The 1.2 from SatelliteAV is finally up and running

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DishDigger

SatelliteGuys Pro
Original poster
Jul 27, 2008
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2
Well, I spent just about the whole day getting the new 1.2 and the CK-1 LNB working:). After getting frustrated with not being able to find settings in the CS6000 that were mentioned in the documentation I have, I was finally able to punch around through the menus and get the things working. Do Microsoft “help file” writers do receiver manuals on the side :confused:? I guess I'm dense, but I find very little help in some of the manuals that are published these days.


Anyway, I was finally able to get about five satellites scanned in and then went through and deleted, or skipped channels I didn't want or were scrambled. I'll have to post later what seems to be coming in, I ran out of daylight about the time I got finished. In fact, you can tell by the quick photos I made that it was starting to get dark. It's threatening rain too (plenty of thunder & lightning), so I didn't risk getting on the roof to get better photos. I'll make some if requested.


I had fits finding a signal until I decided to sit down and carefully go through the mathematics involved in all the angles of the mounting brackets and motor shafts. I made the calculations and recorded what I came up with, keeping in mind that I've read many times that the scales embossed on the brackets were hardly ever correct and usually 4 to 7 degrees off. Well, after taking my time and looking at all the info I could find with all this stuff, I set the receiver for 91W C-band and went out and carefully set the angles on the mounting hardware as close as I could to what I had calculated. Sounded like a good place to start, right ;)? Since it was threatening rain, I had left the TV and receiver in the house figuring I had all day and would spend it walking back and forth, if necessary. When I went in and looked at the screen, I had green bars to about 93% on the signal and 83% quality :eek:!! I scanned the sat to see what it would do and things looked real good :up.


Now the real frustration set in. I could get the motor to go to 91W if I manually moved it away and then told it to go back, but it wouldn't go to anything else! I couldn't find ANYWHERE to set my coords in the receiver :mad:. The menu choices shown in the documents I have did NOT exist in the receiver. I then tried to set 123W in the same manner as I did the 91W, but that didn't help getting the dish to move. I ended up moving the dish manually to 123W while watching the signal and quality bars on the screen (by later taking the TV and receiver outside – rain threat gone at the time). When I got a good quality reading, I played with the “fine-tune” motor adjustments until I got the best quality and then instructed a calibration at that point. I was able to find three more satellites after that by entering them into the receiver and telling the motor to “go to “ :eureka. This may not be the best way, but it worked. I still don't know exactly what I did, but got it done. I may try to add more later, but will wait for better weather and sufficient time!


Thanks for all the help along the way. Some of the help was from others asking questions, but it was help all the same.



#490 Looking toward the SW from the ground. The LNB is facing slightly upward and water collects in the rings on the scalar - something for later....
#491 Looking at the LNB from the ground.
#492 Taken from the side, looking toward the west. The quality is kind of low with the zoom, sorry about that. I have the resolution set to normal, it would have helped to set it higher, I guess. Light was getting marginal too, but I wanted to get the photos out.

Bill
 

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Thanks for sharing with us. Someone needs to weigh in about your CS menu and where to set the long and lats. When you get the motor working with your receiver properly - I would like to hear how well it handles the dish.
Bob
 
Setting the latitude and longitude coordinates in the menus is quite easy. But, you have to select USALS as the motor positioning control.

Follow this menu tree for a Coolsat 4K, 5K or 6K receiver...

MENU > INSTALLATION > MOTORIZED SETTING > DiSEqC MOTOR and then drop down to the line "ANTENNA POSITION". This line won't be displayed if you have the motor option set to 1.2 or OFF. It is only shown to you if you have USALS selected.

Other FTA receivers will probably route you through some different menu steps to get here, but it won't be a whole lot different. I am sure that you can find your way to navigate to the appropriate area without a great deal of trouble.

RADAR
 
Wescopc, I don't get a lot of time to play with the system except maybe on weekends. The wife gets most of the use out of it, but I'm impressed with the way the motor handles the dish. This particular dish is supposed to weigh about 27 pounds, as best as I remember. This is well within the limits of the DG380 (rated for 31 pounds). I was fascinated watching the thing point the dish and "suddenly" stopping when the signal peaked. It was as if the thing was watching the quality meter :eek:! I'll know after it has been moved a few times if it seems to hold okay. It was difficult to get the clamp to grip the motor. The clamp is rated for a minimum 60mm shaft and the motor is 55mm, but I think it tightened down sufficiently, although a high wind might make it shift (reminding me I need to get out there and mark the position so that I can find it agagin easily should a shift occur :rolleyes:). SatelliteAV (Brian) suggested a piece of adhesive-backed sandpaper between the shaft and clamp to create extra grip - an excellent idea, but I didn't get around to doing that -- may pay for that later :confused:??

AcWxRadar, Thanks!! That answered a LOT about the dilema I seemed to have gotten myself into with the CoolSat. I guess I should have read that into the instructions, but was an oversight on my part, though wasn't pointed out very well on "their" part :o. I went with the 1.2 setting instead of the USALS mainly because of a posting from Iceberg where he stated he never used USALS, but always went with the DiSEqC 1.2. I figured if it's good enough for the Guru, it should be good enough for me to begin with, right :D? Anyway, probably not a lot of difference other than preference. Both seem to point the dish - ha :up.

Thanks much for the feedback, guys. I'll get in to trying some more things with it later, like scanning in a few other satellites, etc. I did get to see one of the feeds that I read so much about. At first I couldn't figure out why everyone was just sitting around and occasionally making a comment to each other and then it hit me that it was a live broadcast from Iraq and they were waiting for their que to start the broadcast. Interesting :cool:!

Bill
 
Wescopc, I don't get a lot of time to play with the system except maybe on weekends. The wife gets most of the use out of it, but I'm impressed with the way the motor handles the dish. This particular dish is supposed to weigh about 27 pounds, as best as I remember. This is well within the limits of the DG380 (rated for 31 pounds). I was fascinated watching the thing point the dish and "suddenly" stopping when the signal peaked. It was as if the thing was watching the quality meter :eek:! I'll know after it has been moved a few times if it seems to hold okay. It was difficult to get the clamp to grip the motor. The clamp is rated for a minimum 60mm shaft and the motor is 55mm, but I think it tightened down sufficiently, although a high wind might make it shift (reminding me I need to get out there and mark the position so that I can find it agagin easily should a shift occur :rolleyes:). SatelliteAV (Brian) suggested a piece of adhesive-backed sandpaper between the shaft and clamp to create extra grip - an excellent idea, but I didn't get around to doing that -- may pay for that later :confused:??

AcWxRadar, Thanks!! That answered a LOT about the dilema I seemed to have gotten myself into with the CoolSat. I guess I should have read that into the instructions, but was an oversight on my part, though wasn't pointed out very well on "their" part :o. I went with the 1.2 setting instead of the USALS mainly because of a posting from Iceberg where he stated he never used USALS, but always went with the DiSEqC 1.2. I figured if it's good enough for the Guru, it should be good enough for me to begin with, right :D? Anyway, probably not a lot of difference other than preference. Both seem to point the dish - ha :up.

Thanks much for the feedback, guys. I'll get in to trying some more things with it later, like scanning in a few other satellites, etc. I did get to see one of the feeds that I read so much about. At first I couldn't figure out why everyone was just sitting around and occasionally making a comment to each other and then it hit me that it was a live broadcast from Iraq and they were waiting for their que to start the broadcast. Interesting :cool:!

Bill

Digger,

The Coolsat 4K, 5K and 6K receivers are very well suited and versatile when it comes to FTA and USALS functions. I have tested several different makes and models in the past few years and The early model Coolsat receivers and the Fortec Star receivers are the very best in my personal opinion.

I have only been using the USALS motor positioning with these receivers and I guarantee that these models are accurate in this regard.

I have questioned two or three channels over the past year or two, but I find that this problem is probably due to interference from a nearby channel or transponder and not that my dish is out of alignment.

Iceberg may simply be used to using DiSEqC 1.2 motor positioning through past experience with other receivers and that is just what he has adopted as he trusts the results. I developed my trust with the USALS functions of the Coolsat 5000 receiver and I can vouch for this receiver's operation with USALS. So that is what I have personally grown accustomed to.

You may use either style of motor positioning, but I think you will appreciate USALS better.

There are limitations with USALS, however. You will have to read the other posts in recent times to learn about this, but they are not too critical.

I recently purchased a Fortec Star Dynamic receiver and I can also claim that it is spot on with USALS. I would assume that their other models are just as accurate.

I think very highly of the early Coolsat models and all of the Fortec Star models.

I have used the SG-2100 motors and the DG-280B and DG-380 motors with these receivers and they are all equally accurate.

Using DiSEqC 1.2 motor positioning can sometimes be an aid when the USALS runs over its limitations. I am at 96.4 W longitude and if I wish to drive the motor to Hispasat @ 30.0 W it won't go there. I have to use DiSEqC 1.2 and manually step to this sat.

Thought you would like to know.

RADAR
 
2 main reasons I use Diseqc 1.2 versus USALS
-I have a DBS LNB offset 5 degrees for the 1/2 dozen free KU channels out there
-my first receiver with a motor (Satworks 3688) only had Diseqc 1.2 so when I switched to a Pansat 1500 I kept using Diseqc 1.2

I've tried USALS on numerous receivers and didnt like how sometimes the motor would stop a shade shy of the actual spot
 
ACWxRadar, Thanks again for the information. I hope I didn't come across as criticizing USALS, I know NOTHING of either USALS or DiSEqC 1.2. I've been reading in the forum for some time now and still consider myself a Noobe. The information you provided is great and I appreciate it beyond belief. In fact, I'll bet there are several readers that were wanting the same info.

We'll all get there, I'm impressed with your knowledge and ability to convey it to others, as I am with MANY others on this forum. Keep up the good work.

I've heard about the CoolSat receivers and I'm proud to have "landed" one -- no regrets there.

Iceberg (another impressive voice on the forum), thanks for your input, too. I can tell that a lot of FTA'ers would not have gotten as far, or even succeeded if not for you. I value all opinions here, that's why I quit searching when I started reading this forum.

Now, back to trying to figure out what I'm doing -- thanks folks.....:)
 
dishdig you put a bug in my ear with this thread, and I now have solved an aiming problem I've had for a couple of months. After installing a DG380 motor I noticed on the western sats that the H transponders seemed to have about 10-20pts higher signal and quality than the others, and learned I could adjust the sat's location in USALS ! 125KU became 125.7, signal increased noticeably (proving my dish wasn't aimed far enough west). today I ever so slightly twisted dish/motor on the pole, the width of a #2pencil mark & now all the sats are better!
 
Iceberg (another impressive voice on the forum), thanks for your input, too. I can tell that a lot of FTA'ers would not have gotten as far, or even succeeded if not for you. I value all opinions here, that's why I quit searching when I started reading this forum.

Digger,

You have really nailed it down! I have been a member of this forum since ??? well, for a long time now. I learned a great deal from the senior members here. I won't try to mention them all by name as we all know who they are and I would hate to leave anyone out of the mix. But, our friend "Iceberg" does deserve a great deal of credit.

These guys and gals have provided me with so much information that I really have a hard time determining how to repay them.

The best that I can do, I think, is to forward the information that I have learned from them to others.

By trying to increase my own knowledge and helping other members with questions, I think that I am giving thanks to those who helped me. I still have a great deal to learn, but I have learned a great deal from these guys and gals so far.

My thanks to all members, the staff and administrators of this site! You may not realize how much you are appreciated. But, just from me... I want to say that you are all appreciated very much!

Gordy (RADAR)
 
Thanks for the share DishDigger!
Great numbers on 91W! Glad to see you got the project done!

I think I am also going to start using Diseqc 1.2 over USALS; my SG2100 is starting to give me fits on USALS! Sometimes always wants to go to “0” when I want to go my farthest east 30W!

Been doing that for sometime now and I think the Diseqc 1.2 setting will cure that headache!

Anyways, glad to see it up and working for you!

Nice pictures as well! :up

K E V I N
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Digger,

So you are getting ok C-band signals with the 1.2 and the lnbf you have?

I am torn right now between a stationary 6 footer like scott is getting or taking advantage of the free shipping from sadoun on a 1.2 and doing another motorized setup.

I know the 1.2 isn't ideal, but 6 foot is about the limit I can do in my back yard right now (WAF etc) but I would like to have motorized 1.2 over my current 90cm.
 
Excellent findings and use of Usuals and DiseqC 1.2 commands. Good Job Digger!!:up
 
WOW!!, Great replies, thanks guys.

Turbo, I'm glad that you (and others) got something out of this. If I don't get anything (which is NOT the case),my hopes is that at least one more (and rather it be MANY) get something out of this - the main reason for posting. Your "bug" brought about a comment I want to throw to the crowd. I have an idea what I need to do, but wanted the advice of the pros. I played with the skew (needs to be zero at true south, I know) and with the scalar and distance to/from the dish. There didn't seem to be much difference in quality until the skew was changed quite a bit (no scale on the LNB, but would guess 5-7 degrees). No change at all with moving the scalar back and forth (didn't try removal), and no difference by moving the LNB forward and backward in the mount (limited to about 1" travel by design). I've also noticed that changing the position of the dish using the small adjustment settings for the DG380 didn't afford much change either. To explain the last one here, the "small" adjustment setting for the DG380 changes the dish east or west by apprx .1 degree per pulse. While trying to adjust to 101W this afternoon, I was able to move the dish 16 pulses east and west of "center" without affecting the quality. The Q read 90-91% and changed to 89-90% on the 17th pulse off center. Does this indicate the maybe the LNB is too close to the dish causing the spread of the signal to be more than the width of the antenna allowing more "swing" without affecting the result (although the result is probably less than optimal because of some signal going around the antenna), if this makes sense?

SatinKZO, I'll try to give better numbers on the C-band reception in the next day or two. I'm still sorting out just what I'm doing and haven't been taking adequate notes on the results. I also want to try tweaking the set-up a little better. I'm in a good location (-90.7W, 33.7N) and should get fairly good results. It's been stormy since I received the dish, actually since I received the motor for the dish, and "threatened" to send it back to stop the rain - haha. I was surprised, however, to get any C-band, but all seems to be fairly well right now.

To the other replies, thanks folks, I seem to be taking up a LOT of space on this reply of mine, so won't address each of you seperately here, but many, many thanks to all for support and kind words.

PLEASE keep this forum friendly and helpful, this place is AMAZING!:):):)
 
I thought it was just me! I could swear that when I would motor to a satellite with USALS it would sometimes be a little less % signal quality. So what I do is initially I use USALS to get to the bird I want, then I fine tune with Diseqc 1.2. Seems to work well :)


2 main reasons I use Diseqc 1.2 versus USALS
-I have a DBS LNB offset 5 degrees for the 1/2 dozen free KU channels out there
-my first receiver with a motor (Satworks 3688) only had Diseqc 1.2 so when I switched to a Pansat 1500 I kept using Diseqc 1.2

I've tried USALS on numerous receivers and didnt like how sometimes the motor would stop a shade shy of the actual spot
 
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