TIVO Edge + Remote TIVO Mini Vox connection FAQ

TheForce

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Just got my TIVO system set up and working. Here are some important points for anyone wishing to do the same.

The TIVO Edge is their latest DVR that does 4K HDR and Dolby Atmos sound where available. The quality is quite good. It also has IPTV apps for quite a few popular services, such as Netflix, Amazon, Hulu, YouTube and more. VUDO app is there too bhut not yet active.

The TIVO Mini is a small box that offers ethernet connection to the main TIVO Edge but only by ethernet hard wire, not wifi. However if you are not wired there are adapters using coax that can link the two. I have my Home theater and Kitchen TV connected with ethernet so the wiring was simple.

There are some facts that are not covered and I had to discover them the hard way.
1. If you buy your TIVO from TIVO direct they come already set up and activated to your account so the process is as simple as wiring and done according to TIVO people.
2. If you buy from Amazon or other including TIVO dealers, the activation and pairing is quite a bit more complicated. Here are some tips to avoid time delay:

Setting up a new TIVO DVR like the Edge first and operational. Go to your TIVO account online at Tivo.com and make sure the New Tivo Edge is listed and then check the boxes to share and download video. two boxes checked.

Now reboot the TIVO Edge to update. Make sure you are on the latest firmware too.

Next go to TIVO.com/activate and add your TSN number to your account manually.

Next wire your TIVO MINI Vox to the remote TV and go through the process on screen. Be sure the TIVO Mini is on the same ethernet as the TIVO Edge DVR and the same Subnet Mask. Most home ethernet systems are using DHCP which is best.

You will get to a setup that asks to update firmware and go through that process again. First time takes 20-30 minutes.

Finally you get to a page on the remote TV that says you have to wait 24-72 hours for the account info at tivo.com to activate your TIVO Mini. Note, I find this unacceptable, but discovered there is a faster way and not needing to buy activated and paired hardware direct from TIVO. I called and they just said to wait 72 hours and if still not active, call back for tech support. From what I understand, the TIVO Mini has to "phone home" overnight via the internet at this step in the setup and then keep rebooting and then phone home again for the next step. If something doesn't work in time more changes might need to happen the next night and usually after 3 tries (72 hours) the process is complete.

To speed up the process check the "remote devices" setting on the TIVO Edge settings menu. Be sure to allow the Edge to recognize remote devices and share on the network. Now reboot the TIVO Edge and look at that setting again. Make sure the TIVO Mini is still on and seen in your router listings and note it has obtained an IP as well as the TIVO Edge. Check again and you should now see the TIVO Mini listed as a remote device now in the settings menu.

Now go to the TIVO Mini Vox and unplug it for a minute to reset it. Go through the setup again and it should go much faster than the first time. Once that is complete you should see TV channels show up and you're all set.

Final step is to pair the TIVO VOX remote control to the TV set so you can control volume and Mute and power on buttons. The on screen instructions work for this.

Also make sure your TIVO Edge has the latest firmware update before doing anything as the original Edge firmware does not support the TIVO Mini at all.

This process should take about 2 hours, not 72 hours to activate the system but I had to discover what works on my own since the instructions from TIVO are lacking. Or, they just tell you to wait 24-72 hours for the TIVO account server to send activation instructions one at a time each overnight.

I did some research on the TIVO forums and even there the instructions are not detailed, but they did say you can "force activation by rebooting." The trick they don't mention is the proper order the rebooting needs to be done and that you have to add the TIVO Mini TSN number to your account..
 

TheForce

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One of the slick new features I have never heard of before is when playing a recording on the TIVO DVR, and a commercial break shows up in the show, there is a popup that tells you to push the D button and this skips past all the commercial in one step, rather than 30 seconds at a time.

Also performance of both the TIVO Mini and the Edge is very fast. I understand they are using a 4 core processor which improves speed over what I recall from my older Philips TIVO.
 

osu1991

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One of the slick new features I have never heard of before is when playing a recording on the TIVO DVR, and a commercial break shows up in the show, there is a popup that tells you to push the D button and this skips past all the commercial in one step, rather than 30 seconds at a time.

Also performance of both the TIVO Mini and the Edge is very fast. I understand they are using a 4 core processor which improves speed over what I recall from my older Philips TIVO.
Tivo Central>Menu>Settings>Preferences>Skipmode
change skipmode to automatic and you don't have to press D or the Channel Up/Down Button to skip forwards or backwards. It will do it automatically.

Tivo Central>Menu>Settings>Network Settings> click on Tivo Service Connection and it will connect to the Tivo servers and check for any updates to the guide data and firmware.
 

TheForce

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Tivo Central>Menu>Settings>Preferences>Skipmode
change skipmode to automatic and you don't have to press D or the Channel Up/Down Button to skip forwards or backwards. It will do it automatically.
I'll check that out, Thanks!

When does the Skip ( white button above the Netflix) button work on the remote? I have yet to see that do anything. I had been using the incremental 30 second forward button before but the D button is even faster.

Tivo Central>Menu>Settings>Network Settings> click on Tivo Service Connection and it will connect to the Tivo servers and check for any updates to the guide data and firmware.
That part was in the initial setup instructions for the Edge. Setting up the Mini did it automatically on the first run.


I compared Hulu on the TIVO and the Apple TV 4K and the quality was much better on the Apple TV. Netflix, You Tube, and Amazon were the same.
 

lparsons21

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I'll check that out, Thanks!

When does the Skip ( white button above the Netflix) button work on the remote? I have yet to see that do anything. I had been using the incremental 30 second forward button before but the D button is even faster.

I compared Hulu on the TIVO and the Apple TV 4K and the quality was much better on the Apple TV. Netflix, You Tube, and Amazon were the same.
The Skip button works the same as the D button and isn’t needed if you set ad skipping to auto. If you hadn’t noticed yet, Skip becomes available very quickly after a recording completes.

As to the apps, yeah the video quality is about the same but the software version isn’t. Unless they’ve gotten new apps for the Edge. The ones on the Bolts and Roamios is older versions without some features. I don’t use the apps on my Bolt as they are hinky, oft times just not working or giving an error about a problem starting a video. Quick switch to ATV or FireTV and same app with same video works fine. And I have an Atmos setup which Tivo doesn’t support.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk Pro
 

TheForce

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The Skip button works the same as the D button and isn’t needed if you set ad skipping to auto. If you hadn’t noticed yet, Skip becomes available very quickly after a recording completes.

As to the apps, yeah the video quality is about the same but the software version isn’t. Unless they’ve gotten new apps for the Edge. The ones on the Bolts and Roamios is older versions without some features. I don’t use the apps on my Bolt as they are hinky, oft times just not working or giving an error about a problem starting a video. Quick switch to ATV or FireTV and same app with same video works fine. And I have an Atmos setup which Tivo doesn’t support.
Thanks! I will set up auto skip later today.

Last night tried to watch Hulu on Tivo and the picture kept going soft and sometimes macro blocking. Switched to ATV 4K and watched the same movie and the picture remained sharp, and never suffered.

TIVO Edge does support Dolby Atmos on the Edge but only on services like Netflix 4K premium I tested so far. Hulu is stereo only. I haven't looked at Amazon channel yet. I almost bought the Bolt as it was out longer, consumer tested, but hated the box design. Saw the Edge and also discovered it was lower over cost. While no channels OTA offer 4K HDR (yet) I am ready when they do, so as long as the TIVO box lasts, I'll be ready.


I saw the wifi adapter but since my house is wired for ethernet from years ago it was a waste of money, IMO. If you have several mini's all have to have these adapters and your router has to support 5GHz. I have some devices that only support 2.4Ghz and others that support both so I have to have a router with all three networks active.
 

lparsons21

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I’ve got a mesh WiFi system set up at my house. My Tivo Mini can plug into one of those and to the Mini it will appear to be a wired connection. No overpriced WiFi converter needed! :)
Hadn’t really looked at the Edge since I have enough Tivo stuff that all works, so didn’t realize it supported Atmos at least on Netflix.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk Pro
 

osu1991

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Unless TiVo comes out with an ATSC 3.0 dongle or adapter, the Bolt and Edge won't be doing any 4k OTA. TiVo has hinted at that possibility, but TiVo hints and promotes a lot of vaporware too.
 

harshness

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Unless TiVo comes out with an ATSC 3.0 dongle or adapter, the Bolt and Edge won't be doing any 4k OTA.
I wouldn't worry about 4K OTA anytime soon. The US broadcasters are going to be using Next-gen TV very differently than the Korean broadcasters are and I don't expect 4K OTA to be a thing until after DTV is sunset as 4K will theoretically require most of a channel's bandwidth.

Next-gen TV (ATSC 3.0) is almost certainly coming but the current "permission" (as opposed to a mandate) says that DTV has more than five years left. Most of today's consumer electronics aren't designed to be viable that far into the future.

With that in mind, I point out that the broadcaster's published plans include converting some (or perhaps all) HD content to SD for DTV "lighthouse" broadcast so you may need Next-gen TV capability just to get HD broadcasts at some point before the sunset of DTV.

I'm afraid most of us will come to view this permission as a very bad thing.
 

TheForce

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I have the automatic skip set now and we'll see how that works later tonight on some recordings. Been busy writing scrips for all this new stuff for my remote control.

Regarding 4K video on the TIVO-
I saw somewhere that non-Tivo Edge owners were claiming that 4K for TIVO is a waste since the maximum broadcast channels are only 1080i. Well this is not true as most of the NFL games by FOX Sports are produced in 4K HDR now. I was scanning around today and saw the FOXViking/ Saints game and the image was considerably better on my TIVO than the signal on my Dish VIP722K. I confirmed that the signal sent from TIVO and on my Projector was 4K 60P and there is HDR listed as well. However regular TV programming is still at 1080i. This is the first I have seen 4K on a broadcast channel. I believe FOX is the only network doing this and has been doing this since September.
I also did a search on this and sure enough, Fox is doing NFL in 4K HDR but you have to get it OTA as cable and satellite are not passing this on.

So is it worth it? I think it is fascinating that broadcast TV is continuing to keep up with the latest in tech, but I wouldn't go out and replace all my HD equipment just for 4K. I had many other reasons to make this move and getting the Edge had other benefits after lots of comparing, just about everything. My main goal was to end satellite as rain fade was causing just too many blackouts here.
 

harshness

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I saw somewhere that non-Tivo Edge owners were claiming that 4K for TIVO is a waste since the maximum broadcast channels are only 1080i. Well this is not true as most of the NFL games by FOX Sports are produced in 4K HDR now.
Regardless of what you thought you saw, Fox still broadcasts in 720p. Whether it comes from 720p native, 2K or 4K cameras (that typically aren't 3840x2160), their OTA signals remain 1280x720p. Fox does stream some UHD games with widely varying levels of HDR success but it isn't reasonable to compare those with an old DISH HD receiver (the DISH ViP722K debuted in the September 2012).
 

TheForce

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Regardless of what you thought you saw, Fox still broadcasts in 720p. Whether it comes from 720p native, 2K or 4K cameras (that typically aren't 3840x2160), their OTA signals remain 1280x720p. Fox does stream some UHD games with widely varying levels of HDR success but it isn't reasonable to compare those with an old DISH HD receiver (the DISH ViP722K debuted in the September 2012).
I think your information is dated as stations around the nation have been doing test broadcasts in 4K HDR of the NFL games since September 20. My comparison of the OTA image quality of the VIP722K vs. the TIVO Edge was specifically to see 1080i vs UHD detail. I wasn't trying to claim the 722K looked as good as a 4K tuner. But even the PQ of the NFL game and other 720P programs from the same station using the TIVO Edge was an obvious improvement.
 

osu1991

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I think your information is dated as stations around the nation have been doing test broadcasts in 4K HDR of the NFL games since September 20. My comparison of the OTA image quality of the VIP722K vs. the TIVO Edge was specifically to see 1080i vs UHD detail. I wasn't trying to claim the 722K looked as good as a 4K tuner. But even the PQ of the NFL game and other 720P programs from the same station using the TIVO Edge was an obvious improvement.
They can test all they want, but it doesn’t change the fact that the Edge only has an ATSC 1.0 OTA tuner.

Currently the only way to get the Fox 4K games is via Sat, Cable or the Fox app. Fox itself has stated the NFL games are produced in 1080p and unconverted to 4K for those platforms and downconverted to 720p for the OTA broadcasts.
 

harshness

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I think your information is dated as stations around the nation have been doing test broadcasts in 4K HDR of the NFL games since September 20.
My information is current. Your "around the nation" has been specially produced one-off programs at two or three locations (Phoenix being the "Model Market").

The reason is twofold:

1. There aren't consumer Next-gen TV tuners available yet (what they're using in Phoenix is computer-based)
2. Stations are repacking and not working on adding Next-gen TV broadcasts

That you were fooled by the scaler in your TiVo says a lot about the scaler in the TiVo in combination with what your viewing equipment managed to do with that.

As another data point, I offer that Fox Sports (not the Fox network) is planning to stream the Super Bowl live in UHD with HDR that will be upconverted from a 1080p HDR production master as they've been doing with all of their Thursday night games:


The above article and the article that it links to have many rumor slaying tidbits in it.
 

TheForce

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However the 4K 60p HDR is generated, doesn't matter to me. But the 4K 60P coming off my TIVO from FOX Sports looks far better in image detail and dynamic range than their regular programming which is 720p. To the purist, I understand 4K 60P isn't real unless it begins and ends with 4K. But I'm an end result guy, not a purist, so it it looks like a duck, quacks like a duck I'll call it a duck, even if it is only a toy duck droid. Wake me up when you have your ATSC 3.0 tuner and can claim it looks better yet. Meanwhile, I am enjoying the new upgrades.

harshness- didn't I read elsewhere you praising the benefits of a high quality upconverter vs. a cheap one? How do you determine what is better, image quality?


Thanks for the links and I see why they chose the 1080 60p cameras as opposed to 4K 60p cameras. It has to do with pixel offset. As I understand this from an editing POV, high motion imaging requires not only double the resolution for high detail, but also 4 times the frame rate to keep the pixels sharp. Maintaining the same frame rate will cause the pixel to blur with motion. My screen is big enough to see this especially with hard edge movement. By shooting in 1080 60p they can avoid the compounding effect of pixel offset. Makes sense. With slow movement in dramatic scenes the artifact is not detected.

So, now, a better question is what minimum equipment will be required to see the games in 4K HDR? I'm not talking about ATSC 3.0 because I don't know of any tuners out there that do ATSC 3.0. I'm not into sports much but I believe I saw Fox Sports on Fubo TV guide. I'd watch it just to see how that compares to local FOX 30 upconverted.
 
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osu1991

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4K Roku or 4K Fire Stick will receive the 4K NFL stream from the Fox Sports app. Not sure if the Apple TV gets it or not.

I watched parts of one game on the 4K Fire stick earlier this year, but didn’t watch anymore. I already push the limits of my data cap each month. It looked better than the OTA and the colors did pop from the HDR.
 

Bobby

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4K Roku or 4K Fire Stick will receive the 4K NFL stream from the Fox Sports app. Not sure if the Apple TV gets it or not.

I watched parts of one game on the 4K Fire stick earlier this year, but didn’t watch anymore. I already push the limits of my data cap each month. It looked better than the OTA and the colors did pop from the HDR.
The Apple TV does get the UHD stream but not the HDR stream. Roku and Firestick get both UHD and HDR...
 
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harshness

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But the 4K 60P coming off my TIVO from FOX Sports looks far better in image detail and dynamic range than their regular programming which is 720p.
The dynamic range of DTV is not great (though better than NTSC at the low end). The image detail of 720p isn't stellar either. With a capable video processor, you can turn a 720p picture into something almost cartoon-like (one step beyond DIRECTV). High gamma luminance and punched up color tend to be a big hit with many who watch football and shopping channels while being close a mortal sin to those who prefer movies and regular TV.

You asked about what constitutes a good scaler. Fooling you into thinking that a 720p DTV broadcast was actually a UHD HDR program would be an example of a pretty incredible scaler. Come to think of it, fooling your "TV" into thinking the content is HDR is also pretty magical.

I'm still wondering if you weren't somehow watching something other than your local FOX DTV broadcast (though as Bobby points out, the ATV doesn't do FOX Sports in HDR). FOX Sports Go hasn't made an appearance in TiVoland (and the chances seem pretty slim).
 

TheForce

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Not sure if the Apple TV gets it or not.
Only if you have a supported cable channel provider. With Dish Network I would need the Dish Sports option. I tried as I haven't cancelled service yet and I got the Sorry... notice that I needed to add the sports pack.
But Fubo has the app and I took a look at it last evening and the video is indeed eye watering. Fubo is a paid service I am trying out first. It's working well so far but if I have problems with it, I will try one of the others. The downside of Fubo is the audio is only stereo and I understand Fox Sports offers Dolby Atmos.
 

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