Tracking / Focal / What signal are you all getting on Galaxy 12 (replaced 15)

[whitehawk82]

Hi,

I'm a newbie on this forum although I've been reading it for years. I have run into a big snag and decided its finally time to just ask the experts. I have a REALLY old dish, I mean REALLY old that I maintain. We pull in one channel, classic arts showcase with this dish. While we used to just use the analog we now use the digital they have added but that doesnt always work so well.

I got up on the roof and re-tigtened and replaced a lot of hardware and got up to 70% signal on some sats (mainly SatMex5) but on the extremes my signal is almost nothing so I know the dish isn't tracking properly, however there is only an elevation adjustment, no declination adjustment. Also a new DMX741U has been retrofitted onto this dish, there was no way to mount the scalar ring properly so we clamped the original clamps around the LNB right behind the ring, messing with this focus doesnt appear to help.

So anyway on Galaxy 15 (now 12 since 15 is falling) we are only seeing a 30% signal quality, I finally got it locked with elevation to about 46% but now I can't move to any other birds and that still seems low. If i push on the bottom of the dish it jumps to about 59% but it is not just tilting the dish down it's actually warping it and making the sides push inward...

I'm thinking time for a new FS08 dish or something because this old aluminum 9ft dish is not working as I think it should. If anyone has any tips to get this old dish to work properly I'd love to hear it, even if we just lock it to Galaxy 12 permanently as this is the only channel we use. I've done all of the obvious things, new LNB, new run of Quad Shield cable, made sure the entire dish was grounded well with 6AWG Stranded wire and made all physical adjustments I can think of. What kind of signal do you guys get from that channel?

Classic Arts Showcase 3816 H 3000SR

Here are pictures of my pain:

 

[whitehawk82]

Nobody?

 

[hd fan]

Now that I just filled the gap between the pole and the mount cap with a plastic pipe (now the cap is perfectly plumb like the pole) and therefore it tracks the arc fully even on Ku (I finally get PBS on 125W with over 70 on 12180) I get that one with over 40 I think. The speed hd TP is unwatchable and barely locks but the CNN HD TP locks fine with around 25 I think. AMC TP has always work fine. I have a CS8100 and a motorised fortec 6 footer.

Hope it helps. It is funny , but I do not see the declination adjustment either. weird eh?, because the mount looks very polar to me.

 

[ParaclipseCKu]

I just installed a Sami 10 ft mesh dish and I'm getting a Signal of 50 and Quality of 62 on ARTS on Galaxy 12. I still have some finishing touches on the dish so that is being conservative with my signal.

 

[FaT Air]

This may help
Footprints by Dish Size - Adjusting the Polar Mount for Prime Focus Antenna - C/Ku-Band Satellite Systems - Tuning, Tracking, Azimuth, Elevation, Declination Angles, F/D Ratio, Focal Distance, Inclinometer, LNB/Feedhorn Assembly, Actuator Assembly, C

 

[upnatm]

Looks to me like the declination offset is adjusted by the amount of
spacers used between the pan and the top of the mounting bracket.

Adjusting the angle might be tedious, but can be done. The bolts don't
need to be removed if using horseshoe shaped spacers.

The link FaT Air posted will help with calculating the proper angles
for your location. A declinometer will be very handy. Make sure your
elevation angle is correct before doing any declination adjustments.

That bottom photo, is it just me or the angle of view? To me, the LNB
looks like it's quite a ways off center. Are the three support rods the
same length?

Check to see if the LNB is actually at the focal point before messing with
the mount angles.

It might seem like a bit of a chore just to hit one bird, but if you get it all set up
properly, you'll be able to hit 'em all! Especially with that new DMX741U.

Good luck and have fun.

Oh, by the way, I just looked; Classic Arts on 133W, S= 62%, Q=78%
I'm using a 7.5' StarTrak (mesh), G-Box V3000, DMX741 LNB, K-Box K2HD receiver.

I'm also getting some decent Ku channels too, on a variety of sats .
Under clear skies in Wawa, Ontario Canada (48N, 84W).

Cheers!

 

[whitehawk82]

Looks to me like the declination offset is adjusted by the amount of
spacers used between the pan and the top of the mounting bracket.

Adjusting the angle might be tedious, but can be done. The bolts don't
need to be removed if using horseshoe shaped spacers.

Is this the way they used to do it? Whomever installed this dish originally has them offset, if you are facing the back of the dish there are spacers on the top left and the bottom right...

That bottom photo, is it just me or the angle of view? To me, the LNB
looks like it's quite a ways off center. Are the three support rods the
same length?

I always thought it looked funny too, but the rods are the same length but its hard to tell if they are bent or not and if the LNB is truly center as this dish is hard to get in the middle of even with a ladder. What I do find truly odd is that if I hold the LNB like I am going to make a skew adjustment it will jump up to almost 60% quality and when I release it drops back down, that should be a clue but I have been unable to find out what I am actually adjusting to make this happen.

Oh, by the way, I just looked; Classic Arts on 133W, S= 62%, Q=78%
I'm using a 7.5' StarTrak (mesh), G-Box V3000, DMX741 LNB, K-Box K2HD receiver.

WOW!, so with a solid 9' I should be at least that... yep, something is still very wrong.

 

[upnatm]

Hi again whitehawk82,

Now that you mention the spacer arrangement, and looking closer at
the polar mount, your rig looks like a well intentioned home-made job.

Perhaps the pan was saved from death, then retrofitted to what the
builder thought was proper, without knowing about the fine adjustments,
or maybe the motor drive was an afterthought.

My first pic below, shows the spacing needed for this particular dish at my
latitude of 48N (there's my StarTrak in the background). About 1.75" on the
top two, and none on the bottom, which works out to around 7.11 degrees
of inclination offset.
The bolts are quite rusty, but I need not touch them, this dish was plucked
just 12 miles East of here.

This "tilt", away from the Polar Axis, aims the pan downwards a bit, in order to hit
the spot where the sats are actually orbitting. Yours will be different, but not a whole lot.

Keep in mind, the mounts may differ somewhat, but the geometric theory is the same.
With the way yours is spaced, you can only "see" a small part of the sat belt, 133W
happens to be in that small part of the belt.

I think you might have to start by proving the polar alignment, then resetting the
inclination angle correctly. A point to remember is; aim the dish due-south when
setting the inclination offset angle with an inclinometer.
Once the mounts are set, then you get to play with
the scalar ring, support struts and focal distance!

Your LNB mount looks rather flimsy, Unless the bolts get cinched really tight, they
will likely move out of alignment on you, leaving the LNB nearly impossible to adjust.

My 3rd pic shows how the scalar ring is used as part of the support structure,
leaving the LNB free to adjust easily. Modifying yours to be like this will remove
a big headache for you. You mainly need to get the focal point right.

Here again is the link to the "dish-bible": Footprints by Dish Size - Adjusting the Polar Mount for Prime Focus Antenna - C/Ku-Band Satellite Systems - Tuning, Tracking, Azimuth, Elevation, Declination Angles, F/D Ratio, Focal Distance, Inclinometer, LNB/Feedhorn Assembly, Actuator Assembly, C
Browse thru the pages, you'll find how to make your dish work right!

Another good trick, for working on the LNB/scalar assy, is to move the dish all
the way to the east or west, you won't need such a tall ladder that way.

Gotta run for now, keep us posted!