Are all DVR's and PVR's in trouble?

[tnsprin]

I am surprised this case wasn't against Echostar. Cablevision lost this case, but you can expect that if it were to be upheld all DVR's including E*, D* and TIVO PVR's will be next.
One difference in this case is the Disk space is on Cablevision's servers.
http://www.satelliteguys.us/showthread.php?t=94151

 

[SKrueger]

One difference in this case is the Disk space is on Cablevision's servers.

But that was the big important difference. The argument was that Cablevision was re-broadcasting the material without paying any fees or royalties.

 

[Kaydigi]

What kind if disc space were they giving to customers?

 

[sprintcarcrazy]

Instead of storing the movie at home on the DVR, they are storing it at there building on server hard drives and transmitting to you upon reques from your receiver.

 

[Kaydigi]

Instead of storing the movie at home on the DVR, they are storing it at there building on server hard drives and transmitting to you upon reques from your receiver.

How space much do they let you store?

 

[jcrash]

How space much do they let you store?

That isn't relevant. They would only need one copy of "Heroes Episode 18" and they would rebroadcast it as many times as needed. Get it? You really had no personal copies, they just centralized it all. Sure, your menu system would make you think you only had one thing recorded, but "your" recording of heroes was the same one everyone else had. Thus, they were rebroadcasting it.

 

[Kaydigi]

That isn't relevant. They would only need one copy of "Heroes Episode 18" and they would rebroadcast it as many times as needed. Get it? You really had no personal copies, they just centralized it all. Sure, your menu system would make you think you only had one thing recorded, but "your" recording of heroes was the same one everyone else had. Thus, they were rebroadcasting it.

I get that they are re-broadcasting, I'm just interested in the DVR itself).

I don't get it. On my kids 721 I have a Dora the Explorer Movie recorded from 2005 (yes I bought the DVD also). So I have had it on the DVR for about 2 and half years now.

How are users able to do that on Cablevision? They aren't keeping all episodes of G4's X-PLAY and Discovery's How's it Made on their servers, are they?

 

[rockymtnhigh]

I get that they are re-broadcasting, I'm just interested in the DVR itself).

I don't get it. On my kids 721 I have a Dora the Explorer Movie recorded from 2005 (yes I bought the DVD also). So I have had it on the DVR for about 2 and half years now.

How are users able to do that on Cablevision? They aren't keeping all episodes of G4's X-PLAY and Discovery's How's it Made on their servers, are they?

YOU are storing it in a digital form; but as an end-user its no different if you used a set-top DVD burner and archived it; or gasp, a VCR, to tape it. That is fundamentally different from a cable company re-broadcasting one copy of it over and over again; they are building a video library that they rebroadcast.

 

[Paradox-SJ]

YOU are storing it in a digital form; but as an end-user its no different if you used a set-top DVD burner and archived it; or gasp, a VCR, to tape it. That is fundamentally different from a cable company re-broadcasting one copy of it over and over again; they are building a video library that they rebroadcast.

And how is this DIFFERENT from VOD? Am i to believe that Comca$t has 20 millions of copies of Lost stored so each subscriber can view it at their leasure?

 

[kb7oeb]

They pay for the rights to offer it on VOD

I think a previous poster was asking how many hours could the end user save on his virtual "DVR" and I don't think anyone knows because they were sued and stopped before they were able to run field trials.

 

[Kaydigi]

YOU are storing it in a digital form; but as an end-user its no different if you used a set-top DVD burner and archived it; or gasp, a VCR, to tape it. That is fundamentally different from a cable company re-broadcasting one copy of it over and over again; they are building a video library that they rebroadcast.

So you can't record what you want on a Cablevision DVR? You choose from a huge library that has already been broadcast?

If Wonder Years came on today, can I record it?

I want to know how this works from the user side.

 

[navychop]

You can keep on your DVR what you want for your own personal use. Cablevision kept it on their servers and provided it on demand. This is considered, per the courts, to be rebroadcasting it- without paying for the rights to rebroadcast it. When a cableco provides a program via VOD, they pay the rights holder for the service/right. The courts viewed this virtual DVR scheme as an attempt to get around paying the VOD fee.

 

[Hall]

Safe to say that Cablevision will provide the same, or probably more, than they'd provide with a set-top DVR. Reason they could say more is most customers won't use their allocated amount. Who thinks Google has 2+ gb of mail storage space for every user with a gmail account ??

 

[mike123abc]

That isn't relevant. They would only need one copy of "Heroes Episode 18" and they would rebroadcast it as many times as needed. Get it? You really had no personal copies, they just centralized it all. Sure, your menu system would make you think you only had one thing recorded, but "your" recording of heroes was the same one everyone else had. Thus, they were rebroadcasting it.

This is not what the case was about. Cablevision was going to store a private copy for each and every subscriber that wanted to record the show. They were not going to have 1 copy and just show it to all that wanted to see it. They were trying to save on costs by having all the hard disk space kept at central offices and not in every DVR in the area. All those hard drives are going to crash eventually and they want to be able to have techs in a central location changing out drives as they crash, not having to have service calls to all their customers. They can also save money by sharing hard drive space, they buy 1 TB drives and give everyone up to 150GB of it dynamically allocated as needed.

If you forgot to record your show, you were out of luck just like if you had the DVR at home. Cablevision was trying to argue that this was a private use copy as allowed by the Sony Beta max decision. They lost the case and are now trying to appeal it.