amc 9 83 w classic tv here

[delu4444]

rtn tv network now call myretro tv is on amc 9 83 w. has east/west coast feed. i hope this information will help u find amc 9. these two tp will help u fine amc 9. tp 11728 and 11775. depend on what part of the country u r n one of these tp will come n stronger than the other. put these two tp n frist, then 11735. it will take 10-15 seconds beforce u lock n on 11735 my retro tv.

antenna setup

amc 9 83w
lnb power - on
lnb type - standard- ku-band
lnb freq- 10750
22khz - off
tp- 11728- s/r 04342 pol h- fec- 3/4
tp- 11775- s/r 04342 pol h- fec- 3/4
tp- 11735- sr 04444 pol h - fec- 3/4
remember to scan after setup.
90cm dish

this what work for me n chicago. i hope it will work for u. may god bless u all and keep u safe.

 

[ELMWOOD]

rtn tv network now call myretro tv is on amc 9 83 w. has east/west coast feed. i hope this information will help u find amc 9. these two tp will help u fine amc 9. tp 11728 and 11775. depend on what part of the country u r n one of these tp will come n stronger than the other. put these two tp n frist, then 11735. it will take 10-15 seconds beforce u lock n on 11735 my retro tv.

antenna setup

amc 9 83w
lnb power - on
lnb type - standard- ku-band
lnb freq- 10750
22khz - off
tp- 11728- s/r 04342 pol h- fec- 3/4
tp- 11775- s/r 04342 pol h- fec- 3/4
tp- 11735- sr 04444 pol h - fec- 3/4
remember to scan after setup.
90cm dish

this what work for me n chicago. i hope it will work for u. may god bless u all and keep u safe.

I lock on the 11775 with like 75% but the retro transponder is zero? I would like to get this channel.

 

[delu4444]

july 22 2009 storm were n the area. i had a lot of signal loss. july 23 2009 clear skies no signal loss yet. 11775 u should color bar and nbc news channel amc9/3f. 11728 u get color bars only. if u got these two channel than 11735 singal were out when u scan. just keep trying. i had the same problem yesterday. it might take more than 20 second to lock in. scan the other tp and see what you come up with.

 

[BarneyBean]

They need to turn up the power, I can scan in RTN west but no pic

 

[Tron]

The reception problems you are describing are due to the close proximity of the "LEO-1" signal, which has been discussed in a handful of threads. I get optimum reception of RTV by manually scanning 11735 H 4444.

 

[Mr Tony]

I have no clue what the OP said since some of the "words" are just letters (why cant people write out the words??) but Tron pretty much hit it on the head. Some folks are having issues with an adjacent signal

 

[BarneyBean]

I know its due to the other signal and I have adjusted the S/R but still no good, I need a slightly bigger dish thats it.

 

[tvropro]

Was watching a VSAT engineers classroom on ku today that explained allot about what may be happening to RTN. It appears when an adjacent is stronger in power it throws noise in the digital pedestal of the weaker channel because the stronger one fattens up it's bandwidth and bleeds. It made allot of sense. Went into some deep details, solutions etc, very interesting stuff for the techie.

They may play the piece again. The channel was on G-19: 11778, H, 3978, V-33, A-34, PCR-33 lots of cool stuff to be learned about digital there today.

BTW why is the Video One signal there anyway? it's always bars and tone. Whoever runs it is running a dirty splattering transmitter. Usually stations when running bars and tone as a test slate operate at reduced power until it's time to broadcast programming. Not the case with this signal.

 

[cruzin]

Who owns the station that is putting up the LEO-1? why dont we all write them and ask the to clean up there signal or turn it down. Just maybe!

 

[tvropro]

Did anyone ever see any programming on that? All I ever see is color bars. RTN needs to boost there power so they can splatter back on them.

 

[B.J.]

Did anyone ever see any programming on that? All I ever see is color bars. RTN needs to boost there power so they can splatter back on them.

All this talk about the 11729 signal being too strong and splattering signal onto RTN is really just conjecture as far as I'm concerned. As often as not, the 11729 signal is no stronger than the 11735. Right now, they are about the same, or if anything the 11729 might be a tad weaker.
Also, there is no way that anyone other than at the uplink site of the 11729 signal can have any evidence that that signal is splattering onto the RTN signal.

My conjecture is that many people are blaming the LEO signal for what is really a problem with their own receiver.

 

[Mr Tony]

or the fact they are using a smaller dish....RTV tells affiliates a 1.2m dish minimum

 

[tvropro]

None of the consumer receivers are really up to the task of whats going on. They need narrow band filters installed that would solve the problem. Also a receiver with a non PLL circuit that locks to the stronger frequency would help.

Just out of curiosity has anyone thought about adding skirts on there dish to increase aperture? I remember back in the day some C band systems sold extensions.

 

[Mr Tony]

well I found out that some receivers are bad when it comes to knocking out adjacent signals

The Pansat 1500 can lock RTV no issues on my 76cm or 90cm. Today while working on a test run for another member I took the 6 footer and spun it over to 83W
Locked the test card (11775) at 99 quality
RTN locked at 45-49 quality
what was weird is if I moved the dish on the "scan TP" screen it would spike to 77 quality....woo hoo! until I scanned then it would get Leo even though I was at 11735 H 4340...so 6 Mhz off it scanned. Re-edited it to 11736 H 4440 and locked RTV at a max of 45-49 quality....cant get any higher than that

 

[melgarga]

Well, looks like we are about to re-visit the function (definition) of the Quality indication. The engineering tutorial tvropro referenced supports the idea the stronger signal creating "noise" and causes a poor C/N for the desired (11735) signal receiption. To the garden variety STB this would be a decrease in Q (apparent signal strength), but to a SA the observed "strength" difference is nominal. Not unlike AGC overload for an analog equivalant. The STB is doing exactly what is told to do - "Find a signal around 11735 mhz, with a data rate of about 4444" When it searches withing it's predefined "distance" of the two parameters, it locks (syncs to) the signal with the best C/N aka Quality, and by virture of phase modulation, discriminates out the weaker (poor C/N) signal. The simple truth is that the signals are too close in frequency for reliable operation for the bandwidth they are using.
If one could absolutely manually tune 11735/4444 you would still have the FM capture effect to deal with. Narrowing the receivers lock range may help but at the expense of loss of dynamic frequency coverage and response.
Bigger dish=better lock?....uh, not from my unscientific observation. Realizing that C/N is a major factor here, I have a 1m Primestar w/ stock JAP LNB (NF=.9 I think) and an Astrotel Ku (NF= .6 I think it is) on the 7.5' mesh. The Primestar will lock the signal when the BUD refuses to, no matter what I do to make it. The entire receiption varies immensly. Most of the time it will be both, then the BUD will drop lock, then the PS will, BUT, sometimes in the wee hours (I suspect ice crystals in the upper atmosphere, natures little Ku attenuators) the signal on the PS will be down in the pix'ing threshhold but the signal from the BUD is well above the threshold (better gain) and not trying to jump to the other TP at all.
The very simple solution would be for RTN to move to the vertical plane. That's an automatic 25-30 db isolation.
I wonder if they are still using "Equity Engineers"..........or worse the same engineers that MM is consulting for the G3 re-uplinks

 

[tvropro]

Well, looks like we are about to re-visit the function (definition) of the Quality indication. The engineering tutorial tvropro referenced supports the idea the stronger signal creating "noise" and causes a poor C/N for the desired (11735) signal receiption. To the garden variety STB this would be a decrease in Q (apparent signal strength), but to a SA the observed "strength" difference is nominal. Not unlike AGC overload for an analog equivalant. The STB is doing exactly what is told to do - "Find a signal around 11735 mhz, with a data rate of about 4444" When it searches withing it's predefined "distance" of the two parameters, it locks (syncs to) the signal with the best C/N aka Quality, and by virture of phase modulation, discriminates out the weaker (poor C/N) signal. The simple truth is that the signals are too close in frequency for reliable operation for the bandwidth they are using.
If one could absolutely manually tune 11735/4444 you would still have the FM capture effect to deal with. Narrowing the receivers lock range may help but at the expense of loss of dynamic frequency coverage and response.
Bigger dish=better lock?....uh, not from my unscientific observation. Realizing that C/N is a major factor here, I have a 1m Primestar w/ stock JAP LNB (NF=.9 I think) and an Astrotel Ku (NF= .6 I think it is) on the 7.5' mesh. The Primestar will lock the signal when the BUD refuses to, no matter what I do to make it. The entire receiption varies immensly. Most of the time it will be both, then the BUD will drop lock, then the PS will, BUT, sometimes in the wee hours (I suspect ice crystals in the upper atmosphere, natures little Ku attenuators) the signal on the PS will be down in the pix'ing threshhold but the signal from the BUD is well above the threshold (better gain) and not trying to jump to the other TP at all.
The very simple solution would be for RTN to move to the vertical plane. That's an automatic 25-30 db isolation.
I wonder if they are still using "Equity Engineers"..........or worse the same engineers that MM is consulting for the G3 re-uplinks

There is multiple reasons why this all is happening, more than meets the eye. Who knows exactly what Luken is doing at the uplink. In theory a larger dish should give enough signal to overcome this problem. But the capture effect as you mention of the stronger signal will cause the stronger signal to be dominant. I guess it's hit and miss while they keep things as they are.

As far as the engineers go they seem to take there lessons from the Crawford engineers for NPS (please don't get me started on that). RTN has had one kind of technical problem or another even when over on G-10 back in the day. So should we expect anything less here on AMC-9. All I can say is this is the worst setup they have had yet. It's a shame because I do enjoy RTN's programming. My Primestar 90cm with NJR LNB & Pansat 2700A works for the most part so I guess I should be happy. Although riding at threshold is the pits because an ant walking across the LNB will cause it to start to fall off the digital cliff.

I really think that things are as they are and won't change. Im hoping an OTA channel will pick up RTN by me. They are suppose to be working on getting into the Chicago market. Then the OTA station can deal with the piss poor performance the RTN uplink is putting out.

 

[guapoharry]

...My conjecture is that many people are blaming the LEO signal for what is really a problem with their own receiver.

This sounds sensible.

Some receivers are probably more selective than others.

One that doesn't do so well on the RTV's is my Pansat 2500A. I tried all sorts of stuff to get that TP loaded. It would register with manual entry at 11737, but was not stable. Otherwise with blind scan or manually on 11735, that TP with the color bars would register.

Even when manually setting PIDs, something called Ch A came up. But, it didn't work...

On the other hand, my MercII and Coolsat 5k / 6k's do fine for RTV. (With manual entry, not blindscan...)

 

[guapoharry]

...Just out of curiosity has anyone thought about adding skirts on there dish to increase aperture? I remember back in the day some C band systems sold extensions.

What does this mean, increasing the dish diameter, effectively? Or do the extensions install in a particular location?

 

[melgarga]

Yeah, G3 issues....right there with ya bud :rant:
I agree, there are a lot of factor we just dont have the information about. We can only speculate from observation, but you would think any engineer worth his salt would know the fine line this signal is riding. Another 'speculative' observation is that since uplink/downlink ERP is proportionally related, and a TP has finite output for a given bandwidth, I'm still of a mind that someone is comming in pretty hot, and hogging the available power output of the TP at times. That makes the problem double if the 'hog' is also the one that is adjacent to 11735 powerstarving all other active signals (who else is there full time?) and causing capture problems too. The offending signals arent listed on Lyngsat, so who knows exactly what they are really running at, given that the STBs will lock them in a pretty wide range, all the way passed (above) the RTN signal.
I dunno. It is very annoying when it happens.
I dont see RTN getting picked up for a sub here. The local NBC has THiS and LTV for subs. The CBS and ABC affiliates both use one sc for delayed broadcasts of the main channel programming (what a waste) and the ABC station has the Accuweather feed (more usless crap tv) on their -3 sc. Fox, MY and CW dont have any sc that I've seen, but I cant see independents picking up an independent for a sc feed. ION has it's usual sc multiplex, as does PBS. I dont see Houston getting the RTN channels on OTA.
Even though they ended up in questionably the crappiest spot in the satellite spectrum, you are right, all things (Equitably, punny huh!) considered we should be thankful for what we do have.. I just cant beleive that the affiliates' engineers havent questioned the poor margin of error for threshhold receiption.
If it's not twice as good as it needs to be then it's only half as good as it should be. Let their signal jump to LEO-1 and I'll bet some heads will roll somewhere!

 

[tvropro]

What does this mean, increasing the dish diameter, effectively? Or do the extensions install in a particular location?

In the old days they sold kits to make your 8 foot dish a 10 foot. Something may be able to be fabricated to make an offset bigger.