D*'s alleged "false advertising"

[harshness]

Would you be so kind and point out the places where D* has stated that they would do one thing and havent done it.

That isn't the issue that I have been trying to bring to light. The bone that I pick is with the incessant misinformation that gets spewed by the subscribers. In the last week, there have been numerous false statements and they don't seem to be decreasing with time. Sometimes the misinformation comes from CSRs or installers, but much of the time, it comes from well-meaning forum participants who just aren't paying attention.

The topic that really has me wound up this week is the on-again off-again inclusion of HD LIL in the 100 national HD channel count. Surely it is difficult to figure out how DirecTV is going to come anywhere near their goal, but it doesn't help to explain it away with channels that aren't channels or content that isn't national.

 

[boston area dtv]

Harshness on their site this is what theyve said.

http://www.directv.com/DTVAPP/global/contentPage.jsp?assetId=900034

The future of television has arrived. DIRECTV brings you our new HD DVR, soon with the capacity to offer 150 HD channels*, that's three times more than cable.** Images are sharper. Sound is crisper. And now, they can be recorded. Get the best sports, movies, family and special events, all in stunning HD.
The Best HD Programming
Get your favorite channels, including ESPN HD, Universal HD, HBO® HD, HD PPV and more
Soon, we'll have the capacity to offer 150 HD channels*, that's three times more than cable**
Coming in 2007, enjoy the most sports in HD†

Cutting-edge Equipment

100% digital picture and sound on every channel with a digital signal 99% of the time, rain or shine
Pause and rewind live TV and record up to 200 hours of standard-definition programming or up to 50 hours of high-definition programming,^ with the DIRECTV Plus HD DVR receiver
Automatically record an entire season of your favorite show, even if it moves to a new time
Record two shows of DIRECTV programming at the same time, even record two off-air high-definition shows at the same time

The DIRECTV HD Home Theater

Stunning Dolby Digital 5.1 Surround Sound
Theater wide 16:9 aspect ratio for added image and depth without letterbox black bars
Higher resolution - standard definition has 480 lines of detail, HD has 1,080, making images sharper
10 times the pixels of ordinary TV - clearer pictures, more vibrant colors and wider images



Order Your DIRECTV HD ReceiverThe DIRECTV HD Receiver will transform the way you watch television with the crispest, highest–quality picture possible. Standard professional installation is included with each receiver leased.

Order Now
*Number of channels subject to available HD programming.
**Based on Bank of America Equity Research report May 2006.
†Based on national offering of exclusive sports packages and other major sports programming in HD.
^Actual recording capacity depends on type of programming being recorded.
SUPERMAN and all related characters and elements are trademarks of and © DC Comics. © 2006 Warner Bros. Entertainment Inc. All rights reserved.

The print at the bottom tells you exactly what their numbers are based on.

 

[ScoBuck]

That isn't the issue that I have been trying to bring to light. The bone that I pick is with the incessant misinformation that gets spewed by the subscribers.

With all due respect - you're trying to have on off-topic discussion. This thread is to discuss D*'s alleged "false advertising" - not misinformation spewed by subs.

 

[harshness]

With all due respect - you're trying to have on off-topic discussion. This thread is to discuss D*'s alleged "false advertising" - not misinformation spewed by subs.

I'm responding to being called out. The courts are deciding what is false advertising.

I have already cited the American Pie commercial as an example of a baldfaced lie saved by fine print. The courts decided that the TWC ads were not appropriate.

It has not been established that there is a pattern of deception, but they're getting dangerously close.

To get entirely back on topic, I would point to any DirecTV advertising that the word "soon" appears in as suspect.

 

[raoul5788]

I'm responding to being called out. The courts are deciding what is false advertising.

I have already cited the American Pie commercial as an example of a baldfaced lie saved by fine print. The courts decided that the TWC ads were not appropriate.

It has not been established that there is a pattern of deception, but they're getting dangerously close.

To get entirely back on topic, I would point to any DirecTV advertising that the word "soon" appears in as suspect.

So you don't think that September is "soon"? BTW, in the Christopher Lloyd ad he says that D* will have the capacity for three times the hd channels as cable. Then the announcer says that soon D* will have up to 150 hd channels. Sounds legit to me, especially considering their plan that they stated in 2005.

 

[harshness]

So you don't think that September is "soon"? BTW, in the Christopher Lloyd ad he says that D* will have the capacity for three times the hd channels as cable. Then the announcer says that soon D* will have up to 150 hd channels. Sounds legit to me, especially considering their plan that they stated in 2005.

Half of the capacity is scheduled to come in September. The rest may not be available for another year. 6-12 months in a three year plan is not "soon".

1. In the near future; shortly.
2. Without hesitation; promptly: came as soon as possible.
3. Before the usual or appointed time; early.
4. With willingness; readily: I'd as soon leave right now.
5. Obsolete Immediately.

 

[charper1]

Half of the capacity is scheduled to come in September. The rest may not be available for another year. 6-12 months in a three year plan is not "soon".

came as soon as possible.

DING!

 

[ScoBuck]

Half of the capacity is scheduled to come in September. The rest may not be available for another year. 6-12 months in a three year plan is not "soon".

1. In the near future; shortly.
2. Without hesitation; promptly: came as soon as possible.
3. Before the usual or appointed time; early.
4. With willingness; readily: I'd as soon leave right now.
5. Obsolete Immediately.

Ok - your position is clear, but your point is?

Obviously there are many that don't feel that the ads are misleading, and many do (but typically NOT the D* subs). Can you accept that?

Are you trying to convince us - or convince yourself?

 

[raoul5788]

Half of the capacity is scheduled to come in September. The rest may not be available for another year. 6-12 months in a three year plan is not "soon".

1. In the near future; shortly.
2. Without hesitation; promptly: came as soon as possible.
3. Before the usual or appointed time; early.
4. With willingness; readily: I'd as soon leave right now.
5. Obsolete Immediately.

Nice the way you twist D*'s own words. Their three year plan was to have 150 channels by the end of 2007. By no fault of their own, one of their sats cannot be launched until 2008. Their plan now is to have 60 hd channels up by the end of September, and more by December, by most accounts. If they do that, they have kept their promise to the best of their ability. If you want to continue to whine about it, go ahead. I will not respond to your childishness any more.

 

[richiephx]

Buy a HDDVD or BluRay player and get the capacity and picture quality that far exceeds that of satellite and cable. Now that's what HD really is.

 

[harshness]

Nice the way you twist D*'s own words. Their three year plan was to have 150 channels by the end of 2007.

It is you that is twisting D*'s own words. In 2004, their words were:

These satellites will have the capacity for more than 1,000 additional local HD channels, more than 150 national HD channels, and other new programming offerings. These satellites will provide DIRECTV the capability to bring local and national HD programming and other advanced services to every U.S. household

Once again, carriage versus capacity.

They By no fault of their own, one of their sats cannot be launched until 2008.

That's why they are now using "up to" instead of "more than".

Their plan now is to have 60 hd channels up by the end of September, and more by December, by most accounts.

Where do you find this version of their plan?

I will not respond to your childishness any more.

I'm offering DirecTV press releases and web links to indicate what DirecTV said. I freely admit that I inject some emphasis here an there, but I'm not twisting their words as you suggest.

 

[FlyingJ]

Buy a HDDVD or BluRay player and get the capacity and picture quality that far exceeds that of satellite and cable. Now that's what HD really is.

Brilliant answer...oh ummm...where do I get my live sports and ummm lets see the shows the wife and kids like and ummm....

Ya see, having a pretty picture is great...but it's the content of the pretty pictures that count.

Harshness. are you a D* sub?

 

[ScoBuck]

I freely admit that I inject some emphasis here an there, but I'm not twisting their words as you suggest.

Again - all of us are entitled to our opinions and that is all this really is. But the argument is a foolish one anyhow at this point in time. Until any of us see what is actually offered and available on December 31st, there is absolutley NO BASIS to claim false advertising.

This is a discussion that can (and WILL) take place then - it will be pretty clear then what the end result is - now it is 100% speculation. In this country, people (and companies) are INNOCENT until proven guilty - and the timeline is still OVER 6 months away.

 

[Newshawk]

Maybe I shouldn't be talking because im a DISH Network person, but they really need to stop with all the false advertising and claiming they are the HD "Lite" leader when even cable in some areas carries more HD than they do!

Claude, there you go again!

C'mon, they need to stop talking about the 100 or so HD channels that they plan on carrying and put their money where their mouth is and actually do it!

Then tell Charlie to stop talking about the new "all MPEG4" E* he's supposed to be launching in December... with less evidence of it happening than the HD expansion that D* is completing now (see here for the latest update on D10: http://www.dbstalk.com/showthread.php?goto=newpost&t=84971._

Every day I get to hear this same crap from customers when compairing DISH to Directv in terms of HD. Sure Dish has over 30 HD channels, but I hear Directv is going to have over 100 by the end of the year.

Claude, Claude, Claude... If you can't effectively counter that arguement with the benefits of E*, then I would question your ability as a salesman. Why don't you just tell them about Charlie's fever dream.. er, MPEG4 plans?

Its just as bad as buying a computer, technology is improving every day. Everyone is afraid to buy today because they hear the latest and greatest is coming out in several months. So they wait several months when the latest and greatest is finally available, and something better is planned to be released a few months later.

Again, use your persuasion skills... tell them about Charlie's plans.

Besides that, if Directv has 100 HD channels like they have been claiming for the past 3 years, who says DISH Network is not going to be able to carry those very same channels?

Nobody's saying that... but how long may D* have an exclusive on some of the channels? Even if it's a few months, then it's still a case of "D* had it first".

They need to put a stop to their false advertising campaign and actually do what they are saying they are going to do, then they can run all the commercials they want saying how much better their package is than everyone else!

So what are you saying? D* can't advertise future plans? How about if that was extended to other industries? What if no movie studio was allowed to advertise upcoming movies until they were actually in the theaters? Or car manufacturers not able to tell you that the new models are coming, but only are allowed to tell you they are already in the showroms? Are you seriously wanting to banish the term "Coming Soon" from all advertising, or only from D*'s advertising, and only because you can't counter the advertising with your sales skills?

 

[ScoBuck]

So what are you saying? D* can't advertise future plans? How about if that was extended to other industries? What if no movie studio was allowed to advertise upcoming movies until they were actually in the theaters? Or car manufacturers not able to tell you that the new models are coming, but only are allowed to tell you they are already in the showroms? Are you seriously wanting to banish the term "Coming Soon" from all advertising, or only from D*'s advertising, and only because you can't counter the advertising with your sales skills?

I really think he is anticipating a severe drop in business

 

[ScoBuck]

I can't wait to see the new advertising campaign they launch once the new Satellite is up in the air. That is really gonna get these folks pi$$ed off.

The timing on all this couldn't be any better for DirecTV - the prime TV selling season starts in Sept and peaks at the Super Bowl.

 

[concorde1]

So does it really matter. If you like Dish stay with Dish. If you Like D* than stay with D*. Not sure why you people want to compare anyway. I have been D* sub for 5+ years and very happy with the service.

 

[ScoBuck]

So does it really matter. If you like Dish stay with Dish. If you Like D* than stay with D*. Not sure why you people want to compare anyway. I have been D* sub for 5+ years and very happy with the service.

Agreed 100% - but if you look at the posts, its NOT D* subs that are complaining about the ads - its the 'happy' E* subs. I am not sure why it bothers them that the competition places ads, after all I am besieged with Cablevision ads (and most are targeting FiOS), as well as FiOS ads (most are targeting Cablevision). IMO, just like most ads, you have to read all of the disclaimers. I take no offense at any of these companies trying to win over new customers - not even back when Cablevision targeted the satcos with the B.S. about reliability. I didn't pay attention to it then, and you better believe THAT WAS FALSE ADVERTISING.

But, I can see why people would want to compare the offerings, after all, in the next 6-12 months the landscape will be changed entirely, and it is a good time to reconsider whomever your current provider is, and see what else is out there, The competition is great, and should make all of them better. I am extememly happy with D* (again 95% because of the sports programming), but if I ever believed that another provider offered me a better choice, I would move in a heartbeat.

 

[raoul5788]

It is you that is twisting D*'s own words. In 2004, their words were:Once again, carriage versus capacity.That's why they are now using "up to" instead of "more than".Where do you find this version of their plan?I'm offering DirecTV press releases and web links to indicate what DirecTV said. I freely admit that I inject some emphasis here an there, but I'm not twisting their words as you suggest.

I know I said I would not reply, but I cannot help myself. This is too easy! You need a lesson in grammar and word meanings, because you do not know what the words capacity and capability mean. Also, why do you not address the fact that D11 cannot be launched until 2008 through no fault of D*?

 

[Hemi 6.1]

Half of the capacity is scheduled to come in September. The rest may not be available for another year. 6-12 months in a three year plan is not "soon".

1. In the near future; shortly.
2. Without hesitation; promptly: came as soon as possible.
3. Before the usual or appointed time; early.
4. With willingness; readily: I'd as soon leave right now.
5. Obsolete Immediately.

When your talking about "soon" You can turn that word into what every you want .Your idea of soon could be alot different then someone elses.Soon they will have 150 HD capacity.But you can't sit there an say thats all the info Directv ever gave was ""SOON"". They gave dates ,They had setbacks as well. D11 's Transportation into space blew-up.What do you want from them! Take D10 and D11 up there yourself,if you think they can't do it ""SOON" enough.!