Frustrated Dish Owner - I cant be alone on this!

[chargerrich]

New member, awesome forum! Apologies for length, but this story must be told in hopes of getting some help.

I have only been a dish customer for the past 9 months (15 year former comcast customer who never registered any complaint) but have become increasingly frustrated with my Dish account as we move into the digital age. Let me preface that I am not trying to bash Dish or Directv, my Dish service has been, for the most part, enjoyable if perhaps a little expensive (more on that in a moment). I just want a service that can meet my needs, which I feel are becoming more standard every day as HD becomes common place and I wonder if Directv would be more accommodating.

Please let me explain my dilema.

When we built our new home last year, we initially only really needed 2 HD signals, so we were provided 2 HD Duo DVRs (777 series and 222 series I believe) that gave us 2 HD signals and two "wireless" SD signals. I really did not research Dish vs. Directv and was with Dish because they were coupled as a package offering from my DSL 10mbps carrier (formerly Embarq, now Centurylink). Now that we are moved in and have a finished basement, rec room and a separate theatre room, we really NEED 5 HD signals. So I made a call to Dish yesterday thinking no problem, I will just get a few more receivers, increase my bill and be on my way. Boy was I mistaken.

Unfortunately, Dish has informed me that they have a standing policy to not lease more than 3 boxes to any household. This limitation is very frustrating as I have a need for A MINIMUM of 5 rooms in HD. Even with 3 HD DVR Duos, I only get 3 HD signals. I politely told the CSR that I would gladly trade in the DVRs and just take 5 base HD receivers taking the DVR hit but again was stonewalled. They did tell me however, that I could "semi purchase" new 922 models for... get this... $400 EACH AND a $17 dollar EACH per month charge AND I "own" them but only for the life of my subscription (meaning that if I leave, they are really not mine)!

No thanks...

The CSR was actually pretty understanding, polite and actually said that they have gotten a lot of calls like. She also said she would send me to the "loyalty" department where they might be able to help me. Great! I am then transferred and was immediately greeted by the most arrogant, condesending woman I have ever spoken to on a customer service call (I have her name and OPID) who basically told me that nothing could be done and actually questioned why anyone would "NEED" 5 HD signals when I have the Duos SD!

In 2010? Really?

Am I crazy for wanting 5 of my 7 60"+ or projector rooms to display At LEAST 720p? Really?

Anyway she was quick to let me cancel and of course informed me that I would be hit with the early service termination ($210), $15 shipping charge per DVR/remote and that I would need to have those back in 30 days or I would be charged MSRP for those boxes.

Now that is customer service!

It is important to note that I called in that morning with no issue and with ZERO intention to leave the service, but the sheer lack of flexibility (I was not offered a single dollar discount on anything in an effort to save my account) and arrogance by this "supervisor" left me with no options. I might also add that I had the America's Top 250 package, full sports package with Redzone and paid $112 a month for that plus the 2 DVRs which I am finding out was not a "great deal".

I have spoken briefly with Directv and they seem much more flexible in that they can give me 5 HD units with whole home DVR for $300 (2 HD free, paying $99 each x 3 for remaining) and then only charge me $5 a month for the 3 additional units (as opposed to Dish charging upwards of $400 each and $17 monthly charge each).

My only real issue now is that switching is a pain and more importantly, Dish offered NFL Redzone by iteself (for $5 a month) where Directv wants $314 for Sunday Ticket which includes Redzone, but they wont do Redzone by itself). Dish has a good service, but they cannot expect to compete moving forward if they cannot provide a semi affordable solution for > 3 HD signals. Surely someone has had this problem and found a solution...

I need help

 

[allargon]

Yeah, they really need to update that 3 device policy.

Do you need 5 HD DVR's or just 5 HD rooms? You can purchase 211's for about $100 each on E-bay. Dish won't let you lease more than 3 receivers. However, you can definitely have more than 3 on your account. Even if you need DVR service, you can add an external hard drive to each 211 for a small fee with no monthly DVR fee.

Sorry they were bad about that. That really is screwy.

Congratulations on your new home. Hopefully you find a multichannel provider that gives you the good service you want.

 

[mike123abc]

DISH 211K HDTV : DISHSTORE.NET

Take a look at the 211 from Dishstore. They are $119, but the monthly fee is $7. You can pay Dish a one time $40 charge and then you can hook up an USB HD to them to make them DVRs. Essentially it is the cheapest way with Dish to get more DVRs and the monthly fee is lower than any of the DVRs.

The issue of course you will have is the installation. Dishstore may be able to help with that, call them and see how much to have an installer come out and run the lines. Or a local installer could be contacted. You can do it yourself if you want, it is a matter of running a lot of new cables.

 

[chargerrich]

Yeah, they really need to update that 3 device policy.

Indeed... I was actually shocked by this.

Do you need 5 HD DVR's or just 5 HD rooms? You can purchase 211's for about $100 each on E-bay.

I actually had one of the many CSR's I spoke to mention Ebay or Craigslist and thought that might be an option, but then she added that I would have to pay $17 x 3 service fee monthly for my own boxes!

So I already pay $34 a month for the DVRs I am leasing and if I go out and BUY my own DVRs or Receivers I have to pay $51 more dollars just to use them with Dish! Thats $85 in service fees for equipment that is mine! :rant:

I have to reject that simply on principle! Especially when Directv will let me use any equipment leased or bought for $5/month (per unit). That is at least reasonable.

 

[Yespage]

Sorry they couldn't get you what you needed, though the responses in here seem to offer good advice to get you situated.

That said, I have no problem an operator wondering why you need 5 HD signals. You talk as if we all have that many HD tv's in the house. I don't envy your Sat bill, though am sure you probably can afford it easily.

This does beg the question, how many HD signals can one dish offer?

 

[Juan]

Do you need an independent tuner on all 5 TV's? You might be able to "distribute" a signal from 1 box to several TV's

 

[chargerrich]

Sorry they couldn't get you what you needed, though the responses in here seem to offer good advice to get you situated.

That said, I have no problem an operator wondering why you need 5 HD signals. You talk as if we all have that many HD tv's in the house. I don't envy your Sat bill, though am sure you probably can afford it easily.

This does beg the question, how many HD signals can one dish offer?

Perhaps this is where Dish and I got "off the rails".

Maybe that is unreasonable to some, it just seems to me that in 2010 when you barely even find a non HD set anymore that having 5 TVs you want in HD (we actually have 7 rooms with HD TVs) is quickly becoming common place with each passing day.

5 HD signals may sound like a lot, but in a 5000 square foot home, it really is not from my perspective.

 

[riffjim4069]

Excellent objective post. Without getting into picture quality, Dish service may be reasonably priced for customers requiring one or two TVs. However, as the OP pointed out, it is not such as bargain, and often more expensive, for customers who require multiple receivers and/or DVRs. I still have my purchased 622s sitting in a closet. Even if we were to move from our FiOS area, Dish would not be a likely candidate because of their policy to charge $17 per owned DVR....after paying $1200+ to purchase them.

 

[chargerrich]

Do you need an independent tuner on all 5 TV's? You might be able to "distribute" a signal from 1 box to several TV's

That is what the DUO box that I have does (2 HD signals and 2 SD signals) but there are severe limitations.

1. Secondary signal on each DUO is SD (480i)

2. Even if you wired the units (which would be a pain and expense close to cost of the HD receiver) you CANNOT split an HDMI signal.

3. The more severe problem than the 3 unit limitation by Dish is the fact that even if you agree to fork over $200-600 EACH for new HD DVRs, Dish still demands that you pay them the $17 a month service fee EACH just to use them. How is that fair? No discount from the lease fee? $85 a month is JUST service fees equates to OVER $1000 a year just for the right to use the equipment you were FORCED to purchase because Dish will not provide any other option for you.

Thats just myopic in my opinion...

 

[JayStil]

Was it you or the CSR that was fixated on your additional receivers being 922's? As has been said you could get out of it much cheaper with 211's. Also, if you don't need all 5 HD's going at once, both HDMI and component outputs are "hot" at the same time. You could feed 2 HD's an HD signal from one receiver as long as you didn't need different channels at the same time.

And if I understand your post, you've already cancelled? Not much "help" we can offer you if that's the case.

 

[Juan]

That is what the DUO box that I have does (2 HD signals and 2 SD signals) but there are severe limitations.

1. Secondary signal on each DUO is SD (480i)

2. Even if you wired the units (which would be a pain and expense close to cost of the HD receiver) you CANNOT split an HDMI signal.

3. The more severe problem than the 3 unit limitation by Dish is the fact that even if you agree to fork over $200-600 EACH for new HD DVRs, Dish still demands that you pay them the $17 a month service fee EACH just to use them. How is that fair? No discount from the lease fee? $85 a month is JUST service fees equates to OVER $1000 a year just for the right to use the equipment you were FORCED to purchase because Dish will not provide any other option for you.

Thats just myopic in my opinion...

I have seen it done. Its not split but "repeated"..You can change the channel with UHF remote from any room in the house however the same channel would show up on all TV's . The HDMI can be extended and You can use "component" on the other TV [ame="http://www.amazon.com/Gefen-EXT-HDMI-141-HDmi-Repeater/dp/B000BNY11K"]Amazon.com: HDmi Repeater: Electronics@@AMEPARAM@@http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/41CZ3MMEVKL.@@AMEPARAM@@41CZ3MMEVKL[/ame]

here is a splitter

[ame="http://www.amazon.com/Powered-Splitter-Certified-Bandwidth-10-2Gbps/dp/B002673EW6/ref=dp_cp_ob_e_title_2"]Amazon.com: ViewHD 2 Port HDMI 1x2 Powered Splitter Ver 1.3 Certified for Full?@@AMEPARAM@@http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/41ehH0GScqL.@@AMEPARAM@@41ehH0GScqL[/ame]

 

[chargerrich]

Was it you or the CSR that was fixated on your additional receivers being 922's?

I was not aware of the 922's (but they sounded nice)! I am sure the CSR gets a bonus or something to incent me that way, but needing three would be a lot of out of pocket money ($1200-2000) for something that I apparently would not own or could not use if I left Dish.

And if I understand your post, you've already cancelled? Not much "help" we can offer you if that's the case

I have a pending cancellation scheduled yes, I was hoping it would not come to that, but I was really backed into a corner. I still am amazed that they would not even make a token attempt to offer a discount or some trivial service that would be little or no cost to them in order to keep my $1400 a year (or a lot more if they had convinced me into some upsell but palatable arrangement to accommodate my need).

 

[Yespage]

Perhaps this is where Dish and I got "off the rails".

Maybe that is unreasonable to some, it just seems to me that in 2010 when you barely even find a non HD set anymore that having 5 TVs you want in HD (we actually have 7 rooms with HD TVs) is quickly becoming common place with each passing day.

Not as much "unreasonable" as is possibly "unusual".

5 HD signals may sound like a lot, but in a 5000 square foot home, it really is not from my perspective.

I'd agree to a point. If I had a huge home, I'd probably have one or two serious setups and number of smaller setups where standard digital would be acceptable. You kind of backed yourself into a corner with so many large media screens.

I was a little surprised they'd bring up the 922, pretty high up standard for having so many in the home! The best of luck though for making it all work.

Excellent objective post. Without getting into picture quality, Dish service may be reasonably priced for customers requiring one or two TVs. However, as the OP pointed out, it is not such as bargain, and often more expensive, for customers who require multiple receivers and/or DVRs. I still have my purchased 622s sitting in a closet. Even if we were to move from our FiOS area, Dish would not be a likely candidate because of their policy to charge $17 per owned DVR....after paying $1200+ to purchase them.

I just can't wrap my brain around the $17 a month for owning the receiver. One of the reasons I went back to Directv after skipping tv for a year was because I owned the receiver (not a DVR), and could just switch it back on. $17 a month would really make me think otherwise.

 

[Scherrman]

If you want HD on all your HD TVs the best thing to do is lease one 722 and two 211 receivers and purchase more 211's for the rest of the TVs that you need. You will have to pay $7 for every extra 211 on your account. The first receiver is included in your programming.

 

[Laddyboy]

That is what the DUO box that I have does (2 HD signals and 2 SD signals) but there are severe limitations.

1. Secondary signal on each DUO is SD (480i)

2. Even if you wired the units (which would be a pain and expense close to cost of the HD receiver) you CANNOT split an HDMI signal.

3. The more severe problem than the 3 unit limitation by Dish is the fact that even if you agree to fork over $200-600 EACH for new HD DVRs, Dish still demands that you pay them the $17 a month service fee EACH just to use them. How is that fair? No discount from the lease fee? $85 a month is JUST service fees equates to OVER $1000 a year just for the right to use the equipment you were FORCED to purchase because Dish will not provide any other option for you.

Thats just myopic in my opinion...

Component and HDMI is active at the same time so more than one TV can get a distributed HD signal from one HD receiver. Also HDMI can indeed be split and used with an amplified splitter. Unless you would need 5 independent HD signals simultaneously, you could get by with less than 5 receivers with wired remotes or the provided UHF remotes. As has been noted above, for $500 you could purchase 5 200ks online. You would pay $28 per month for 4 additional receivers past the first. Also noted above, they can be turned into DVRs by adding an external HDD and paying a one-time enabling fee. If you wanted to keep what you already have, lease one 211k from E* and purchase two additional online. There are several possibilities. CSRs are technologically clueless and working off script.

 

[Paradox-SJ]

If you want HD on all your HD TVs the best thing to do is lease one 722 and two 211 receivers and purchase more 211's for the rest of the TVs that you need. You will have to pay $7 for every extra 211 on your account. The first receiver is included in your programming.

+1 this is the best and least expensive monthly solution.(28.00 a month in rcver fees)

 

[SouthRider]

I have to agree with the poster. I am not rich by any means - but we now have a 50" TV in the living room and three 32" sets in other rooms (2 are store brands).

So we have a 722K in the living room, 622 in the bedroom, but are forced to watch an SD signal on an HDTV through the TV2 output in the exercise room or our home office.

SD was just never meant to be viewed upconverted to an HDTV, it is pitiful at best.

I too am amazed that DISH has not been at the forefront of some type of centralized box that offers multiple tuners, multiple hard drives, and distributable HD so that each room can watch anything it wants live or by DVR.

It could be done as simply or elaborately as the customer needs by creating a system that lets the tech add tuners or drives as each customers situation calls for. Basically an HTPC with many bays for tuners & drives.

Distribution could be through ethernet or wireless with sling technology.

Chargerrich - if you can hang in there - DISH is supposed to be releasing a sling device for the 922 that distributes Hd to multiple rooms sometime this summer or fall. I don't know if it will allow you to view different streams in different rooms.

I am eagerly awaiting more info myself.....

 

[dangue]

Indeed... I was actually shocked by this.

I actually had one of the many CSR's I spoke to mention Ebay or Craigslist and thought that might be an option, but then she added that I would have to pay $17 x 3 service fee monthly for my own boxes!

So I already pay $34 a month for the DVRs I am leasing and if I go out and BUY my own DVRs or Receivers I have to pay $51 more dollars just to use them with Dish! Thats $85 in service fees for equipment that is mine! :rant:

I have to reject that simply on principle! Especially when Directv will let me use any equipment leased or bought for $5/month (per unit). That is at least reasonable.

With two boxes, you should only be paying for the second receiver. Your 722 is included as part of your package price, so you shouldn't be paying anywhere near $34 in equipment fees.

Also, my understanding was that the limit was on the number of leased tuners, not receivers. I was under the impression that you could lease up to six single tuner boxes or three dual tuner boxes. That being said, you'd still have to pay up front for extra boxes to lease so it might make more sense to just buy them anyway.

 

[mike123abc]

The 922 was supposed to be the box that fed 2 TVs at the same time in HD. They have botched the launch, and then imposed rediculous receiver fees. It turned a great idea into a failure. They still do not have the catcher (2nd TV box) out yet, and now it looks delayed until the end of the year.

When the 922 was first shown it had 3TV outs HD, SD hardwired and IP HD Sling. And the receiver fee was $7. So, you could do 2 HDTVs and 1 SD set for $7. What finally managed to get released after a long delay was 1 TV HD and clunky internet remote viewing that has to go through Dish's web site instead of connecting direct like other sling boxes and long delay on second TV box.

Dish is now way behind in multi TV viewing. They are essentially at cable system type levels now. They do not even have a way to share recordings unless you copy to an USB drive and carry it to another room. That does not even work yet on the 922.

 

[Bogy]

Last summer when we subscribed to Dish we ran into a similar "why would anyone need..." situation. In our case it wasn't all hd's, but just the number of tv's. When I added them up, we had 8 tv's in the house. Family room, 2 offices, kitchen, workout room, rec room, and 2 bedrooms. Maybe not typical, and not all hd, but it's what we have, and we live in an area where you can't just get by with rabbit ears, you can barely get by with a roof top antenna. I was able to "double up" on some runs, but finally figured I could do it with 3 dual tuner boxes, which the Dish rep agreed to. When the installer came he had 2 boxes. After some phone calls they agreed to give me the 3rd box that had been agreed to (this was when they were still only allowing 2 boxes.) I'm waiting for the TV Everywhere to be released because since then 3 of the sd TVs have been swapped for hd. I have just over a year left on the 2 year commitment, and at that time we'll see what is available for multi-room viewing from the various providers and see what looks good.