RE: [VOOM] Re: OTA reception
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L
lets_c_1
Guest
Original poster
[VOOM] Re: OTA reception
Well, Voom customer service called back, and yes, it's what I
figured - the OTA function only works if you are a current customer.
When I told them to temporarily turn off Voom as I was not going to
be at my house during the summer, they apparently turned off the Voom
programming, leaving the box functioning. Then for some unknown
reason, they decided to do a disconnect in December, which then
turned the box off and deleted my account.
Anyone who is getting Voom, I have a box to sell....
------------------------
Well, Voom customer service called back, and yes, it's what I
figured - the OTA function only works if you are a current customer.
When I told them to temporarily turn off Voom as I was not going to
be at my house during the summer, they apparently turned off the Voom
programming, leaving the box functioning. Then for some unknown
reason, they decided to do a disconnect in December, which then
turned the box off and deleted my account.
Anyone who is getting Voom, I have a box to sell....
------------------------
J
jnardone
Guest
Original poster
Hi:
Check the FCC regs regarding set top boxes that receive OTA signals.
They are pretty clear in that a box must receive all available signals
(meaning it can't exclude some channels) and I think that you should be
protected in that a third party (VOOM) can not block your OTA reception
to equipment that you purchased. One can also make the argument that
if VOOM is now failing to provide the program guide for the OTA
channels then they should modify the box to receive the program guide
information that is included for free along with the OTA signal from
each station as this a part of the signal.
This is not a minor issue as there are probably a couple of thousand
VOOM customers with purchased boxes that are entitled to receive their
OTA signals should VOOM cease operating.
--
jnardone
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This message was posted via http://www.satelliteguys.us by jnardone
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Check the FCC regs regarding set top boxes that receive OTA signals.
They are pretty clear in that a box must receive all available signals
(meaning it can't exclude some channels) and I think that you should be
protected in that a third party (VOOM) can not block your OTA reception
to equipment that you purchased. One can also make the argument that
if VOOM is now failing to provide the program guide for the OTA
channels then they should modify the box to receive the program guide
information that is included for free along with the OTA signal from
each station as this a part of the signal.
This is not a minor issue as there are probably a couple of thousand
VOOM customers with purchased boxes that are entitled to receive their
OTA signals should VOOM cease operating.
--
jnardone
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This message was posted via http://www.satelliteguys.us by jnardone
------------------------
J
jnardone
Guest
Original poster
[VOOM] Re: OTA reception
Hi Again:
The FCC reg is Section 15.117 regarding television receivers. Since
the VOOM box was sold as both a satellite receiver and a television
receiver it is subject to the regulations regarding television
receivers.
....The reference in this section to TV broadcast receivers also
includes devices, such as TV interface devices, that incorporate the
tuner portion of a TV broadcast receiver and that are equipped with an
antenna or antenna terminals that can be used for the off-the-air
reception of TV broadcast signals....
....TV broadcast receivers shall be capable of adequately receiving all
channels allocated by the Commission to the television broadcast
service......
....TV broadcast receivers are required to provide useable picture and
sound commensurate with their video and audio capabilities when
receiving digital
television signals..
--
jnardone
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This message was posted via http://www.satelliteguys.us by jnardone
------------------------
Hi Again:
The FCC reg is Section 15.117 regarding television receivers. Since
the VOOM box was sold as both a satellite receiver and a television
receiver it is subject to the regulations regarding television
receivers.
....The reference in this section to TV broadcast receivers also
includes devices, such as TV interface devices, that incorporate the
tuner portion of a TV broadcast receiver and that are equipped with an
antenna or antenna terminals that can be used for the off-the-air
reception of TV broadcast signals....
....TV broadcast receivers shall be capable of adequately receiving all
channels allocated by the Commission to the television broadcast
service......
....TV broadcast receivers are required to provide useable picture and
sound commensurate with their video and audio capabilities when
receiving digital
television signals..
--
jnardone
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This message was posted via http://www.satelliteguys.us by jnardone
------------------------
J
jnardone
Guest
Original poster
I really don't see how you are getting that from the regs I quoted.
VOOM provides a service but they also sell equipment and that equipment
has requirements under the fcc rules. Why? - because the Voom box is TV
broadcast receiver (in addition to being a satellite signal receiver)
and all TV broadcast receivers (as defined in the regs) sold in the US
have the requirements listed in the regs. If you doubt me call the FCC
and ask. I called today and they explained the rule to me exactly as I
have explained it in my messages.
--
jnardone
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This message was posted via http://www.satelliteguys.us by jnardone
------------------------
VOOM provides a service but they also sell equipment and that equipment
has requirements under the fcc rules. Why? - because the Voom box is TV
broadcast receiver (in addition to being a satellite signal receiver)
and all TV broadcast receivers (as defined in the regs) sold in the US
have the requirements listed in the regs. If you doubt me call the FCC
and ask. I called today and they explained the rule to me exactly as I
have explained it in my messages.
--
jnardone
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This message was posted via http://www.satelliteguys.us by jnardone
------------------------
J
jnardone
Guest
Original poster
Satellite may be different but if the box has a OTA TV broadcast
receiver function then the box has to meet certain requirements - such
as being able to display all available channels, etc...
It comes down to this - VOOM can not charge you a monthly fee to
receive broadcast signals which the government says must be free. Once
you purchase the Voom box you do not have to pay extra for the OTA
reception.
--
jnardone
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This message was posted via http://www.satelliteguys.us by jnardone
------------------------
receiver function then the box has to meet certain requirements - such
as being able to display all available channels, etc...
It comes down to this - VOOM can not charge you a monthly fee to
receive broadcast signals which the government says must be free. Once
you purchase the Voom box you do not have to pay extra for the OTA
reception.
--
jnardone
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This message was posted via http://www.satelliteguys.us by jnardone
------------------------
J
jnardone
Guest
Original poster
They said that if a company sells a piece of equipment that acts as a TV
Broadcast receiver as one of its functions then that receiver is
required to display the TV broadcast signal if the signal is available.
The equipment manufacturer doesn't have to supply the signal but if
the equipment hooks to an antenna and signals are received then all the
signals received must be displayed. There are other requirements - such
that it must be able to receive both VHF and UHF signals, that it can
not exclude channels, and a few other things that don't matter to
VOOM.
The purpose of the regulations is to prevent an equipment manufacturer
from being able to control the reception of the public airwaves -
Imagine a case where Sony didn't like something that CBS news said so
they started selling TV's that would not receive CBS channels.
VOOM is trying to do something just a bad - you either always subscribe
to their satellite service or they block you ability to receive public
broadcasts.
My understanding of the Dish receivers it that your are able to receive
OTA broadcasts without subscribing as long as you modify some of the
settings in the setup menu.
--
jnardone
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This message was posted via http://www.satelliteguys.us by jnardone
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Broadcast receiver as one of its functions then that receiver is
required to display the TV broadcast signal if the signal is available.
The equipment manufacturer doesn't have to supply the signal but if
the equipment hooks to an antenna and signals are received then all the
signals received must be displayed. There are other requirements - such
that it must be able to receive both VHF and UHF signals, that it can
not exclude channels, and a few other things that don't matter to
VOOM.
The purpose of the regulations is to prevent an equipment manufacturer
from being able to control the reception of the public airwaves -
Imagine a case where Sony didn't like something that CBS news said so
they started selling TV's that would not receive CBS channels.
VOOM is trying to do something just a bad - you either always subscribe
to their satellite service or they block you ability to receive public
broadcasts.
My understanding of the Dish receivers it that your are able to receive
OTA broadcasts without subscribing as long as you modify some of the
settings in the setup menu.
--
jnardone
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This message was posted via http://www.satelliteguys.us by jnardone
------------------------
J
jnardone
Guest
Original poster
Eric Wrote:
> But that is a Voom box for Voom Service. Yes you purchased the
> hardware.
> You canceled Voom service so that part of the service is also
> canceled/removed. It was/is an OTA receiver with the VOOM service. NO
> Voom
> = No OTA reception on the VOOM receiver
>
> Eric
>
> That is exactly the point - VOOM can not, by FCC rules, make you pay
> for OTA service. TV broadcasts on the VHF and UHF channels must be
> free once you buy a device that is a TV broadcast receiver. VOOM had
> to have known this when they started selling boxes that act as TV
> broadcast receivers and now they are using their ability to bloch
> reception of OTA broadcasts to keep people from cancelling their
> satellite service.
--
jnardone
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This message was posted via http://www.satelliteguys.us by jnardone
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> But that is a Voom box for Voom Service. Yes you purchased the
> hardware.
> You canceled Voom service so that part of the service is also
> canceled/removed. It was/is an OTA receiver with the VOOM service. NO
> Voom
> = No OTA reception on the VOOM receiver
>
> Eric
>
> That is exactly the point - VOOM can not, by FCC rules, make you pay
> for OTA service. TV broadcasts on the VHF and UHF channels must be
> free once you buy a device that is a TV broadcast receiver. VOOM had
> to have known this when they started selling boxes that act as TV
> broadcast receivers and now they are using their ability to bloch
> reception of OTA broadcasts to keep people from cancelling their
> satellite service.
--
jnardone
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This message was posted via http://www.satelliteguys.us by jnardone
------------------------
J
jnardone
Guest
Original poster
I don't understand your argument at all. VOOM sold the box as a
combinatinon satellite and TV broadcast receiver - they did not call it
"satellite receiver with free TV broadcast receiver capability" or any
such thing. Even if they had it still meets the specific definition in
the rules specifically:
"The reference in this section to TV broadcast receivers also includes
devices, such as TV interface devices, that incorporate the tuner
portion of a TV broadcast receiver and that are equipped with an
antenna or antenna terminals that can be used for the off-the-air
reception of TV broadcast signals"
You can continue to disagree with me since you appear to want to but I
did call the FCC and I did speak with someone familiar with the OTA
capability of satellite boxes - both Dish's and VOOM's and they did say
that VOOM can not turn off your ability to receive OTA broadcasts on a
box that you own.
--
jnardone
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This message was posted via http://www.satelliteguys.us by jnardone
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combinatinon satellite and TV broadcast receiver - they did not call it
"satellite receiver with free TV broadcast receiver capability" or any
such thing. Even if they had it still meets the specific definition in
the rules specifically:
"The reference in this section to TV broadcast receivers also includes
devices, such as TV interface devices, that incorporate the tuner
portion of a TV broadcast receiver and that are equipped with an
antenna or antenna terminals that can be used for the off-the-air
reception of TV broadcast signals"
You can continue to disagree with me since you appear to want to but I
did call the FCC and I did speak with someone familiar with the OTA
capability of satellite boxes - both Dish's and VOOM's and they did say
that VOOM can not turn off your ability to receive OTA broadcasts on a
box that you own.
--
jnardone
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This message was posted via http://www.satelliteguys.us by jnardone
------------------------
J
jnardone
Guest
Original poster
If you purchased the box from VOOM then I think they would have to.
--
jnardone
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This message was posted via http://www.satelliteguys.us by jnardone
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--
jnardone
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This message was posted via http://www.satelliteguys.us by jnardone
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J
jnardone
Guest
Original poster
Re: [VOOM] OTA reception
thegrod Wrote:
> Well the FCC has enforcement and penalty powers. Did they indicate any
>
> interest in pursuing the matter with VOOM?
>
> Due to the small number of customers involved - no
>
> One would hope that VOOM would comply on their own now that there
> oversight has been noticed.
--
jnardone
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This message was posted via http://www.satelliteguys.us by jnardone
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thegrod Wrote:
> Well the FCC has enforcement and penalty powers. Did they indicate any
>
> interest in pursuing the matter with VOOM?
>
> Due to the small number of customers involved - no
>
> One would hope that VOOM would comply on their own now that there
> oversight has been noticed.
--
jnardone
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This message was posted via http://www.satelliteguys.us by jnardone
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B
bradley
Guest
Original poster
Re: [VOOM] OTA reception
see: http://tinyurl.com/5wx97
--
bradley
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This message was posted via http://www.satelliteguys.us by bradley
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see: http://tinyurl.com/5wx97
--
bradley
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This message was posted via http://www.satelliteguys.us by bradley
------------------------
