Can you tell which is Dish, DirecTV or OTA? Part 2
- Thread starter Mike Greer
- Start date
- Latest activity Latest activity:
- Replies 16
- Views 3K
- Status
This is obviously a setup
This is obviously a setup
The top one has to be OTA because of the ghosting
The Middle I would say is Dish
The Bottom must be DirecTV
But honestly, I would say the bottom one SHOULD be OTA DTV, that is about how good my OTA's look but they are DTV, my analogs all look like the top image.
This is obviously a setup
The top one has to be OTA because of the ghosting
The Middle I would say is Dish
The Bottom must be DirecTV
But honestly, I would say the bottom one SHOULD be OTA DTV, that is about how good my OTA's look but they are DTV, my analogs all look like the top image.
The top one is OTA....gotta be. Much darker color than the others.
Middle is Dish
Bottom is Direct
Middle is Dish
Bottom is Direct
"This is obviously a setup"
I would would never set you guys up!
Iceberg - things are not always as they seem....
I would would never set you guys up!
Iceberg - things are not always as they seem....
Again, like the other comparison you posted, the ghosting in the top picture indicates that that DBS company is getting their local feed from via analog OTA reception. And it's also obvious that the bottom picture in this comparison is the same "provider" as the middle one in the first comparison. It is sharper, but has some artifacts present. My guess would be that it is the digital OTA feed, since it's the same as the one I thought was the digital OTA feed in the other, which had some clarity to it that made it seem like it was the most "virgin". If that IS the digital OTA signal, the artifacts could be an issue of upconversion (either at the local station, or your STB).
Sorry but I have to ask. It is good that you are making this comparison but you haven't told us what type of connection, receivers and whether those TVs input has been calibrated properly. If you have done calibration to your TV inputs, you need to tell us what calibration methods you have used. Did you calibrate based on each output of each receiver. I mean all these can factor in in the final output in the screen you are posting. Also, consider that the JPG that you are posting here has its own problems as well -- compression.
Given all of this, the best way to test your hypothesis will be to have 3 TVs of the same model, calibrated by the same technician and the same method for all threes receivers for the same input of the TVs and output of the receivers. This assumes that the ouput of the receivers do not have problems in saturation or sharpness or black levels. All these need to be tested as well. Otherwise this assesment is flaw because there are variables that could actually interfere and not give you the results you are seeking. This is just my opinion and it is not intended to bash in any way the original poster or anyone.
I have done my own calibration to S-Video and composite for dish and found that some receivers like the 501 has better picture quality through the composite output than the S-Video. The same is not true for the 721.
Given all of this, the best way to test your hypothesis will be to have 3 TVs of the same model, calibrated by the same technician and the same method for all threes receivers for the same input of the TVs and output of the receivers. This assumes that the ouput of the receivers do not have problems in saturation or sharpness or black levels. All these need to be tested as well. Otherwise this assesment is flaw because there are variables that could actually interfere and not give you the results you are seeking. This is just my opinion and it is not intended to bash in any way the original poster or anyone.
I have done my own calibration to S-Video and composite for dish and found that some receivers like the 501 has better picture quality through the composite output than the S-Video. The same is not true for the 721.
I have never experienced ghosting through true OTA, at all, it's sharp as heck even on Standard broadcasts.. The colors and ghosting tells me this is could be (im going out on a limb here) a digital station rebroadcast through a dish (although I would think this is cable not a dish).
the bottom is the sharper than the middle so I'm going to say this is digital OTA using something like an Svideo... this one is harder than the last.
the bottom is the sharper than the middle so I'm going to say this is digital OTA using something like an Svideo... this one is harder than the last.
This is more like I would expect… No one got it right.
The top is DirecTV, the middle is Dish Network and the bottom is OTA.
The only thing I know for sure about all of this is picture quality is not something that Dish Network or DirecTV are even slightly concerned with. Their “100% Digital Quality” slogan is a simple lie and they should not be able to tell people they will get so called “Digital Quality”. Digital does not mean better or even good. Most people don’t know anything about how this stuff works and Dish Network & DirecTV take advantage of it.
From the samples it is very obvious that DirecTV is using rabbit ears to receive the Salt Lake WB feed. The only thing in question is do they know how to adjust rabbit ears for the best signal. From the samples it appears that Dish Network is using WB’s digital feed – both the OTA digital and Dish network samples look like washed out over-compress junk but at least they don’t also have the analog problems.
I have called DirecTV 3 times over the last few months including today. The first 2 times I called and got the usual speech about how “We have 100% digital quality; there must be a problem with your setup. We’ll send someone out.” After explaining to them how the process works they said they would elevate the problem to whomever’s job it is to ignore complaints about picture quality. Today when I called they just skipped the long speech and went right to the “elevate it” speech. According to 3 different people on 3 different phone calls “no one else has reported problems”. Yea, right! What about me 2 months ago?
Oh – also for those of you with HD Tivo receivers – the HD Tivo tier support people say the only thing they know about audio problems is “if the audio stops, change the channel and change it back” as of a memo dated July 13th that is the temporary fix – a permanent fix is being worked on by DirecTV and Tivo – no other information is available. They also don’t know about the Dolby Digital problem and HD Tivo – apparently the speaker killing cracks and pops are only happening to people who use theses type of web forums. I just chalk that up to more of the “ignore until enough people complain” type of customer service.
The samples actually look worse in motion – nothing like adding all kinds of artifacts to an already watered down picture to make your day!
Theses samples are not pictures from the screen – they are pixel by pixel what the receiver is displaying. I extracted the DirecTV pictures from the hard drive on my SD Tivo (don’t want to void the warranty on my HD Tivo just yet! I’ll let them fix it before I do that.). The OTA samples are from my good old antenna in the attic using my Fusion Digital OTA card to capture the pictures. The Dish Network samples are extracted from my cousin’s Dish Network 501’s hard drive.
No camera tricks or TV adjustments involved – just good ol’ “100% Digital Picture Quality”!
The best part of all this is that while I was driving home from work today I heard a radio ad for a local DirecTV reseller – “DirecTV gives me 100% digital quality so the video and sound quality is like watching a DVD… Not like cable.. blah blah blah” Down right lie – even the best DirecTV SD channels don’t come close to so called “DVD quality”.
Let’s not let them lie any more. How do they sleep at night anyway? What are they? Some new breed of corporate scammers?
The top is DirecTV, the middle is Dish Network and the bottom is OTA.
The only thing I know for sure about all of this is picture quality is not something that Dish Network or DirecTV are even slightly concerned with. Their “100% Digital Quality” slogan is a simple lie and they should not be able to tell people they will get so called “Digital Quality”. Digital does not mean better or even good. Most people don’t know anything about how this stuff works and Dish Network & DirecTV take advantage of it.
From the samples it is very obvious that DirecTV is using rabbit ears to receive the Salt Lake WB feed. The only thing in question is do they know how to adjust rabbit ears for the best signal. From the samples it appears that Dish Network is using WB’s digital feed – both the OTA digital and Dish network samples look like washed out over-compress junk but at least they don’t also have the analog problems.
I have called DirecTV 3 times over the last few months including today. The first 2 times I called and got the usual speech about how “We have 100% digital quality; there must be a problem with your setup. We’ll send someone out.” After explaining to them how the process works they said they would elevate the problem to whomever’s job it is to ignore complaints about picture quality. Today when I called they just skipped the long speech and went right to the “elevate it” speech. According to 3 different people on 3 different phone calls “no one else has reported problems”. Yea, right! What about me 2 months ago?
Oh – also for those of you with HD Tivo receivers – the HD Tivo tier support people say the only thing they know about audio problems is “if the audio stops, change the channel and change it back” as of a memo dated July 13th that is the temporary fix – a permanent fix is being worked on by DirecTV and Tivo – no other information is available. They also don’t know about the Dolby Digital problem and HD Tivo – apparently the speaker killing cracks and pops are only happening to people who use theses type of web forums. I just chalk that up to more of the “ignore until enough people complain” type of customer service.
The samples actually look worse in motion – nothing like adding all kinds of artifacts to an already watered down picture to make your day!
Theses samples are not pictures from the screen – they are pixel by pixel what the receiver is displaying. I extracted the DirecTV pictures from the hard drive on my SD Tivo (don’t want to void the warranty on my HD Tivo just yet! I’ll let them fix it before I do that.). The OTA samples are from my good old antenna in the attic using my Fusion Digital OTA card to capture the pictures. The Dish Network samples are extracted from my cousin’s Dish Network 501’s hard drive.
No camera tricks or TV adjustments involved – just good ol’ “100% Digital Picture Quality”!
The best part of all this is that while I was driving home from work today I heard a radio ad for a local DirecTV reseller – “DirecTV gives me 100% digital quality so the video and sound quality is like watching a DVD… Not like cable.. blah blah blah” Down right lie – even the best DirecTV SD channels don’t come close to so called “DVD quality”.
Let’s not let them lie any more. How do they sleep at night anyway? What are they? Some new breed of corporate scammers?
Where are you directvrep? I'd like to hear from your perspective here. What is the deal? What happend?
directvrep said:To qualify ourselves as " 100% digital quality picture " and " CD quality sound " we must provide no fewer than 400 lines COMPRESSED, up to 512 lines uncompressed quality picture. D* has dropped below 400 lines 1 time in 10 years :shocked ... that was the 1st year of operation when the sat went completely down. Compression ratio does not cut down on the amount of lines PQ provided. The further data is compressed the more it tends to sque... or merge data causing pixelization. We must also continuously provide nothing less than 128 bt/ 16 ccm audio, which as well has only gone down 1 time. If for some reason the data transfer of PQ from your DTV IRD to your TV is " crappy" then I suggest you contact us
Feel free to call, we are tole free and open 24/7 for customer service or tech support call 1-800-531-5000 and if you don't want to wait for the menus, chose option 0 then option 4.
Your Friendly DTV Res Spec
white_knight_2010@yahoo.com
I was right OTA was the bottom, but really how to tell between the two Sats which one was which? I like the CSRs responses, hey if you want better PQ use RCA or S-Video I thought there was only one way to get SD to look better and that's S-Video?
It's easy to say the transmission is "100% Digitial) compression afterall is digital, the signal they are sending you is 10101010 right? Tell you what you do, drop D* and E* on their butt, reward yourself with a nice new HDTV, and head on over to Voom with the cool people. (shameless Voom plug alert)
It's easy to say the transmission is "100% Digitial) compression afterall is digital, the signal they are sending you is 10101010 right? Tell you what you do, drop D* and E* on their butt, reward yourself with a nice new HDTV, and head on over to Voom with the cool people. (shameless Voom plug alert)
I don't get it.. the one you said was DirectV was the best picture of the 3. There was a ghosting effect for some reason. I have never seen satellite ghost before so perhaps just a tivo flaw when you extracted or it happened so fast only the tivo caught it...
No doubt the other 2 images were way too washed out... talk about no black level
No doubt the other 2 images were way too washed out... talk about no black level
Alvarez said:
I agree about the other 2 images being washed out - they look like crap but they are the closest to "100% Digital Quality". The first one from DirecTV is picked up by DirecTV over a very bad analog OTA signal. My guess is that it has better color because WB does a very bad job at compressing their signal to digital and that's what we see OTA and most likely Dish Network is using this signal.
The ghosting is not from the Tivo or extraction - it is the exact signal from DirecTV and sometimes is even worse! The ghosting is always there because the rabbit ears they are picking up the signal with need to be adjusted!
Dvlos said:
I'd love to do the Voom - but they don't have a PVR - right now I have no choice but to use DirecTV if I want an HD PVR.
Maybe someday I'll have a choice but for now DirecTV is my only choice - they seem to be the lessor of the evils!
Here is another sample of the "100% Digital Quality" I pay DirecTV for. The top picture is a bounce in the picture that happens usually when there is a very bright picture. To me it looks like because the haven't re-adjusted their rabbit ears their enoder is loosing vertical sync and the picture jumps up and down for about 1 - 2 seconds.
The second picture is just more of the usual....
Sometimes the ghosting is worse than others - but it is always bad.
This is not a tempory thing either - it has been this way since I subscribe to DirecTV about 3 months ago. I'm sure they are arguing about who has to go adjust the antenna - maybe it will be fixed sometime next year?
The second picture is just more of the usual....
Sometimes the ghosting is worse than others - but it is always bad.
This is not a tempory thing either - it has been this way since I subscribe to DirecTV about 3 months ago. I'm sure they are arguing about who has to go adjust the antenna - maybe it will be fixed sometime next year?
Attachments
Yes but the pictures posted are just rebroadcast's though right? how does the picture look on something like starz or nfl network or something non local.
Alvarez said:
I may borrow my cousins Dish Network receiver again and compare other channels also.
The problem with comparing these things is that the problems don't look as bad with these snap shots - in order to do a fair comparison you would need to have at least 5 minutes of video to look at. I can't do that because of the size of the files and don't want to get into legal trouble. I could judge them on my own and then post the results but then you all would just have to trust my judgement!
- Status
