asked for an address, they never responded. Then I just sort of let it go. Send me a PM to continue the discussion
Anony55
Well, after nine months of being on pause, I finally figured out that I was wasting $5 a month. So I cancelled. For the first time since 2010, I no longer have a Dish account.

I do have to say that I did appreciate the account pause option. That just gives a person some time to see what the fallout of cancelling will be... without having to go all the way over the cliff first.

Since I never once had an "oh shoot, I need Dish Network for..." moment, the decision was a lot easier.

Funny enough, when I called to cancel (for real, not playing the pricing game), all of a sudden, they were offering me deals that I was told before that I couldn't get without changing out my VIP211k. Now, I could have had those specials with them just sending me a new card for the receiver. LOL!

Of course, my mind was already made up because of having not missed the service while on pause. That, and the fact that I bet the 211k still kills recordings.

All in all, I'm glad that I had Dish for all those years. I just outgrew the need, and they pressed the issue by deleting recordings. I would have eventually went this route without the deleted recordings issue. But, for sure, that did hasten the outcome.

I'll still pop in at this site from time to time. Believe it or not, I still have a C/Ku BUD that I intend on playing with again if life ever slows down.
dishstaller
Actually, it is. A couple of people PMed me when I posted this, and when I asked for an address, they never responded. Then I just sort of let it go. Send me a PM to continue the discussion
Unless things have changed at Dish, which is entirely possible, they won't activate the 211, even as a replacement. I gave one to a customer a while back....which when I turned it off I made sure to tell the CSR I wanted it freed up so another customer could use it, I was assured it was.....and when they called to swap out there's they were told it couldn't be done. Now like I said, things MIGHT HAVE CHANGED.
Anony55
Unless things have changed at Dish, which is entirely possible, they won't activate the 211, even as a replacement. I gave one to a customer a while back....which when I turned it off I made sure to tell the CSR I wanted it freed up so another customer could use it, I was assured it was.....and when they called to swap out there's they were told it couldn't be done. Now like I said, things MIGHT HAVE CHANGED.
It hasn't changed. When I cancelled my service the other day, they told me I didn't need to return the receiver (which I already knew because I purchased it).

But in addition to that, the young man told me not to sell it, but to take it to a recycling place. The reason he gave for the advice was because 211Ks can no longer be activated.

So as far as the VIP211k goes... once grandpa dies, he's dead.
T
They tell you to trash it and not to sell simply because they're phasing them out, not particularly because someone might be "confused" into buying it and not be able to activate. They tell people that in every case where they're not acting to get a box back, either from a replacement or service cancel.
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Corrado
Although my VIP211K hasn't been subscribed or connected to a dish in probably 5 years since canceling service, my 1 TB HDD full of programming still works fine.

Upon occasion I power it up to watch something I recorded as far back as 2010. The last time I had it going in September it even let me rescan the local OTA channels which I think it refused at some earlier time. I will use it until the day it fails but this topic makes me think some software download is responsible for current subscribers.
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zippyfrog
Pub Member / Supporter Lifetime Supporter
Last reply · posted in DISH Network Support Forum
Has anyone subscribed to NBA League Pass for 2026-27 and try to link their account to NBA.com to stream League Pass? I purchased it for 2026-27, and when I linked, I got a message saying success, but then I receive an error that my linked subscription does not include the preseason games for NBA League Pass. Is that how it has always been? I know satellite doesn't have the preseason games on the NBA League Pass channels, but I thought that I was able to stream the preseason once I linked my account on NBA.com?
2 Replies · 87 views
zippyfrog
I found my answer...when I log into the NBA app on my phone and try to watch, it gives me a more clear answer that it acknowledges I have paid for NBA League Pass from Dish and it is linked, but I need an "upgraded" subscription to League Pass for the preseason games. So I guess it is by design that Dish does not show the preseason games on League pass and that the contract Dish has signed for league pass is explicitly for the regular season games. (I know the description for League Pass says regular season games, but I thought that was only by satellite and the preseason would have worked)
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Darrell S
I plan on doing what I did last season. I ordered the more expensive arena feed version from the NBA website. It's worth it because you get to watch what's going on in the arena instead of just staring at the ad break slide on the Dish version. The main advantage to ordering from the website is you can go on a month by month basis and cancel if you get tired of it.
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Ramy
Supporting Founder
Last reply · posted in The Sports Section
Really excited for this season with Kentucky having a new coach and some really exciting recruits. Probably won't last long, but here's hoping this season is great.
143 Replies · 1468 views
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Y
24 team playoff seems to be real close.

Are we really that far from a 64-team tournament?

The benefit of the 24 team playoff:
  • All the cartel teams that cartels want in playoff are in playoff
    • Independent of record too! Bonus.
  • MONEY!!!!! for the cartels.
  • I'm out of ideas.
Cons
  • Regular season really doesn't matter now other than the rivalry games
    • Top cartel teams can lose three games and still make the playoff
  • Going to start resting players?
    • The playoff is going to be *checks notes* several games!
    • Resting players could make games dumb.
    • Maybe even restrict NIL players from games played.
  • How much are streaming sub costs going up a month to pay for this?!
AZ.
AZ.
24 team playoff seems to be real close.

Are we really that far from a 64-team tournament?

The benefit of the 24 team playoff:
  • All the cartel teams that cartels want in playoff are in playoff
    • Independent of record too! Bonus.
  • MONEY!!!!! for the cartels.
  • I'm out of ideas.
Cons
  • Regular season really doesn't matter now other than the rivalry games
    • Top cartel teams can lose three games and still make the playoff
  • Going to start resting players?
    • The playoff is going to be *checks notes* several games!
    • Resting players could make games dumb.
    • Maybe even restrict NIL players from games played.
  • How much are streaming sub costs going up a month to pay for this?!
One of the pro's I see is in a year with so many undefeated teams they have a good chance of an opening. Few years back you had lower divisions that didnt get a shot. I love collage football and I have no problem with that addition.

We are in what week 5 now? Been two real good ranked games to watch.....Other than that top 25 teams are playing nothing.
Jimbo
One of the pro's I see is in a year with so many undefeated teams they have a good chance of an opening. Few years back you had lower divisions that didnt get a shot. I love collage football and I have no problem with that addition.

We are in what week 5 now? Been two real good ranked games to watch.....Other than that top 25 teams are playing nothing.
There are 68 Power 4 teams, so eventually they will get there I wouldn't imagine ...
AZ.
AZ.
There are 68 Power 4 teams, so eventually they will get there I wouldn't imagine ...
Far from it but you know that....You dont like the larger playoff.....Its ok.....
Jimbo
Far from it but you know that....You dont like the larger playoff.....Its ok.....
Oh, I Hate the idea ...

It would be different if it was a game that you could play 2 or games each week, but when you only play 1 game a week, the larger playoff is Not a good thing ...

The season has how many games now, is it 14 ... then you want to play another 5 (with more to come) against Top 12 (eventually 24 teams) ... remember, the 5 games in the playoffs will be the hardest games all year and back to back.

For example, IF Ohio State should win it all this year ... they play 5 teams in the Top 25, plus they would play 5 more to win it all, depending on how the ranking shake out and if Bye weeks are given.

Thats 10 Ranked teams ... in one year ...
I don't see that happening very often ...
Edit, Bama plays 4, Georgia plays 3, But Ole Miss plays 5 (didn't expect to see that)

That said, I don't see the Buckeyes winning it all this year.
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AZ.
AZ.
Oh, I Hate the idea ...

It would be different if it was a game that you could play 2 or games each week, but when you only play 1 game a week, the larger playoff is Not a good thing ...

The season has how many games now, is it 14 ... then you want to play another 5 (with more to come) against Top 12 (eventually 24 teams) ... remember, the 5 games in the playoffs will be the hardest games all year and back to back.

For example, IF Ohio State should win it all this year ... they play 5 teams in the Top 25, plus they would play 5 more to win it all, depending on how the ranking shake out and if Bye weeks are given.

Thats 10 Ranked teams ... in one year ...
I don't see that happening very often ...

That said, I don't see the Buckeyes winning it all this year.
Yes anyone here knows you 100%....Astros failed no posting...Ohio state loses we hear it.....Its ok....Its called an opinion....I have one so do you.....Problem is?
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Jimbo
Yes anyone here knows you 100%....Astros failed no posting...Ohio state loses we hear it.....Its ok....Its called an opinion....I have one so do you.....Problem is?
Seeing theres very little activity in the MLB threads, it wouldn't matter if I posted that the Astros didn't make the Playoffs ...

Theres more NFL info in the Pub section than in the Sports/NFL thread.
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Jimbo
IF they go to 24 teams, and it looks like they will soon ....
Do we Really want Teams with 3 and 4 losses in the Playoffs ?
Is a 3-4 Loss team one thats able to win 4-5 more games against Top teams ?
Y
One of the pro's I see is in a year with so many undefeated teams they have a good chance of an opening. Few years back you had lower divisions that didnt get a shot. I love collage football and I have no problem with that addition.
A 12 team playoff net should catch any undefeated team. The 12 team playoff also exposed that rankings suck. I mean, we kind of knew already that the rankings weren't particularly reproducible, but we now have the empirical evidence that the rankings suck because judging who is the best among a mickey mouse scheduled football season isn't a rational endeavor. So the 12 team playoff ensures most teams that should make it, do, including the mid-major undefeated team. 8 teams should be able to work as well, but puts greater risk at OSU and Alabama missing the playoff... can't have that.

Which is the run up to my main problem with the 24 team set up is that it is designed to keep the OSU's and Alabama's from missing the playoff. The cartels are ensuring widespread participation for their own cartels to increase the monetary reward to themselves. It is fixing the system while not fixing the outcomes, merely making the regular season game outcomes virtually irrelevant. Sure, a bye for winning the conference would be nice, but we've already seen that byes aren't that influential.
We are in what week 5 now? Been two real good ranked games to watch.....Other than that top 25 teams are playing nothing.
That is college football in a nutshell. Again, college football isn't about competition, it is about revenue. The entire setup is about making money, from regular season squash games against local jobbers like the WWF days to tax exempt bowl games.

And to add to the first world woes, the college football cartels have made being a College Football fan even more expensive... so they can get paid more.
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meStevo
Theres more NFL info in the Pub section than in the Sports/NFL thread.

Nah, you just don't understand how ignore works, which is why you made your own NFL thread thinking there wasn't one 🤣
Former member 209992
Last reply · posted in SatelliteGuys Support Center
For some reason, the satelliteguys.us site is loading a lot slower than usual on both Chrome on my Asus laptop and Safari on my iPhone.
I'm also seeing longer appearances of the blue bar at the top and the "3 blue bars" loading symbol.
Is anyone else also having the same problem? Thanks in advance.
530 Replies · 18125 views
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Scott Greczkowski
Remember folks... just like DNS... its always Foxbat. :D
Foxbat
Remember folks... just like DNS... its always Foxbat. :D
WTF… …What the Foxbat!😱
S
WTF… …What the Foxbat!😱
wow what a kick in the balls!!! the wife blames you when things don't work now scott's blaming you :biggrin
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Foxbat
wow what a kick in the balls!!! the wife blames you when things don't work now scott's blaming you :biggrin
I know. Here's what Scott has in store for me if I get out of line:
IMG_1990.webp
IMG_1989.webp
S
I know. Here's what Scott has in store for me if I get out of line:
OMG to freaking funny :biggrin
comfortably_numb
I know. Here's what Scott has in store for me if I get out of line:

Not likely since that place closed down.
Foxbat
Not likely since that place closed down.
You're no fun.😑
T
Last reply · posted in DISH Network Support Forum
I thought I would come here and find lots of complaints about the update to the dish anywhere mobile app, but am not seeing any. It used to look just like the desktop webpage. Now you can no longer filter by sports channels or movie channels. Plus that they made it look like a big button telephone and you see fewer channels in the screen which requires more scrolling. Yes I realize you can look at sports then select which sport you want to look at, I just liked being able to see all sporting events in the guide with all other channels being filtered out. Am I alone in the wilderness on this?
7 Replies · 158 views
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dishstaller
I really dislike change for the sake of change
dishdude
I like the new look, it's a lot cleaner. I'm using it on one of those Onn streaming devices when I travel.
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T
I like the new look, it's a lot cleaner. I'm using it on one of those Onn streaming devices when I travel.
Yes a lot cleaner, glossier, and less functional. Someone trying to justify why they are making a big salary. "See look shiny"
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navychop
"Big salary." Charlie. "?Big?"
Tampa8
Seems in some ways better. Nicer layout, as others said maybe cleaner. Moving ahead in the guide is better.
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Foxbat
Supporting Founder Pub Member / Supporter Lifetime Supporter
Last reply · posted in Internet Television (IPTV) Discussion Forum
Apple has finally released their Apple TV 4K with built-in Siri and a microphone so it can respond to your queries even if you don't have the remote. It also increases in price, to $299. I had been planning on updating my current Apple TV 4K streamers, but that's $600 for the two of them, and that's a pass at this point.

At $299, it had better come with 256 GB of Storage, Gigabit (or better) Ethernet, the latest HDMI tech and standards, and one year of free Apple One. But it probably won't…
20 Replies · 333 views
Ronnie-
Meh. The 4Ks I have will do everything that these do that I need them to do.


Which that's most tech these days for anything released the last four to five years.


It's honestly a testament to how good the previous gen Apple TVs were and are.
navychop
It's honestly a testament to how good the previous gen Apple TVs were and are.

Don't tell them that. They'll adopt planned obsolescence.
navychop
Outside of gaming, would Joe Sixpack notice any difference?
KAB
KAB
Outside of gaming, would Joe Sixpack notice any difference?
Not a bit. IMO, Apple's are slow to boot up. Time is about the same with 1st gen and 3rd. Roku runs rings around them in that department. I only reason I stuck, is the Apple infrastructure, which has it's definite advantages. But $300 is a deal breaker. Later, Apple!
S
Don't tell them that. They'll adopt planned obsolescence.
they all do that anyways.. ever notice your cell phone slows down when you come up for an upgrade.. :what. apple's been making money off of software and not hardware for a while
ncted
Not a bit. IMO, Apple's are slow to boot up. Time is about the same with 1st gen and 3rd. Roku runs rings around them in that department. I only reason I stuck, is the Apple infrastructure, which has it's definite advantages. But $300 is a deal breaker. Later, Apple!
Yeah, they boot up a bit slower than Roku, but the OS does a lot more, so it makes sense. How often are you booting them up that is a differentiator? Aside from OS updates, mine are on all the time. I will say the ATV4K is generally quicker than the Roku Ultras I have, when it comes to launching apps and responsiveness, not that the Roku is sluggish.
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navychop
apple's been making money off of software and not hardware for a while

What software? For iPhones? I tried to buy some image s/w IN THE APPLE STORE! They had none, and could not offer ANY s/w for iPhones
ncted
apple's been making money off of software and not hardware for a while
I assume you mean services, like iCloud and Apple Music, and not actual software sales. Services have been growing quickly for Apple, but hardware still brings home the bacon. As for where Apple's revenue comes from, the iPhone is still king with 49.58% of revenue as of June 2026. Services comes in second with 28%. iPad, Mac, and Wearables/Home makes up the rest. So, that is 72% coming from hardware. Their profit margin is around 25%, FWIW.

I am skeptical the AppleTV 4k makes them much money on the hardware though, which I suspect is what you were getting at.
ncted
What software? For iPhones? I tried to buy some image s/w IN THE APPLE STORE! They had none, and could not offer ANY s/w for iPhones
You should have looked in the APP STORE instead. ;)
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navychop
Will do!