Dish Network trying to kill Pansat and Legal FTA

[tvropro]

I don't know if anyone read this from Mike Kohl's website:

Pansat has discontinued two of their more basic MPEG-2 receivers; models 2700 and 2800, which were replaced by their 150
and 250 series units. They received some bad news last month when an appeal that would have paralleled Coolsat's successful challenge of DISH Network's demand for customer names was rejected. If you have purchased a Pansat receiver
in the last five years, do not be surprised if DISH Network lawyers contact you to do a survey about what channels you
are using that equipment to receive. We trust that the vast majority of our customers bought equipment strictly for
legitimate reception of non subscription signals. But DISH Network is trying to collect information in order to build
a case that suggests that the majority of MPEG-2 free to air receivers on the market have been compromised for illegal use.
If you are like one of our typical customers, we strongly urge you to explain to them that there are lots of other channels in
the sky that do not involve their subscription service, and list them. I prefer PBS from 125 West,
international news from Al-Jazeera and Russia Today on 97 West, and a host of services from Equity Broadcasting
on 123---all Ku-band satellites; not even using DBS frequencies. The whole legal process appears to be
very over-reaching, but some corrupt or easily manipulated judges were convinced by DISH Network's legal team
that the majority of independent satellite users were involved in illegal activity, and signed off on subpoenas
demanding the release of customer names of persons that purchased MPEG-2 gear. If you are asked in such a survey,
please set these people straight. DISH Network needs to replace their encryption system like DirecTV did several
years ago, and this problem would go away.

http://www.global-cm.net/news&views.html

 

[DJ Rob]

About a year and a half ago, I caught a guy from Dish taking pictures of my Winegard 30" that was on my balcony. He said that all FTA equipment was illegal and that I would be contacted by corporate. One more reason why I would NEVER use their service. How can they get away with this kind of harrassment?

 

[Cadsulfide]

Charlie Ergin has been exploiting the legal system for his own gain since the beginning. I'm sure the legal dept has a bigger budget than customer service, which at DISH is an oxymoron. If you can't make a decent profit by providing a reliable service at a good price point, make a profit by splitting up the company, and by sueing everything in sight.

 

[tvropro]

Charlie should look in a mirror before accusing others. Back in the day he was involved with transporting Videocipher 2's to Mexico to be illegally chipped even though it was illegal to have one out of the US because of the DES used in it.

What it boils down too is Charlie has decided to use a breakable encryption system and instead of spending money to use something unbreakable like DC2 he pays off the corrupt judges to judge in his favor to take out companies like Pansat, Coolsat etc and destroy the legal use of there equipment and call us criminals. If there was justice Charlie could be held accountable for his actions but alas. The ones with all the bucks make the rules and get away with it until the courts finally decide to make an example out of them.

 

[RVD420]

About a year and a half ago, I caught a guy from Dish taking pictures of my Winegard 30" that was on my balcony. He said that all FTA equipment was illegal and that I would be contacted by corporate. One more reason why I would NEVER use their service. How can they get away with this kind of harrassment?

I can do better than that.

About 2 years ago I had Dishnetwork installed.

The installer saw my 90cm fortec dish, my 6 footer, and my 2 fta boxes.

After the install he offers to fix my fta boxes to get PPV's.

The fooking Idiot didn't realize that there is no hackware for the Traxis 3500.

 

[olliec420]

I can do better than that.

About 2 years ago I had Dishnetwork installed.

The installer saw my 90cm fortec dish, my 6 footer, and my 2 fta boxes.

After the install he offers to fix my fta boxes to get PPV's.

The fooking Idiot didn't realize that there is no hackware for the Traxis 3500.

ha now thats funny, did try and get money from you for it? i.e. hey for $200 bucks i can hook u up with.....

 

[Ironsides]

What a joke

Personally, I think and this my opinion and mine alone, that Every Single FTA dealer and Owner of FTA Equipment should all get together some how and seek Congress and the FCC to have providers broadcast some network feeds, news feeds and educational channels and at least 2 or 3 movie channels FREE AND IN THE CLEAR WITH NO FEES or otherwise ever be allowed to charge for them! Seems they are forcing people to have
purchase crappy programming packages from either Cable companies or Satellite companies! When is Enough Enough my gawd People! When is anyone going to stand up and say ENOUGH!

People who live in Fringe areas that are not provided cable or can receive free over the air tv with an antenna either digital or analog should be allowed to have other alternatives SUCH as FTA! I live in a fringe area
where over the air digital tv is a joke. We can get just a few digital channels and before they started goofing around with over the air tv, I could get about 35 analog channels well enough to watch them. Now I'm lucky to get 3 or 4 digital channels and was forced to either buy a new TV or buy a converter box. Nobody asked me If I wanted to switch to digital, I just got told I was switching! Has it been good for everyone? NO it has not! It's only good for those who are going to make millions if not billions on the frequencies that wish to sell or buy!

I am sick as he** of corporations trying to suck this country dry! Bad enough everyone of them run to the government for money with every broken law and crooked crook following them! Bailout Wallstreet is a joke! How about bailing out middle and poor America for once!

This is just another joke thrown on Hard Working people by Greedy back stapping lying two faced crooked jerks!

FTA should be FREE AND LEGAL for anyone who wishes to purchase and maintain and educate themselves somewhat!

 

[toucan-man]

Can anyone post a copy of the letter (if that's what it is) they're sending out to owners of these boxes?

As far as answering any questions, did we all wake up today to find we're living in North Korea? Do you have a button with Kim Jong Il's photo on your lapel? Are you obedient?

Whether you like them or hate them, I wonder if the ACLU would care to do some pro bono work on our behalf.

 

[toucan-man]

Personally, I think and this my opinion and mine alone, that Every Single FTA dealer and Owner of FTA Equipment should all get together some how and seek Congress and the FCC to have providers broadcast some network feeds, news feeds and educational channels and at least 2 or 3 movie channels FREE AND IN THE CLEAR WITH NO FEES or otherwise ever be allowed to charge for them! Seems they are forcing people to have
purchase crappy programming packages from either Cable companies or Satellite companies! When is Enough Enough my gawd People! When is anyone going to stand up and say ENOUGH!

I agree, 100%. Click this link and take a look at what they have for free in the UK:

freesat - Features

Check out this cool brochure:

http://www.freesat.co.uk/file_uploads/INSTORE_LEAFLET_26.11.08.pdf

Television in the USA has been frittered away for years. And it was no accident.

 

[stogie5150]

Personally, I think and this my opinion and mine alone, that Every Single FTA dealer and Owner of FTA Equipment should all get together some how and seek Congress and the FCC to have providers broadcast some network feeds, news feeds and educational channels and at least 2 or 3 movie channels FREE AND IN THE CLEAR WITH NO FEES or otherwise ever be allowed to charge for them! Seems they are forcing people to have
purchase crappy programming packages from either Cable companies or Satellite companies! When is Enough Enough my gawd People! When is anyone going to stand up and say ENOUGH!

People who live in Fringe areas that are not provided cable or can receive free over the air tv with an antenna either digital or analog should be allowed to have other alternatives SUCH as FTA! I live in a fringe area
where over the air digital tv is a joke. We can get just a few digital channels and before they started goofing around with over the air tv, I could get about 35 analog channels well enough to watch them. Now I'm lucky to get 3 or 4 digital channels and was forced to either buy a new TV or buy a converter box. Nobody asked me If I wanted to switch to digital, I just got told I was switching! Has it been good for everyone? NO it has not! It's only good for those who are going to make millions if not billions on the frequencies that wish to sell or buy!

I am sick as he** of corporations trying to suck this country dry! Bad enough everyone of them run to the government for money with every broken law and crooked crook following them! Bailout Wallstreet is a joke! How about bailing out middle and poor America for once!

This is just another joke thrown on Hard Working people by Greedy back stapping lying two faced crooked jerks!

FTA should be FREE AND LEGAL for anyone who wishes to purchase and maintain and educate themselves somewhat!

Your argument is the exact one that the hackers use. They don't see it as stealing, well most of them don't. They will tell you they believe that the satellite/cable companies have a monopoly on the airwaves, shut out to all except those who will pay what they believe are extortion-like rates. So they have no problem taking what isn't theirs because they look at it as a kind of civil disobedience. Stick-it-to-the-man, such as it is.

I've had a few folks ask me about it, and I tell them all the same thing....if I were hacking would I have all these C-band dishes in my back yard, spend all this time and money (mostly time, but time is worth SOMETHING,after all), on motors and obsolete dish mover motors that no one can find or fix? It'd be madness.

Its EASY to set up a system for hacking. EASY. Those of us that do true FTA could aim a E* dish blindfolded. What we do is HARD. It takes TIME,PATIENCE, and, most of all KNOWLEDGE. Knowledge that can ONLY be obtained by DOING IT. There are no shortcuts.

I don't know anyone that does it, but if I did I wouldn't give a tinker's damn, that's between them, the Man in the Clouds, and Echostar. It isn't for me, because I am not a thief by nature. I'll take what's unencrypted and be happy.

Charlie needs to secure his signal. His antics lately have taken him off of MY list should I consider pay tv again. So, with D* being on my permanent excrement list, and now E* joining them, there's no one to take my money left, except Charter.

I disagree with any kind of DRM on principle, also, so Blu-ray is a non-starter too. And also,any company that sells me programming and then wants to control what I do with it ,automatically gets disqualified from enjoying my money every month.

 

[Cadsulfide]

The only vote that counts is your checkbook. If you don't like small towns dying, stop driving 100 miles to Wal-Mart to save $25.00. If you MUST have Animal Planet, get a 10' dish and a NPS sub. Spread the word about FTA, every convert is more than a "churn loss" to Charlie, it's a cash cow gone for good. A trickle can turn into a flood. Look at current oil prices.

As for Pansat dropping the 2700, it is an old box, new models with new features do come out from time to time.

Also, we would be naive to ignore that big chunk of change is being made from the endless cat & mouse game that the eye-patch crowd plays with a certian provider. Many so called FTA boxes capitalize on the weaknesses in Nagra. It does help to drive the technology forward in areas like HD and PVR abilities.

This is still America. If you ever recieve a nastygram demanding money and that you divulge everything you do to some souless entity, just tell em "F*CK *FF". They count on people caving out of fear and sending undeserved checks to them. For D*SH, it's another revenue stream that requires no product to be made nor any service to be provided. No different than the retransmission wars. No different than ill timed price hikes. Think TIVO lawsuit. Oppose these tactics. Hit 'em where it hurts, in the wallet.

Or....Just sign over your freedom.....and pay no attention to the man behind the curtain.

 

[rv1pop]

send a letter to each member of the FCC. Complain to them. THEY do work for you. They work for votes (indirectly) NOT money. Our FCC legal eagle had us do that a few years ago as well as writing to our congressmen. There were only a few thousand letters, total, writen, but it did the job. A few thousand letters could put both D* and E* licenses up for re-bid. There are people with a better business record than those 2 companies who wouyld have a great chance at winning.

 

[waters]

Great posts.! I got rid of the Dish network years ago. They kept raising the rates every year. I was paying near $50 a month. I checked into the British FTA and saw what they are getting for free a while ago and couldn't believe it. TV was free to begin with and now it cost more and more. Plus you still have commercials! Lots of them.

 

[Ironsides]

Not exactly

Your argument is the exact one that the hackers use. They don't see it as stealing, well most of them don't. They will tell you they believe that the satellite/cable companies have a monopoly on the airwaves, shut out to all except those who will pay what they believe are extortion-like rates. So they have no problem taking what isn't theirs because they look at it as a kind of civil disobedience. Stick-it-to-the-man, such as it i

s.

Really, that's very unfair of you to imply that my statement compairs to hacking or that I agree with such. I don't agree with hacking anything and by no means am I a thief. I have worked my entire adult life. Infact I started working a public job at the age of 12. I pay for everything I get and Do not appreciate anyone implying I hack anything or steal anything. Just because some of you are posting on a forum does not give you the right to imply anyone is a theif or a hacker just because you think you can get by with it.
I do not appreciate that and that statement offends me deeply!

My arguement differs very much from hacking. I believe that by law that Over the Air broadcasts should be free from this date till the end of time. Our law makers once agreed with that and IF you would like to Check the 1937 FCC act you'll see they did and did for many many years. Not until the very late 70's and early 80's did that start to change!

The services are there for people to pay for IF they so choose! That's my point it should be by choice! Other Alternatives should be out there for everyone! Not just the elect or wealthy!

Other countries have FTA and why should We not be able to enjoy TV on equipment we have bought and paid for legally? Spent many hours working on our dishes? I owned a C-Band dish when everything on it was FREE and that was legal until some corporate muck wad decided to to buy someones lunch in Washington or pay for a house remodel! I never played hacker with C-Band either! When they changed the laws, I paid my sub and I paid for New equipment in order to receive those sub'ed channels! Just Like I DO TODAY!

I'm not saying everything on Satellite should be made FTA all I am saying is some FTA should be out there for people to enjoy with some decent channels. Like we enjoy today! Some Greedy assed CEO should not have the right to take that away from the people of this nation!

I would bet pine nuts that as soon as the Digital over the air is full swing and they have the kinks worked out of that the major players will try to stop allowing people to receive over the air broadcasts without a sub. They are already getting into the play ground by supplying Converter boxes. Soon they'll offer special packages and then No More Free Over the Air TV by antenna! Corporate Greed will make it illegal for people to enjoy antenna tv that's been legally free since its conception! So what then? Is everyone who Complains about that a Hacker or a thief? No they're not they're just asking for fairness in a nation who's laws are about being fair to all people! Not just a select group! So what about people that live in areas that Cable is not offered? What about people who live in Areas Satellite is difficult to receive? What about those of us who live in areas Antenna Reception is difficult? What alternatives do we have? Let's not forget about people that are poor and do not have the income to afford Cable or Satellite packages, what becomes of them? Are they not allowed to have something to enjoy or is TV only for the upper class?

If I read more into your post than you mean, which I certianly hope is the case I apoligize. However, in the future a friendly tad of advice; Don't assume to include me or anyone who speaks out against Corporate Greed as being a thief or hacker. Unless you have something more to go on than a post that complains about A CEO who's only interests are self serving and not for the good of the over all general public!


I really thought after years of reading this Forum that Satellite Guys would be a place to enjoy. I had hoped it would Different from so many other FTA sites and actually discuss topics without belittling others because of differences of opinion, I can now see I was dead wrong. I would have thought everyone at this site would be very happy to KEEP REAL FTA in our skies, I guess I was wrong about that as well.

Peace and Happy Holidays!

I'll crawl away now that I have spoken my mind and go back to my "cell" with all the other criminals who only want to keep FTA free and legal!

 

[rv1pop]

Hi Ironsides. I have watched what Stogie has done on this website for over a year and I would be very surprised IF he was saying anything against you. Your arguements (reasons) are probably the same REASONS as his.

That being said, I think it is time to change the laws back to the people -- or change the lawMAKERS back to the people.

As an example of what could happen, if TBN networks and their programers were to promote Glorystar and FTA by pulling off D* and E* and 25% of their listeners were to quit the sub services because of it, the sub services would be hurting. The likelyhood of that happening is slim because TBN wants to reach NEW people. However, if TBN supporters were to go to Glorystar system instead of paying Charlie, and support TBN with some of the savings, Charlie would be hurting a whole lot more than the rest of us. AND those savings would also pay one of the best FCC law firms enough to stop the harrassment of CHRISTIAN viewers -- who may be Charlie's real targets. (Need to check his backers, I think.)

 

[Mr Tony]

Ironsides I think you are taking what stogie the wrong way. Believe me I have heard people "think" the same way you do and they are stealing. Are we accusing you of stealing? I know I'm not.

But people who steal Dish (most of them) basically are doing it as a "f you" to Dish.


But I do want to comment on the first paragraph you wrote.

Personally, I think and this my opinion and mine alone, that Every Single FTA dealer and Owner of FTA Equipment should all get together some how and seek Congress and the FCC to have providers broadcast some network feeds, news feeds and educational channels and at least 2 or 3 movie channels FREE AND IN THE CLEAR WITH NO FEES or otherwise ever be allowed to charge for them! Seems they are forcing people to have
purchase crappy programming packages from either Cable companies or Satellite companies! When is Enough Enough my gawd People! When is anyone going to stand up and say ENOUGH!

um, there are "some" networks, news feeds and educational stuff on free to air. With KU I can get ABC, FOX & My Network, for educational I can get PBS and for news I can view Russia Today, Al Jazeera, Press TV, or local news on the ABC affiliates above. Movie channels like HBO, Showtime etc we wont see unscrambled because they have been scrambling for 20 years.

But the options that have been out there for 15-20 years have always been the same. 20 years ago it was antenna, cable (if available) or if you had the option to put up a big dish, that's what they did. Then Directv & Dish came along and allowed folks to subscribe to them.
You dont have to subscribe to them if you dont want to. I know I and others here don't. I have FTA and OTA and I'm pretty content with what I have.

Other countries have FTA and why should We not be able to enjoy TV on equipment we have bought and paid for legally?

I enjoy TV just fine on my setup thank you

So what about people that live in areas that Cable is not offered?

satellite or OTA

What about people who live in Areas Satellite is difficult to receive?

I've seen some interesting setups for DIsh/Direct like on a pole really high up, on the TV antenna tower or near the road (200 feet from the house) to get satellite

What about those of us who live in areas Antenna Reception is difficult? What alternatives do we have?

satellite or an antenna...same as it was 20 years ago. Where our cabin is we are too far away from the Minneapolis stations and until we got Dish setup there we had 3 channels...CBS, PBS and a low powered NBC. I see 5 foot dishes that are still used today and are fixed on G16 at 99W for the nets. Others have tower antenna systems that are a good 100+ feet up..

And lets not forget about people that are poor and do not have the income to afford Cable or Satellite packages, what becomes of them? Are they not allowed to have something to enjoy or is TV only for the upper class?

I think if they cant afford cable how they gonna afford a FTA system??

I have a couple relatives that are strictly OTA not because they are "poor" but because they dont want anything else. They could get cable or satellite but figure what they have right now is good enough.

Also if FTA "catches on" like it is in other countries, you don't think they'd scramble the channels then too? Frankly I'm content with what we have the opportunity to see of FTA because its not that "big" like other countries. I like the raw news feeds and sports feeds. FTA gets too "big" then we can say bye bye to them

also here is the thread about the last time we went through this
http://www.satelliteguys.us/fta-shack/101645-echostar-files-suit-over-fta-boxes.html

 

[Skyscanner]

Be careful when you look to the UK as an FTA haven, they have to buy a license to operate their TV. I have read of cases of people being jailed for refusing to license their tube. Nothing is free, but the good ol' USA is as close as it gets. I love my FTA hobby. I got started just this last summer. Prior to that I was a Sky Angel lifer. Don't want to go on a rant about that, but in retrospect, they did me a tremendous favor and got me into a hobby I really love. FTA and OTA is the only TV I can get up here in Northern MI, except for D* or DTV-- and I get to control what I watch, and since the price is right, if something goes off the air, I can always find something else! I'm not going to panic over what D* might do, I have a rebellious nature that is not shy about telling them to step off.

 

[Ironsides]

Regardless

Regardless of the meaning, people should be far more considerate of other peoples opinions/feelings on an open forum. If I mistook the intentions or misinterputed the actual meaning of the post, I will be the first to say I am sorry to anyone who I would or do offend by my comments. It was not my intentions to start a pissing match between posters of the rights and wrongs of government. Or to imply that anyone who disagrees with me is a thief or a hacker or anything else for that matter. In Fact I thought Hacker talk of ANY kind was forbidden on this site. In my opinion it would include implying someone a hacker if that be the actual case. I just don't care for that sort of thing and do not do that and do not want to be included in that catagory.

My intention was to support the TRUE MEANING OF REAL FTA in my original posting and nothing more! I've spent many a year working with C-Band dishes and although new to this site I am not all together new to the hobby of FTA and would dare say have worked just as hard and speant as many hours reading not to mention the money I have laid out in the past. As anyone here! I just don't know everything and I don't act like I do, I am not afraid to ask a question and often times, I already know the answer. I just enjoy getting other peoples ideas and suggestions. After all this is what a forum is about posting, asking questions and getting answers.

I am an old man don't have to much left in life but a few hobbies such as Radios and Satellites. I will admit I get a tad raff'ed due to the medications I take and I do not mean to hurt anyones feelings. I just grew up in a different time I guess...I guess I just don't like the idea of some CEO trying to take away something I take seriously and enjoy!

Well its pretty clear a few of you think I over reacted to comments, that said I don't think I did but thats just me. I read exactly what the guy posted and I read it a couple of times, I get it! Really I do! What I posted had nothing to with hackers or being a thief. As mentioned wouldn't give you a plug nickel for either. What I posted in my opinion is the Very thing We all so much enjoy and for some petty little twirp CEO try to take away that right just burns me. You may have the rights of FTA today but in the future if you keep turning a blinds eye to these very things we will not have them to enjoy.

In this case, I guess the best thing for me to say is Good Night Gracie! All you guys have a Merry Christmas, Happy Holidays and Seasons Greetings! This old man will go back to reading, no need for me to post, can't see that well anyway! Good night!

Stogie, I appreciate you taking the time to break down my post and I appreciate your comments very much. I saw your last post after mine and wanted you to know, I have no hard feelings towards you. Also, know I thank you for breaking down my post and explaining it as you have and agreeing with some of what I said. I think we are on the same pages we just said it differently. I apologize to you directly for my haste and you have a Merry Christmas

 

[stogie5150]

Your argument is the exact one that the hackers use. They don't see it as stealing, well most of them don't. They will tell you they believe that the satellite/cable companies have a monopoly on the airwaves, shut out to all except those who will pay what they believe are extortion-like rates. So they have no problem taking what isn't theirs because they look at it as a kind of civil disobedience. Stick-it-to-the-man, such as it is.

Really, that's very unfair of you to imply that my statement compairs to hacking or that I agree with such. I don't agree with hacking anything and by no means am I a thief. I have worked my entire adult life. Infact I started working a public job at the age of 12. I pay for everything I get and Do not appreciate anyone implying I hack anything or steal anything. Just because some of you are posting on a forum does not give you the right to imply anyone is a theif or a hacker just because you think you can get by with it.
I do not appreciate that and that statement offends me deeply!

If you are offended I apologize. It was not intended. I simply said a version of your argument is the same as the hackers use. Me personally, I think it should be illegal to encrypt any signal that contains advertising, but I am the loon in the barn on this, for I am old enough to remember the PROMISE that "cable tv" wouldn't even HAVE commercials!

My arguement differs very much from hacking. I believe that by law that Over the Air broadcasts should be free from this date till the end of time. Our law makers once agreed with that and IF you would like to Check the 1937 FCC act you'll see they did and did for many many years. Not until the very late 70's and early 80's did that start to change!

And I am saying that the average hacker will tell you that the satellite provider bombards his property with signal, and as such he can do whatever he wants with it unless and until they stop bombarding his property with the signal! Regardless of the law saying otherwise!

The services are there for people to pay for IF they so choose! That's my point it should be by choice! Other Alternatives should be out there for everyone! Not just the elect or wealthy!
Other countries have FTA and why should We not be able to enjoy TV on equipment we have bought and paid for legally? Spent many hours working on our dishes? I owned a C-Band dish when everything on it was FREE and that was legal until some corporate muck wad decided to to buy someones lunch in Washington or pay for a house remodel! I never played hacker with C-Band either! When they changed the laws, I paid my sub and I paid for New equipment in order to receive those sub'ed channels! Just Like I DO TODAY!
I'm not saying everything on Satellite should be made FTA all I am saying is some FTA should be out there for people to enjoy with some decent channels. Like we enjoy today! Some Greedy assed CEO should not have the right to take that away from the people of this nation!

I agree wholeheartedly with all of that. :up

I would bet pine nuts that as soon as the Digital over the air is full swing and they have the kinks worked out of that the major players will try to stop allowing people to receive over the air broadcasts without a sub. They are already getting into the play ground by supplying Converter boxes. Soon they'll offer special packages and then No More Free Over the Air TV by antenna! Corporate Greed will make it illegal for people to enjoy antenna tv that's been legally free since its conception!

Its already here. Every DTVPal converter box is equipped with a decoder device. Its pretty well known, here on SatelliteGuys. If and when that happens, I WILL BE a hacker.

So what then? Is everyone who Complains about that a Hacker or a thief? No they're not they're just asking for fairness in a nation who's laws are about being fair to all people! Not just a select group! So what about people that live in areas that Cable is not offered? What about people who live in Areas Satellite is difficult to receive? What about those of us who live in areas Antenna Reception is difficult? What alternatives do we have? Let's not forget about people that are poor and do not have the income to afford Cable or Satellite packages, what becomes of them? Are they not allowed to have something to enjoy or is TV only for the upper class?

Then my friend, we hoist the black flag and begin slitting throats.

If I read more into your post than you mean, which I certianly hope is the case I apoligize. However, in the future a friendly tad of advice; Don't assume to include me or anyone who speaks out against Corporate Greed as being a thief or hacker. Unless you have something more to go on than a post that complains about A CEO who's only interests are self serving and not for the good of the over all general public!

Point taken, but I didn't get over 2000 posts here by pissing folks off. We get all kinds of folks from all walks of life here every day. Some stay, most don't. But satelliteguys is the best for a reason, and we both are experiencing that reason right here. We can discuss this here without fear.

I really thought after years of reading this Forum that Satellite Guys would be a place to enjoy. I had hoped it would Different from so many other FTA sites and actually discuss topics without belittling others because of differences of opinion, I can now see I was dead wrong. I would have thought everyone at this site would be very happy to KEEP REAL FTA in our skies, I guess I was wrong about that as well.

You will find no other FTA site as good as this. Hang around, maybe you can teach US something, we always welcome new ideas in the C-band section.

Peace and Happy Holidays!

I'll crawl away now that I have spoken my mind and go back to my "cell" with all the other criminals who only want to keep FTA free and legal!

As far as I am concerned you have not done anything wrong, and have no reason to hide. Pull up a chair and stay awhile.

Happy Holidays to you and yours as well.:up

 

[avg1joe]

I think it should be illegal to encrypt any signal that contains advertising

I agree with that.

If only you could get the advertisers to jump on the bandwagon then you might go someplace with that idea.