70 miles away is too much out of range. I would think max will be 45 miles. Anything beyond that is a miss or hit.
VOOM Installations
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I know you asked for Sean's input but I have a lot of experience with RF and can suggest something that may work.
If the channel you plan to get is UHF you are at the fringes of line of sight. This means that depending on terrain it may not be possible.
Here is what I suggest:
1) Get a channel master 8 bay bowtie antenna. I think the model number is 4228. Mount it as high as possible. Use antennaweb.org to figure out where to point it. http://www.starkelectronic.com/allant.htm
2) Be prepared to add a pre-amp. With the type of receiver involved in OTA HD noise figure is much more important than gain. This means that you need a low noise amp. Check out the Channel Master 7775 at: http://www.starkelectronic.com/allamps.htm
3) Use RG6 quad shield and do not split to multiple sets or receivers.
Good Luck!
P.S. I have no association with Channel Master or Stark Electronics.
If the channel you plan to get is UHF you are at the fringes of line of sight. This means that depending on terrain it may not be possible.
Here is what I suggest:
1) Get a channel master 8 bay bowtie antenna. I think the model number is 4228. Mount it as high as possible. Use antennaweb.org to figure out where to point it. http://www.starkelectronic.com/allant.htm
2) Be prepared to add a pre-amp. With the type of receiver involved in OTA HD noise figure is much more important than gain. This means that you need a low noise amp. Check out the Channel Master 7775 at: http://www.starkelectronic.com/allamps.htm
3) Use RG6 quad shield and do not split to multiple sets or receivers.
Good Luck!
P.S. I have no association with Channel Master or Stark Electronics.
Fargus said:
Voom install nightmare so far...
Hi,
Great forum! Here's my story so far:
I had some installers out at my house to install Voom on Saturday and they told me I couldn't receive it due to line of sight problems.
An issue I had with the installation is the guys insisted Voom only had 7 HD channels, and kept telling me D* was better, but Voom would have 10 more HD channels by next year.
I kept telling him they had 32 currently, but he said he has installed it recently and they only have 7 channels. Would believe me that they had more then that.
They also brought up the E* $999 HDTV in a box deal.
They said they were meeting with Voom Sunday, so hopefully they figured out that they were wrong there.
Either way.. they left with only looking and saying no LOS. I wasn't satisfired with that.
Now:
I called Voom and they were very mad that the installers would tell me D* was better, and to even talk about the Dish deal. They also weren't happy that the guys insisted Voom only had 7 HD channels.
I didn't trust the installers so Voom has me setup with an install today. Since the last attempted install, I printed out the angle and got out a compass, and it appears that the installers weren't even pointing directly in the right direction when pointing out the tree that they said was in the way. I also looked at the angle, and it is clearly above the tree by quite a bit. So hopefully I will have a good experience today with the install.
Great info in this thread!
Any tips for the install?
So far I know I should not pay to have a second line for the antenna installed. Should I just call Voom if I have any issues while the installer is here?
I'm going to let the installer leave without doing some type of test for the signal.
Hi,
Great forum! Here's my story so far:
I had some installers out at my house to install Voom on Saturday and they told me I couldn't receive it due to line of sight problems.
An issue I had with the installation is the guys insisted Voom only had 7 HD channels, and kept telling me D* was better, but Voom would have 10 more HD channels by next year.
I kept telling him they had 32 currently, but he said he has installed it recently and they only have 7 channels. Would believe me that they had more then that.
They also brought up the E* $999 HDTV in a box deal.
They said they were meeting with Voom Sunday, so hopefully they figured out that they were wrong there.
Either way.. they left with only looking and saying no LOS. I wasn't satisfired with that.
Now:
I called Voom and they were very mad that the installers would tell me D* was better, and to even talk about the Dish deal. They also weren't happy that the guys insisted Voom only had 7 HD channels.
I didn't trust the installers so Voom has me setup with an install today. Since the last attempted install, I printed out the angle and got out a compass, and it appears that the installers weren't even pointing directly in the right direction when pointing out the tree that they said was in the way. I also looked at the angle, and it is clearly above the tree by quite a bit. So hopefully I will have a good experience today with the install.
Great info in this thread!
Any tips for the install?
So far I know I should not pay to have a second line for the antenna installed. Should I just call Voom if I have any issues while the installer is here?
I'm going to let the installer leave without doing some type of test for the signal.
I had Voom installed yesterday and pick up the 2 VHF channels fine with the stealth antenna and preamp. I was going to take that down and put up a combo VHF/UHF antenna which cost around 160.00. Could I put up the channelmaster antenna you talk about and combine the signal with the stealth antenna somehow? They say that when they turn off analog signal channels will go back to there original spot so I will always have VHF and UHF channels. Wish Connecticut could of been like almost everyone else and put all digital channels on UHF. That would of been to easy. Any chance of Picking up the 2 VHF channels with the 4228. They must be strong because I can turn the stealth antenna anywhere and they still come in. The 2 VHF towers are about 21 miles from me. The UHF towers are about 25 miles in a different direction. Sorry post is so long. Just got up and am thinking as I type.soledade said:
Unfortunately the 4228 does not receive VHF channels well at all. The only channels that come in at all are the very highest VHF channel number (above 10). In addition the 4228 has a very narrow angle of reception. This will make it even worse performer if the towers are in radically different directions.
Combining two antennas on the same cable run almost never works. The reason is that if the antennas have any overlap (like the stealth and the 4228 overlap in the UHF region). The signals from both antennas add up and cancel each other out when not in phase. This ends up looking like multipath problems at the receiver.
You can combine the 4228 more successfully with a VHF ONLY antenna. In fact the large boom antennas you see are usually just that a VHF and a UHF antenna combined. If you want to put up only one antenna try the channel master 3671 or 3678. However I am skeptical this will work for you since you say the towers are in different directions (how many degrees apart? see antennaweb.org).
Since you say the towers are in different directions you may need to combine a 4228 or 4221 with one of the VHF only antennas made by winegard. I don't think channel master makes vhf only antennas. Point them in the corresponding tower directions. If their overlap is small (should be since one is UHF and the other is VHF) run them into your house on a single cable.
I hope this helps!
Carlos
Combining two antennas on the same cable run almost never works. The reason is that if the antennas have any overlap (like the stealth and the 4228 overlap in the UHF region). The signals from both antennas add up and cancel each other out when not in phase. This ends up looking like multipath problems at the receiver.
You can combine the 4228 more successfully with a VHF ONLY antenna. In fact the large boom antennas you see are usually just that a VHF and a UHF antenna combined. If you want to put up only one antenna try the channel master 3671 or 3678. However I am skeptical this will work for you since you say the towers are in different directions (how many degrees apart? see antennaweb.org).
Since you say the towers are in different directions you may need to combine a 4228 or 4221 with one of the VHF only antennas made by winegard. I don't think channel master makes vhf only antennas. Point them in the corresponding tower directions. If their overlap is small (should be since one is UHF and the other is VHF) run them into your house on a single cable.
I hope this helps!
Carlos
pmalve said:
where i live (NYC area)the 4228 is fine because the HD signal comes from one location more or less and are all UHF if that changes they will have to make good on a new one
I love this forum! If it was not for you guys I would never have known about Voom. I ordered it on Monday Night and I have an install date of March 10th. I have already contacted my installer and confirmed the installation info. What is the next step?
I don't quite understand why I need two separate lines coming in (one for the OTA and other for the Dish)? There has been mention of not having a diplexer (hope I got that right) installed why is that? Are there any other things I should keep in mind.
I don't quite understand why I need two separate lines coming in (one for the OTA and other for the Dish)? There has been mention of not having a diplexer (hope I got that right) installed why is that? Are there any other things I should keep in mind.
omard. said:
omard, the diplexer has caused a 30% decreased in signal strength (in some cases). Others have reported no problems. I strongly suggest you to get two lines (OTA and Satellite) and not use the diplexer. Just keep in touch with the installer so that they do not skip your installation.
Thanks for the responce Sean. Ok I should NOT use a diplexer and have two lines run one for OTA and other for Dish. I will give the installer a call on Monday before the install. Any other things I should do?
Omar, good to have you vooming. The initial method of installation included a diplexer, a two part gizmo which effectively combines both the signal from the dish and the signal from the OTA antenna so that the combined signal can share a single coaxial cable as it travels from your roof to your HDTV. At the VOOM box another diplexer component would separate out the two signals again routing one to the OTA portion (8VSB module) of the VOOM receiver and the other would go to the satellite input. It turns out that combining and then separating the signals in this manner typically degrades the overal signal to the point of significant reception problems.omard. said:
So, have the installer run each antenna's signal via its own coax all the way to the back of the VOOM box and you'll guarantee yourself the highest signal strength for both antennas.
Don't pay extra to have VOOM installed with 2 lines, it should be installed this way to begin with.
Other things to know and do:
-Give the installer a beer, he's probably had somebody else chewing his ear off all day - he's your friend.
-Look for threads regarding the little flap on the front of the VOOM box (lower right as you look at the front). Behind it is a magical red button that allows you to cycle through different screen resolutions. There are reports of installers not knowing about this and leaving people with it set to 480P and a picture quality which is very disappointing.
-Some installers have made the error of connecting the OTA antenna to an input confusingly labled "RF" on the back of the VOOM box. This is not for the OTA antenna to plug in but for a potential option of an radio frequency remote control device. The OTA plugs in to the back of the 8VSB module which is plugged into the VOOM box at the lower right back.
-Report back to this forum how your install went.
Update on my install...
2/24 Ordered and set up install for 3/2
2/27 As suggested on this forum, called Voom to find out installer. They couldn't find me by phone number, and finally figured out that both phone numbers entered for my account were entered wrong. They corrected and told me my local installer, Adant from Chicago.
2/27 Len, at Adant, was extremely helpful and told me he was about to cancel my install since he couldn't reach me by phone. He also corrected the number, and set me up for Noon on 3/2.
3/2 Len called and told me that the truck of his "experienced Voom installer" had broken down. After several more update calls througout the day, we rescheduled for 3/4 morning between 9 and 12.
3/4 At 10:30am I called to find out where they were. Len apologized and said someone messed up the schedule, and they would be out after another install. I told them I had to go back to work at noon. He said he'd call back.
3/4 At 11:00am...David (installer) called and said he'd be here around Noon.
3/4 Arrived 10 minutes ago at 12:40pm. At first wanted to install a diplexer, but quickly backed down. Very nice, Very knowledgeable.
More later...
2/24 Ordered and set up install for 3/2
2/27 As suggested on this forum, called Voom to find out installer. They couldn't find me by phone number, and finally figured out that both phone numbers entered for my account were entered wrong. They corrected and told me my local installer, Adant from Chicago.
2/27 Len, at Adant, was extremely helpful and told me he was about to cancel my install since he couldn't reach me by phone. He also corrected the number, and set me up for Noon on 3/2.
3/2 Len called and told me that the truck of his "experienced Voom installer" had broken down. After several more update calls througout the day, we rescheduled for 3/4 morning between 9 and 12.
3/4 At 10:30am I called to find out where they were. Len apologized and said someone messed up the schedule, and they would be out after another install. I told them I had to go back to work at noon. He said he'd call back.
3/4 At 11:00am...David (installer) called and said he'd be here around Noon.
3/4 Arrived 10 minutes ago at 12:40pm. At first wanted to install a diplexer, but quickly backed down. Very nice, Very knowledgeable.
More later...
Pending Install
New kid on the block, to this forum and HDTV in general. First, I want to thank all of you for a LOT of great info! This forum has already been very helpful to me and I just got started.
Now my issue: VOOM is being installed tomorrow morning and, despite all the posts in this thread and Joe Harkins' message yesterday confirming that Install, Inc. concurs with installing a separate coax line from the OTA antenna, the installer insists they have to follow the work order which requires use of a single line and diplexer. And, of course, the work order is from Installs, Inc.?!
I sent an email directly to Mr. Harkins but I also wanted to ask here if there is any other reference I can use to convince them to use two lines?
Thanks, and thanks again for such a great resource.
New kid on the block, to this forum and HDTV in general. First, I want to thank all of you for a LOT of great info! This forum has already been very helpful to me and I just got started.
Now my issue: VOOM is being installed tomorrow morning and, despite all the posts in this thread and Joe Harkins' message yesterday confirming that Install, Inc. concurs with installing a separate coax line from the OTA antenna, the installer insists they have to follow the work order which requires use of a single line and diplexer. And, of course, the work order is from Installs, Inc.?!
I sent an email directly to Mr. Harkins but I also wanted to ask here if there is any other reference I can use to convince them to use two lines?
Thanks, and thanks again for such a great resource.
SSN671,
Welcome.
here's the number for Installs Inc 888 987 3474 asked to be connected to Joe Harkins if the person cannot help you. The work order clearly states up to 4 coax lines included in the installation. Tell the guy that you will call Installs who produces the work order. Do not let him/her intimidate you.
Where are these local installers come from? They really don't want to do any work.
Welcome.
here's the number for Installs Inc 888 987 3474 asked to be connected to Joe Harkins if the person cannot help you. The work order clearly states up to 4 coax lines included in the installation. Tell the guy that you will call Installs who produces the work order. Do not let him/her intimidate you.
Where are these local installers come from? They really don't want to do any work.
My install is about half done, and is going well. He arrived at 12:40pm and it is now 2:00pm.
Get this...he felt bad about having to reschedule, and offered to run all 4 lines now "just in case I need them in the future." I took him up on it. I helped him run the wires in the house since I wanted them to take a certain path. I also gave him a Dr. Pepper, and he seems pretty happy.
Question: I am 10-12 miles from the OTA stations. He is installing the amplifier. Do you think I'll have any over-amplification issues?
I'll know in a while if my VOOM service works yet, I'll keep you posted and will take pictures if I can figure out how to post.
Get this...he felt bad about having to reschedule, and offered to run all 4 lines now "just in case I need them in the future." I took him up on it. I helped him run the wires in the house since I wanted them to take a certain path. I also gave him a Dr. Pepper, and he seems pretty happy.
Question: I am 10-12 miles from the OTA stations. He is installing the amplifier. Do you think I'll have any over-amplification issues?
I'll know in a while if my VOOM service works yet, I'll keep you posted and will take pictures if I can figure out how to post.
Sean, thanks. I will call that number during the installation if I can't convince them. The message I received directly from Installs Inc. after I placed my order does state up to 4 lines, but makes no mention of any OTA installation. If this is the same as the work order received by the installer, then I can see where they might be confused since I am getting a single room installation. The message makes no mention of an OTA antenna installation and thus no mention of the feed from an OTA antenna. They probably equate one room to one line.
Update: just received a reply from Joe Harkins and he will call the installer directly. We are very fortunate to have people like you and Joe to help us newbies out!
Thanks to you and Joe; I will let you know how it all comes out.
Update: just received a reply from Joe Harkins and he will call the installer directly. We are very fortunate to have people like you and Joe to help us newbies out!
Thanks to you and Joe; I will let you know how it all comes out.
