Old Westerns you see in HD that aren't on Blu-ray - Why?

[long_time_DNC]

Just out of curiosity, does anyone know how channels like the Sony Movie Channel or MGM HD, Retroplex and Indieplex have movies (mostly westerns that I'm talking about, but other movies too) in HD that I can't find anywhere on BD? It gets really irritating.

How do they get them, do their own transfers?

 

[zack]

Just out of curiosity, does anyone know how channels like the Sony Movie Channel or MGM HD, Retroplex and Indieplex have movies (mostly westerns that I'm talking about, but other movies too) in HD that I can't find anywhere on BD? It gets really irritating.

How do they get them, do their own transfers?

HD is new, HD is not possible for old material!

They may claim HD quality transmission for these channels, or movies, but the content is never better than the original source!

 

[navychop]

Well, the original source may be film, which can be better than HD. But they need to remaster. I suspect remastering for TV, with expected compression, is cheaper than meeting standards expected of Blu-ray.

Even if taped, extensive, time consuming remastering can "smooth the edges" and make a more presentable image. Some improvements may be made, but it ain't gonna be worth writing home about.

After all, a lot of old B&W footage has been rendered into color rather successfully.

 

[Pepper]

Zack's mistake is assuming the original source was TV.

Some old film sources are starting to show up as UHD transfers in fact. It is surprising what the actual resolution of 35mm or 70mm analog film can be.

I just got done watching "Gun Fury" from 1953. It's a new 3D Blu-Ray, limited edition of 3000 copies from TwilightTime. It is a really well done transfer from the original film stock. (bonus, it was a Rock Hudson movie Mrs Pepper had never heard of, so she was excited to see it).

 

[osu1991]

HD is new, HD is not possible for old material!

They may claim HD quality transmission for these channels, or movies, but the content is never better than the original source!

Wrong. They can remaster the source film which is of much higher quality than an HD broadcast, such as has been done with Hogan’s Heroes.

 

[KE4EST]

Exactly, 35mm film has roughly the same equivalent to a little better than 4K.

 

[long_time_DNC]

Being in the film digitizing business, I can tell you that even Super 8mm has nice resolution at 1280x720p. We've done a lot of that...my question is, why aren't these films available in the U.S. on BD? Found some of them on region B BD, but not in the U.S...

 

[Juan]

HD is new, HD is not possible for old material!

They may claim HD quality transmission for these channels, or movies, but the content is never better than the original source!

Bzzzz wrong...original film higher than hd

 

[Claude Greiner]

Kind of sucks that shows from the 1960’s on film can be remastered in HD, but stuff from the 1980’s on tape cannot.

I am glad however we are able to remaster a lot of old Tv shows in HD such as Hogan’s hero’s etc

 

[long_time_DNC]

The Rockford Files on BD looks quite good, that's true...

Some films, like The Tall T, Ride Lonesome, and Comanche Station would be nice to have on BD, even newer films like Open Range, still aren't available domestically on BD...

 

[jayn_j]

I expect the reason, like always, is either they aren't willing to pay for rights, or more likely, they don't see a market for this stuff.

My other hobby is collecting old movie paper. As time marches on, we tend to find that prices are highest for stuff about 30 years old. 80s movies are really hot now, with 90s stuff emerging. Old musicals and western posters are pretty much fish wrapping right now. You can't give them away. Naturally, there are exceptions, but most stuff from the genre is worthless. Even the best of the best tends to go for considerably less than it did 10 years ago.

 

[harshness]

I think a lot of the problem is that the movies weren't shot in widescreen and people expect wide screen when they buy HD. At the same time, there are the OAR purists that won't stand for 4:3 content that has been converted to widescreen. It is a lose-lose for the people doing the telecine.

As much as SMC replays stuff, you probably don't really need to buy it.

 

[long_time_DNC]

As a collector of classics, it's not so much a matter of needing the movies as wanting to add them to my collection. Sure, I have them stored on an external hdd, but those eventually fail. Found a website that sells them from region B, blu-ray, but not sure I trust that site...

 

[dfergie]

Open Range is available at Amazon Germany but... waiting for US release, maybe UHD someday...it would be awesome WM Dts-x or atmos.

 

[osu1991]

I've recorded several off MoviePlex and archived off tivo to my NAS. Hard drives do fail but with 16TB mirrored and backed up I hope to be safe from losing data. I use Plex for everything now as I've had to replace scratched discs in the past and it's just more convenient for everyone.

 

[zack]

Zack's mistake is assuming the original source was TV.

Some old film sources are starting to show up as UHD transfers in fact. It is surprising what the actual resolution of 35mm or 70mm analog film can be.

I just got done watching "Gun Fury" from 1953. It's a new 3D Blu-Ray, limited edition of 3000 copies from TwilightTime. It is a really well done transfer from the original film stock. (bonus, it was a Rock Hudson movie Mrs Pepper had never heard of, so she was excited to see it).

You are right. I did not think about those films made back then when I made my post!

 

[harshness]

Open Range is available at Amazon Germany but... waiting for US release, maybe UHD someday...it would be awesome WM Dts-x or atmos.

What does Open Range have to do with "Old Westerns" (aka oaters)?

What would be the point of trying to wring a 7.x or 9.x channel soundtrack out of something that was recorded in 5.1 or less (in this case, DD, DTS and SDDS)?

 

[dfergie]

Open Range was mentioned ...

 

[long_time_DNC]

What does Open Range have to do with "Old Westerns" (aka oaters)?

What would be the point of trying to wring a 7.x or 9.x channel soundtrack out of something that was recorded in 5.1 or less (in this case, DD, DTS and SDDS)?

I mentioned Open Range in post #10, as an example of westerns that are available in region B but not here in region A...

 

[harshness]

I mentioned Open Range in post #10, as an example of westerns that are available in region B but not here in region A...

Open Range (2003) is still making the rounds of the premium plexes.

I wouldn't worry about Open Range as it is surely worth the effort but there is certainly a question about whether many of the oaters are worth the effort. A lot of it will come down to whether or not there are any good prints left as many of them would be hard to justify doing a restoration on given the size of the market.

As far as what constitutes being worth doing, I think there have been only independent efforts at doing Gone With the Wind in 4K (not to be confused with UHD). I expect that mastering 4K to UHD is no walk in the park.