1.8 Dual-axis Prodelin Conversion to HH Motor

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pendragon

SatelliteGuys Pro
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Oct 13, 2008
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A few folks have requested the details of my conversion of a dual-axis mounted 1.8m Prodelin offset reflector into a horizon-to-horizon mount. This was a bit of a rush job as I was concerned the city was about about to pass an ordinance to restrict satellite dishes. They eventually did, but not before I completed my 15 dish farm :)

The reflector I rescued was originally a Ku-band transmit/receive dish with a massive electronics box that contained all the feed plumbing, the upconverter and downconverter and a skew adjustment motor. This part alone weighed around 30 pounds and was mounted on a tray attached to a very heavy duty feed arm. There was no need for side supports on this monster, because it is such overkill I could likely stand on the feed without affecting the alignment. The feed itself is a work of art and I was determined to salvage this part. Sadly this meant cutting the electronics package into pieces, because I needed some of the plumbing and shims to adapt my LNBs (see later). The resulting dish is shown in the first picture.

The next picture shows the rear side of the reflector. I found an old Ajax motor at a satellite junk yard and the guy was happy to completely empty my wallet for it - all $18 that was there. This was completely rusted and in terrible shape. Still I figured if I was able to get everything up, working or not, I would be grandfathered from the new ordinance. I could always change or fix the motor later. However before I installed the dish, I decided to assess the motor innards. I had to tear everything down to the smallest piece and the actual motor too. That part was encased in rust and had to be soaked in penetrating oil for about a day to get it apart. The gears and axles were almost as bad. Still I was able to recover all the original pieces except for the terminal block for the wires. No big deal.

Miraculously after spending another couple of days off and on, it all went back together and worked perfectly. Ajax motors usually came mounted to a ring adapter for the particular target dish. This was of no use and I simply cut it off, leaving only a steel plate at the top of the motor. The third image is a diagram that resembles the original dual-axis mount. Two actuators are used for azimuth and elevation, with the electronics block having its own motor for skew adjustment. I had thought about keeping these features, but I was dubious that the azimuth actuator would really provide a sufficient range of adjustment (I can see 30W to 180W). The dual-axis' fate was sealed by a pragmatic matter - I already had a 3.5" OD pole mounted to a wall exactly where I wanted the dish, and the dual-axis pole mount needed something much bigger. The city was busy and so was I.

Looking at the diagram again, there is a horizontal bar bolted to the top of the pole mount. I set aside the pole mount for the museum (picture 4) and cut off the rear portion of the horizontal bar (picture 5). I had to enlarge the mounting hole at the bottom of the Ajax polar axis to take a 1" grade 8 bolt that was used as the azimuth axis in the original mount (picture 6). I then cut some angle irons and welded them together to fashion the top polar axis mount, and serve as a declination adjustment (picture 7). We get tons of wind as the house is essentially at the top of a hill, with an unobstructed panorama of the Colorado front range. That inclined me to spend some decent dosh on a lot of grade 8 hardware, including 7/8" threaded rods for the declination adjustment. To date everything is absolutely solid and when the winds blow and shake all my other Ku dishes, the Prodelin stays locked on target without visible motion.

Pictures 8, 9 and 10 show the feeds and LNBs. I wanted to mount an Invacom universal LNB to the original feed. This required some simple adapter machining to couple the feed to the C120 flange on the Invacom. By doing this I was able to salvage a nifty skew scale marked to units of one degree to handle 103W if I ever needed it. But I got tired of climbing on the roof for that bird, so I sidecared a cheapo Ku LNB so I could skew it permanently by 26 degrees. This actually performs quite well, but comparing the front view of the scalars makes this normal FTA-sized LNB look like a toy. The CNRs I get are outrageous.

This has become one of my most treasured dishes, and I am so grateful to my neighbors who complained to the city about the mad scientist next door who was disgracing their cherished world. Without their impetus I probably would have never bothered to contemplate this project.
 

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I don't know where you are located geographically but your Ku signal quality must be amazing.
 
nice job

... a very heavy duty feed arm.
There was no need for side supports on this monster, because it is such overkill ...
I've seen both the tank-like version, and the light-weight version.
My guess is that yours is the older model (and if anything, more desirable).
The feed itself is a work of art and I was determined to salvage this part.
Sadly this meant cutting the electronics package into pieces, because I needed some of the plumbing and shims to adapt my LNBs...
Recycling the original feed is probably overkill for Ku reception, but no one can deny it's the way to go, if possible! - :up
..The CNRs I get are outrageous.

I found an old Ajax motor at a satellite junk yard and the guy was happy to completely empty my wallet for it - all $18 that was there.
note: good bargaining tactic - just a few small bills in the wallet which you show the seller.
Any more, you keep in another pocket, or the car! - :D
This was completely rusted and in terrible shape.
... and had to be soaked in penetrating oil for about a day to get it apart.
... it all went back together and worked perfectly.
Amazing! :eek: Any more words of wisdom or pix of the pieces?
Ajax motors usually came mounted to a ring adapter for the particular target dish.
Yea, you might want to explain how your adapter compensates for the offset up-look of the dish, by tilting it downward.
To date everything is absolutely solid and when the winds blow and shake all my other Ku dishes, the Prodelin stays locked on target without visible motion.
Good thing! I wonder what the beam-width is on Ku with that beauty!? - :cool:
Can't be much.
Pictures 8, 9 and 10 show the feeds and LNBs. I wanted to mount an Invacom universal LNB to the original feed. This required some simple adapter machining to couple the feed to the C120 flange on the Invacom. By doing this I was able to salvage a nifty skew scale marked to units of one degree to handle 103W if I ever needed it.
Maybe more info on how you went about that?
Or would it be obvious if we had one in our hands? ;)

Well, regardless, it's a dish to be proud of! - :up
Congratulations.
 
What awesome work! Very nice dish too, i'm sure it pulls in everything. Good job beating the "restrictors" too, haha.
 
Recycling the original feed is probably overkill for Ku reception, but no one can deny it's the way to go, if possible! - :up

Prodelin still delivers feeds much like this one for Ku reception on their current 1.8m models. Unlike most C and Ku FTA feeds, this one appears to take advantage of optimizing a feed to a particular dish design. In a quick comparison to a smaller but well performing feed, this one provided better CNRs. I didn't write anything down because I was simply choosing which options worked the best.

Amazing! :eek: Any more words of wisdom or pix of the pieces?

Sorry, I have to borrow my wife's camera to take pictures and she's always out when I need it. I was pretty disappointed when I first started working with this Ajax motor because it was in much worse shape than I thought. There were several to choose from at the junkyard, and this one appeared to be in the best condition. But everything was rusted together and nothing would move.

Most of the progress was made with a combination of patience (in soaking the parts) and brute force (after the soaking had done what it could). I have a nice assortment of 2-3' pipe and Crescent wrenches, but it also took a sledgehammer to liberate the polar axis from its casing and sleeve. Thank goodness Ajax motors were build for nuclear warfare, as none of this abuse caused any detectable damage.

The motor was probably the scariest mess. Getting the long bolts out that held it together was fairly straightforward, but inside it looked like a solid cylinder of rust. But I kept chipping away at the parts I could reach and eventually was able to tap out the armature. That was just the start of the real work ahead, but at least I could see and reach everything. In the end the insides looked nearly pristine.

I was reluctant to disassemble the gearbox that mounts the worm gear and half-moon gear through which passes the polar axis. But I couldn't get any rotation leaving it in place as the worm gear axle was badly corroded. The assembly was aligned by shims at the factory, and as expected they largely turned to powder as I took things apart. I think I did a decent job of re-shimming this after getting the parts working again. However the half-moon gear is not perfectly in round and I had to compromise a bit between a minimum of backlash and the gears being a bit tight on the western side of my arc. It's possible I missed something here.

Yea, you might want to explain how your adapter compensates for the offset up-look of the dish, by tilting it downward.

The HH motor's elevation adjustment is done the same way as it would for a prime-focus reflector, because its rotation axis has to be parallel to the earth's. A DiSEqC motor for an offset dish does the same thing, but its shaft is bent at the end to lower the offset dish's elevation to a practical point. I accomplished the same thing by having a very long declination adjustment coupled to the angle irons. I wanted to keep the threaded rod lengths reasonable because they experience a lot of stress when the dish is lowered to point near the horizon.

Good thing! I wonder what the beam-width is on Ku with that beauty!? - :cool:

I recall the beamwidth is about 0.9 degrees at Ku frequencies. That's a very handy number, although it does put a premium on alignment.

Maybe more info on how you went about that?
Or would it be obvious if we had one in our hands? ;)

This wasn't entirely obvious when I started. The feed mount is not a C120, which is what the Invacom wants. I looked it up at the time, and found some adapter plates that would interface the two together. However this would have to be special ordered from Europe and might have cost more than the entire rest of the project.

I didn't like that anyway because I wanted to be able to easily adjust the skew by hand and the existing feed could essentially do that with its electronics package. In the end I cut out the front end of that box and redrilled the adaptor plate that was originally inside. That meant all the mechanics pretty much stayed the same, although piecing everything together is only a little simpler than solving a Rubik's Cube. There is enough friction in the skew adjustment that the LNB and feed don't move on their own, but I can adjust it quickly by hand to within a degree using the original skew scale.

Thanks for everyone's encouragement!
 
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