Interesting at this point. One thing i will do as i tell my dealers is provide feed back to the "Brass" Although im not in those conversations i can plant seeds. We will see how this plays out..
WildBlue ViaSat1 the real scoop
- Thread starter Chris Conant WildBlue
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Not a real good comparison, given that cellphone providers (around here anyway) offer only one data plan. That's not the point anyway. The way I'm reading the complaints is that the "new and improved" WB/Exede has made a corporate decision to sell less for more.
//greg//
23% less data on the entry level plan, plus increase in lease fee (those that own the equipment with no lease fee, $10 increase in price). To add 2GB of data to be close to the current level, $16 increase on top of that. So for me to “upgrade” to the new service and be at ~close to the same level as now, $26 more per month, an almost 50% increase in price not including the upgrade fee and new contract, and still would not be able to do any more than I can now (just faster). Yes the 2GB is upload on the old plan, but at least half of that is needed just for general browsing with no uploading. Sure Skype and stuff work, but they worked before WB blocked them/artificially doubled the latency back in '06. I won't give them brownie points for undoing what they did on their own.
That's just the base plan. Sorry, but there is no way I can see that as reasonable. Read all the user comments of people that use the service (the comments on articles, not the hype of the articles themselves, of course the articles will be positive), look at the Facebook page, etc. A lower more sensible speed and higher caps, even a little bit, would do users MUCH more good. People that understand satellite are not asking for a lot, and I don't see where anything unreasonable is being asked at all. But telling those of us that know what's going on that the service is great and we have no reason to complain (basically), does not go over well. “We” use this as our primary internet, and I know for a fact it isn't adequate or reasonable for many people I know. The speed is useless if you can't use it or are overcharged to use it, and paying $30-$50+ more per month is not reasonable at all. Parroting what is great about the service, basically what would come from the sales brochure, is not helpful, and many of us are angry about it, and feel very misled with all the hype the last few years. And we have a right to complain about the services being offered to us, and most definitely can state the fact that the price is too high.
Also, any statistics I've seen released about how much data people use have been basically useless. People were given caps, and stayed under them because they were penalized if they went over. Shocking concept that people stay under what they are supposed to. Also, in those statistics there was no breakdown of how many people use the WB connection as their only source for internet, no mention of how many were vacation homes or other varying circumstances. Some of us don't have access to other means (work, cell service, free hotspots (60 mile round trip for me)) to supplement our data usage. And it makes people angrier when they get the sense they are talking to brick walls, people that don't listen or care at all, repeating over and over what's stated with few reasonable responses, other than "tough".
I've said it before, if they weren't willing to give us a reasonable cap, a 30 day download limit plus free download time every night or week. A combination of Hughesnet and WB policies. This would allow for downloading some movies, system updates, needed files or programs, etc. WB/VIasat/Exede/whatever are already offering much less data than possible with Hughesnet.
As for what it is, as I stated, I am looking at the other alternatives. I've had two people call me this week and ask if there was anything else available too. I told them about the upgrade, they aren't interested either, like everyone else I've explained it to around here. People are driving 30 miles one way as it is to get enough data for online classes, etc. as it is. Even the $130 package isn't enough for -some- of that. That is not reasonable.
That's just the base plan. Sorry, but there is no way I can see that as reasonable. Read all the user comments of people that use the service (the comments on articles, not the hype of the articles themselves, of course the articles will be positive), look at the Facebook page, etc. A lower more sensible speed and higher caps, even a little bit, would do users MUCH more good. People that understand satellite are not asking for a lot, and I don't see where anything unreasonable is being asked at all. But telling those of us that know what's going on that the service is great and we have no reason to complain (basically), does not go over well. “We” use this as our primary internet, and I know for a fact it isn't adequate or reasonable for many people I know. The speed is useless if you can't use it or are overcharged to use it, and paying $30-$50+ more per month is not reasonable at all. Parroting what is great about the service, basically what would come from the sales brochure, is not helpful, and many of us are angry about it, and feel very misled with all the hype the last few years. And we have a right to complain about the services being offered to us, and most definitely can state the fact that the price is too high.
Also, any statistics I've seen released about how much data people use have been basically useless. People were given caps, and stayed under them because they were penalized if they went over. Shocking concept that people stay under what they are supposed to. Also, in those statistics there was no breakdown of how many people use the WB connection as their only source for internet, no mention of how many were vacation homes or other varying circumstances. Some of us don't have access to other means (work, cell service, free hotspots (60 mile round trip for me)) to supplement our data usage. And it makes people angrier when they get the sense they are talking to brick walls, people that don't listen or care at all, repeating over and over what's stated with few reasonable responses, other than "tough".
I've said it before, if they weren't willing to give us a reasonable cap, a 30 day download limit plus free download time every night or week. A combination of Hughesnet and WB policies. This would allow for downloading some movies, system updates, needed files or programs, etc. WB/VIasat/Exede/whatever are already offering much less data than possible with Hughesnet.
As for what it is, as I stated, I am looking at the other alternatives. I've had two people call me this week and ask if there was anything else available too. I told them about the upgrade, they aren't interested either, like everyone else I've explained it to around here. People are driving 30 miles one way as it is to get enough data for online classes, etc. as it is. Even the $130 package isn't enough for -some- of that. That is not reasonable.
One more thing. Why is this being compared to -mobile- internet and phone plans? This is -fixed- home internet, not subject to the convenience factor and price premium of a mobile product. Home internet plans and landline phone service would be a better comparison. Perhaps somewhere in between the two because there is no direct comparison, but certainly closer to home. As a sort of example, Verizon offers a fixed home phone box, I think for $20, unlimited calls. Compare that to the mobile unlimited calling plan ($50 on prepaid, higher on post, for example), utilizing the same network but much higher. Didn't look into those or look up the numbers, as before recently did not have usable cell service here, so my numbers are probably off.
Prior to now, users were given a choice of paying more for more speed AND more data. Now, the decision was made to make everyone pay for the speed premium, at the sacrifice of data (being able to do anything). Most home interenet plans I see offer different prices for different speed, in fact in every town I know of within a 50 mile radius, that's how it is.
I think that covers much of the user frustration, nothing will likely change anyway, at least any time soon.
Prior to now, users were given a choice of paying more for more speed AND more data. Now, the decision was made to make everyone pay for the speed premium, at the sacrifice of data (being able to do anything). Most home interenet plans I see offer different prices for different speed, in fact in every town I know of within a 50 mile radius, that's how it is.
I think that covers much of the user frustration, nothing will likely change anyway, at least any time soon.
Giving everybody more speed does a couple of things. One, it allows people to reach their caps quicker after they see what they can do with some decent speed causing them to want to upgrade their package for more data. Two, they can advertise speeds higher than DSL and some other broadband companies along with competing with wireless internet company speeds.
That pretty much sums it up. Difficult to make direct comparisons to anything other than another satellite-delivered service, especially if you live in an unserved or underserved area.
Compare Excede12's advertised monthly data caps to HughesNet's daily FAP limits using 31 days per month:
Excede12 Plans
Up to 12 Mbps downstream
Up to 3 Mbps upstream
$ 49.99 per mo. 7.5 GB per mo. = 242 MB per day
$ 79.99 per mo. 15 GB per mo. = 484 MB per day
$129.99 per mo. 25 GB per mo. = 806 MB per day
HUGHESNET PLANS
Up to 2 Mbps downstream
Up to 300 Kbps upstream
BASIC $49.99 per mo. 250 MB per day
POWER 150 $79.99 per mo. 350 MB per day
POWER 200 $109.99 per mo. 450 MB per day
Alan, I'm wondering if those HughesNet FAP numbers are current. If you took them from the Hughesnet website, it may not yet have been updated to reflect the recent 50MB/day increases. My $79.99 plan for example was recently bumped to 475MB during the 19 hours on either side of the daily 0200-0700 unlimited window.
There's also talk of a roll-over plan being inaugurated in the HN9000 community this month. Apparently they're first, then the Ku-community gets it (a carrot and stick thing to get legacy subscribers to switch to Ka-band). No actual announcement from Hughes yet. But the basic concept is that the unused portion of your daily allowance becomes cumulative. For two consecutive days that is. I'm pretty sure the max FAP threshold will be that of the current plans times two.
//greg//
There's also talk of a roll-over plan being inaugurated in the HN9000 community this month. Apparently they're first, then the Ku-community gets it (a carrot and stick thing to get legacy subscribers to switch to Ka-band). No actual announcement from Hughes yet. But the basic concept is that the unused portion of your daily allowance becomes cumulative. For two consecutive days that is. I'm pretty sure the max FAP threshold will be that of the current plans times two.
//greg//
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Taken from here:
Rural High-Speed Internet Service - HughesNet Satellite Internet
As always, with any sat internet plan, your actual mileage can and will vary
Rural High-Speed Internet Service - HughesNet Satellite Internet
As always, with any sat internet plan, your actual mileage can and will vary
Just want to ask something. While I can understand its to be expected that satellite broadband should cost a premium over DSL, cable, etc., these caps seem really restrictive. Is satellite technology really so incapable of meeting the needs of it's relatively limited customer base, in regards to people having constant access to ever increasingly popular and common websites? Not being sarcastic, I honestly am not that familiar with satellite broadband and am just curious. I'm pretty sure one day I will need such a service.
Two things. It's not for "free" you're paying for access. Also, an ISP slowing down traffic to a competitor's video service in order to push their own is one of the reasons Net Neutrality was passed.
And another thing, "Chris". I see you've artfully dodged around the issue of latency. You've talked about how fast the throughput is, but you still haven't addressed the fact that the latency of satellite Internet is roughly equal to sending your packets by carrier pigeon. No matter how fast of a speed, it's still going to be utterly useless for VoIP and online gaming.
I think that's already happening. I got a letter about it Nov 29 indicating they had started with all new customers, and are rolling it out to existing. Says nothing about Ku or Ka being first:
Dear HughesNet Reseller,
Today, we announce the addition of the Download Bank feature to the HughesNet service! This is a FREE enhancement for your customers!
There is nothing that either you or your customer needs to do to take advantage of this new feature! The Download Bank will automatically start upon activation of a new HughesNet account.
This feature provides more freedom and less worry for your customer! Think of it as a bank that holds your customer's daily Download Allowance. Now they can "bank" or carry over their daily Download Allowance up to 2x the capacity (that's up to 900 MB, depending on their plan). With the bank filled, they have the flexibility to download a little, or a lot, any time they want! So now, instead of worrying about using more than their daily allowance for streaming movies or large downloads, they are able to dip into their "savings" at the Download Bank. Of course, they may also continue to schedule large downloads using the HughesNet Download Manager - or by using the FREE monthly Restore Token.
Please review our Download Bank Customer Talking Points/FAQ document for full details and how to speak about this great new enhancement! To see an illustrated example of how the Download Bank works, please see the graphic below.
For your information, Download Bank is being rolled out in stages as a pilot program to existing HughesNet consumers. Click here to see the letter that customers will receive today, November 29. Any information learned during this pilot may be useful for further enhancements of the HughesNet service.
Thank You,
Hughes Channel Support
Ah, "Download Bank". I didn't realize that they'd actually given it a name. But my supposition was correct, in that you can't accumulate more than the equivalent of your subscription allowance times two. But the answer to the Ku-last is in your cut & paste. It says new accounts get this automatically. Except for those with visibility issues, all new subscribers are Ka-band by default. So we "existing subscribers" have to wait in line. By the way, I never received that November 29 letter - which gives more credence to the idea that Ku-band subscribers are in the back of the bus. Given that I've paid for unbroken service since the days of DirecPC, that doesn't say much for HughesNet customer appreciation.
//greg//
//greg//
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You may be right, but almost all my new installs are Ku (Mexico). Haven't had a chance to test the Download Bank with any of them yet.
Thinking about switching
I am thinking about switching to the new EXEDE service, but I have a question. I looked at the site and saw that it will support VoIP. How many GB would be used by VoIP in a month's time?
I am thinking about switching to the new EXEDE service, but I have a question. I looked at the site and saw that it will support VoIP. How many GB would be used by VoIP in a month's time?
Understand. Most "visibility issues" above the border involve physical obstructions between available dish locations and the Ka-satellite. Your Mexican installs are apparently outside the Ka-footprint; another "visibility issue". FYI; predicted Jupiter beam footprints can be viewed here. A quick glance shows northern Mexico coverage by beams 3 and 5 and 58. There's still some gaps however, but I didn't open all the files. Perhaps you can fill in the coverage by trial and error.
//greg//
That's like asking how much gas do you use in a month - depends upon your driving habits and the type of car you own.
VoIP can use anywhere from 17 Kbps (Kilobits per second) to 130 Kbps of data, depending upon the platform and codec used. One hour of phone time a day at 17 Kbps will use about 8 MB of data. At 130 Kbps, you'll burn up about 59 MB in an hour of phone time.
Which site? I went to exede.com and put VoIP in the search box. Zero hits. There was however, a link to the Wildblue website - where a VoIP search reveals:
"FAQ: Does WildBlue support VoIP?
At this time, WildBlue does not support VoIP."
That's not to say that you can't eventually get voice service over ViaSat/Excede/Wildblue, but - and history will bear this out - it's always been sold as a satellite "value-added" feature (with the possible exception of selected Canadian off-grid areas). This involves routing your signal through a VoIP accelerator to counter as best they can the effects of latency. Current Wildblue plans don't make it available period. And if you want it from HughesNet, you have to first get a Business plan - and THEN have it upgraded to support VoIP. that means more money per month. So take considerable care to research the how and why-for of VoIP over satellite - before you commit.
//greg//
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