HDCP is now ON, if you have a non-HDCP compliant HDTV change to COMPONENT

[andrzej]

If you have a LCD, DLP, or plasma, DVI can offer a noticeably better picture than component. How much better will depend on the particular display model. If you have a traditional CRT-based television (like Lem52's Mitsubishi), DVI offers minimal to no improvement over component.

The benefit of DVI for digital sets (like LCD, DLPs, and plasmas) is that the signal can be kept entirely in the digital domain, without any analog conversion, direct from set-top box to the display. With CRT televisions, the digital signal must be converted to analog for display, so there will always be some D/A conversion taking place; with component, the conversion is done by the box, while with DVI, the conversion is done by the television.

Ken,
this "all digital pathway" argument is theoretically correct but in practice the results vary because there is more to PQ than just digital vs analog. Some people with plasmas report (see AVSForum) no difference between DVI and component (especially on ED displays) some report minor improvement with DVI.

 

[Lucky]

Doesn't this simply mean that if we do not have a HDCP compliant device we can just simply use component input ?

 

[andrzej]

Doesn't this simply mean that if we do not have a HDCP compliant device we can just simply use component input ?

Yes. You can use component for any signal including 720p and 1080i.

 

[Mr. Biggles]

Doesn't this simply mean that if we do not have a HDCP compliant device we can just simply use component input ?

For now yes.

HDCP is supposed to protect content providers from unauthorized copying of their programming. HDCP enabled DVI/HDMI will do this and why it's implemented.

As time go's on V*, D* and E* will be forced to limit 720p and 1080i to these protected connections (DVI & HDMI) as dictated by their content providers and force down rez'ing of the various other connections. (component, S-vid, composite).

It's not a pretty picture, but it's going to happen.


Bill

 

[Lucky]

For now yes.

HDCP is supposed to protect content providers from unauthorized copying of their programming. HDCP enabled DVI/HDMI will do this and why it's implemented.

As time go's on V*, D* and E* will be forced to limit 720p and 1080i to these protected connections (DVI & HDMI) as dictated by their content providers and force down rez'ing of the various other connections. (component, S-vid, composite).

It's not a pretty picture, but it's going to happen.


Bill

Do you have any time frame as to when this down rezzing will be required ? Just curious. One my TV's has DVI and one does not.

 

[Dan Berndt]

Has anyone tried to see if the audio is coming through now on the DVI/HDMI?

 

[Mr. Biggles]

Do you have any time frame as to when this down rezzing will be required ? Just curious. One my TV's has DVI and one does not.

Have no idea Lucky.

I'm sure your aware as others are that the new breed of DVI/HDMI DVD players by major manufactures only allow 720p/1080i over there HDCP connections. 480i/p over component.

Of course there are a few DVD players like the Momitsu and Bravo that ignore that scenario and why people clamor to buy them. How long they can get away with it is anybodys guess.

You won't be totally out of luck, because there are outboard scalers which will deinterlace and process 480i to 720p/1080i. I use one for my SDI modded Panasonic RP91 DVD player now thru my HTPC.

I wouldn't worry/panic about it yet.

Bill

 

[Lucky]

Have no idea Lucky.

I'm sure your aware as others are that the new breed of DVI/HDMI DVD players by major manufactures only allow 720p/1080i over there HDCP connections. 480i/p over component.

Of course there are a few DVD players like the Momitsu and Bravo that ignore that scenario and why people clamor to buy them. How long they can get away with it is anybodys guess.

You won't be totally out of luck, because there are outboard scalers which will deinterlace and process 480i to 720p/1080i. I use one for my SDI modded Panasonic RP91 DVD player now thru my HTPC.

I wouldn't worry/panic about it yet.

Bill

Thanks for the informative information, Bill.

 

[madpoet]

To be fair Bill, the downrezzing you're talking about has NOT been passed into law. Right now it's just a concept, that may or may not happen. I don't think it will.

-MP

 

[traganoo]

I have a Sony 34XBR910 and today my DVI stopped working... I am using the component outputs to output to my Dell W1700 lcd tv.... The sony is supposedly hdcp friendly....what else could be going on? I was watching RUSH HD and in the middle of a program the picture went blank on the sony. I reset the receiver (held button in for 6 seconds) and still only get output to my lcd tv

 

[mike123abc]

To be fair Bill, the downrezzing you're talking about has NOT been passed into law. Right now it's just a concept, that may or may not happen. I don't think it will.

-MP

It may not become law, but there is nothing to stop a content provider from refusing to provide their content without downresing being enforced. The provider would of course have to balance the copy protection demand with possible lost customers that were upset by it.

 

[tattootearz]

......You won't be totally out of luck, because there are outboard scalers which will deinterlace and process 480i to 720p/1080i.....

Bill

Well that wont help one bit since only 480P will be going into the Scaler. To Upconvert will not give you true 1080i or 720p. You need to be able to get that directly format from the TV itself....

Upscaling 480p may improve picture quality...but it will NOT give you a true HD video signal.

 

[Mr. Biggles]

To be fair Bill, the downrezzing you're talking about has NOT been passed into law. Right now it's just a concept, that may or may not happen. I don't think it will.

Thats true. But it begs the question why V* has decided to go ahead and implement HDCP over it's DVI connection carte blanche' so soon and why they would/could leave the component ouput free to pass the protected HD signal if indeed they have been asked to not do so. Thats the part thats unanswered to me. Why cripple one connection and not the other.

I sure hope your right though and I'm just crying wolf.

Upscaling 480p may improve picture quality...but it will NOT give you a true HD video signal.

No argument on that comment at all.


Bill

 

[madpoet]

It's certainly not only Voom. The new HD Tivo has HDMI out, and I'd be amazed if they didn't turn on HDCP with it soon. HDCP is a current standard, fully supported by the FCC. Downrezzing component is not. Frankly, adding HDCP is not "crippling" DVI. There wasn't anything out there under about $10k that could copy from a DVI port anyway. Component, on the other hand, can be copied somewhat easily (although with only limited playback opportunity) through a WVHS VCR.

-MP

 

[Mr. Biggles]

It's certainly not only Voom. The new HD Tivo has HDMI out, and I'd be amazed if they didn't turn on HDCP with it soon. HDCP is a current standard, fully supported by the FCC. Downrezzing component is not. Frankly, adding HDCP is not "crippling" DVI. There wasn't anything out there under about $10k that could copy from a DVI port anyway. Component, on the other hand, can be copied somewhat easily (although with only limited playback opportunity) through a WVHS VCR.

-MP

Just thinking out loud here, but whats the point of protecting DVI/HDMI but not component. The whole point of HDCP as I understand it is controlling copying. Why tell me I can't record/view HD content from a DVI/HDMI connection unless the display device is HDCP compliant but it's OK to do so over component?

I do believe they have crippled DVI for the folks that have displays with DVI but not HDCP compliance. Granted in the future as all sets will have this standard implemented it will be come a non-issue.

I would love to hear a response from V* directly why they decided at this point to implement HDCP when their competetion has not.

Bill

 

[madpoet]

Because HDMI/DVI is a pure digital signal. Recording off the Component ports is analog. The quality is entirely different, and your ability to do fun things with it later are reduced without the digital source.

 

[truqui]

Just so I understand it...DVI now only works with displays that are HDCP compliant?
I believe that mine is as the specs state "MonitorLink™/DVI Input Secure HDCP digital connection that enables auto-configuration". Is this correct?

I have not experienced the short blackouts at all while watching extended periods last night like mentioned. Oh and yes I have the new software installed.

 

[madpoet]

Yes, you are correct. It only works with HDCP compliant DVI, which it sounds like you have.

 

[eschu97611]

Yes, you are correct. It only works with HDCP compliant DVI, which it sounds like you have.

I have a compliant display(Mitsu-65313) and noticed the blackouts last night-had to switch to components and put my D* HD box back on DVI-would much rather have V*on DVI since there is more programming to enjoy than D* HDTV. Wilt and the gang, please fix the bug so I can go back to the beauty of DVI on V*

 

[Mr. Biggles]

I have a compliant display(Mitsu-65313) and noticed the blackouts last night-had to switch to components

I doubt the two are related. Non-conformance should result in the message I recieved from the V* STB that I posted on the first message in this thread.

I'm guessing your 'black outs' (which I never have had ) is related to something else...what I don't know.

Bill