Chase Carey calls VoOm "crap"...

[CPanther95]

At least acknowledge the problem... Read the a few threads back and some of you sound like there is no problem. At least recognize that there is a problem. Someone reading some of these posts will think that they will get glorious 1920x1080i HDTV on their set and they will not. A good start --- recognize that there is a problem at least. I am not telling you that I have all the answers. I am trying to make you understand that some of you are not correct when you say that there's no problem with the 1080i HD channels on DirecTv.

Just answering your question... Nothing more.

Agreed, you have to acknowledge the problem and keep up the pressure to make PQ a priority. For those who say it's "not bad", "technology is improving", "it will get better" - all you have to do is observe the degradation of SD PQ from D* to realize that PQ is only a priority to the extent that it is marketable. They have shown that since the "100% Digital" message gives them the perceived PQ advantage among consumers - there's been no motivation to actually improve their PQ.

If you can't see the dramatic difference between the early HD Demo & HDNet months and what we are getting today, you're very lucky. It is understandable that you would want as many HD channels as possible without regard to improving HD PQ since you can't see a difference - that's a valid opinion. But it is not a valid opinion to make a blanket statement that it is "good enough" for everybody considering many may not have the same eyesight, distance or display limitations that you do.

Sit back, enjoy your HD, and keep your mouth shut when people are trying to get our providers to make PQ a priority. If we wait until the least discriminating out there start to see the problem, it'll be too late - you'll also save yourselves from looking like selfish, complete idiots for waiting until the PQ erosion affects you before joining the cause, or before you stop trying to hinder it.

 

[vinnyv07]

In my opinion, there is enough on Voom not to call it crap. Everytime I look at Directv's HD pack I get depressed. First....the package is missing TNTHD. I work about 80 hrs a week and I like to have the option of watching some of their movies on the weekend. Second...their HD really doens't look good. Even the HD-lite that is on dish looks better than what Direct provides. I'm sorry but the only provider that is pushing crap is Direct right now....when it comes to HD.
There are problems with the VOOM pack that Dish offers....but how many of you watch every ch that you pay for? I don't pretend that I watch every or even most of the HD ch's that is offered by VOOM......but there is the option of flipping through the ch's to see if anything is on. You just don't have that option on Direct. I love MonstersHD ...TNTHD....I watch RAveHD ...and there are some movies that I have watched on VOOM also. Not to mention that you still have ESPNHD and HDNET and HDNET movies to choose from. Mr. CHase says VOOM is crap....I don't think so. I rather have the VOOM ch's than nothing. VOOM or nothing ....nothing Mr.Chase.

 

[vurbano]

Incorrect, verizon throughout the buffalo area is actually selling off their copper lines to help fund Fiber throught ALL, not just like dsl, fiber has enough bandwith to carry your phone, and televison with more bandwith than dtv and dish can dream about.

That is why DBS has hit its Apex IMO. It made great inroads into cable territories. But that day is over end it will soon start decreasing as FIOS grows. Even wall street recognizes that in their recent downgrades in DBS stocks. The DBS internet experiment failed, DBS phone service would fail as well, and now HDlite is the result of DBS bandwidth problems. IMO this is the beginning of the end for DBS. I for one am not looking forward to having a birdbath sized 5 LNB monster strapped to my roof. And anyone that tells you they dont lose signal during a heavy storm is simply lying. As soon as Verizon finishes in my area Im going to FIOS.

 

[Satmeister]

You might want to read this all the way through (or not), so everyone can move on to accomplish something, rather than just complain day in and day out. First let me address a few of the specific issues.

Who is getting to a pissing contest. You are expressing your opinitions and we are expressing ours with some real facts about the state of HDTV on DirecTv.

The difference is your "opinions" and those of others here are littered with condecending insults that infer anyone who likes what they see on DirecTV is a fool. Apparently, there are 15 Million SD and 750,000 HD service-paying fools out there. Many of us stated more than once that we believe things are NOT perfect, but OK now and that things will only get better - whereas bashers jump in at a moments notice and insult anytime who states any positive things.

The delivery of any terrestrial or satellite signal is a science. One which can get have very complicated mathematical equations. Especially when you are working with Harmonic Encoders.

It's such a science that those same engineers cannot ever explain digital broadcast transmission anomolies, have to repeatedly intervene in unexplainable equipment malfunctions, and manually make switches (real time) to address broadcast inconsistencies. If someone sits in the TNT or ESPN HD engineering booths, they would see just how "calm and scientific" things are - panic occasionally sets in because of things happening in HD broadcasts that are anything by science. It's even worse at local affiliate stations. The point on this was that while the plan to deliver HD is pure science, the execution is not always science.

I thought that this was a free forum. Is it so bad that some us do not believe the statement. Do we have to believe it? no sir.

You absolutely have every right on a free forum to believe whatever you want - and I'd be the first person to defend you. However, please don't do it at the expense of others with a different opinion.

You are taking it the wrong way. You made various remarks which are quite wrong and we try to inform you about the correct information.

No, I think we're taking it just as it was intended. If you don't like seeing something, fine, but don't tell anyone else here we are any less knowledgeable, intelligent, or experienced in HD observations just because we don't agree.

*
Now that I got that off my chest, let me conclude by personally thanking you, Sean, and the others for your opinions. We obviously disagree on some points, but some of your comments (except those that don't clearly insult us) have as much value as any of our posts - maybe even more from time to time.

That said, here's the bottom line for those here who think there are shortcomings with DirecTV - what are YOU doing to constructively address your position that DirecTV is failing to deliver your vision of HD? What won't accomplish anything is constant whining, crying, bantoring, insulting, or daily waking up thinking that anyone has all the answers. Individual complaints among 15 Million people generally does little.

Here's a suggestion - someone draft a good old fashioned letter with well-thought-out, non-emotional, clearly worded "issues" statements - get a few hundred or thousand people to sign it, and send it certified mail directly to Chase Carey. Publish this same "open letter to Chase Casey" here on a new sticky thread, and see what happens. Maybe throw in a copy to Phillip Swan, Sound and Vision Magazine, or other media outlet to see if they can get the "movement" a little added publicity. Who knows, someone who can really ACT UPON your concerns may actually LISTEN and DO SOMETHING. Stranger things have happened.

 

[bgsmallwood]

To me CC sounded very DEFENSIVE when he said Voom stuff is crap and the obvious question is why?

D* chooses to emphasize all kinds of other diversions (CD USA, gambling, dating) because they can't deliver on the HD front. Whether it is because of a failure of management to come up with a vision and implementation or they just don't want to spend the money or they are just stubborn. I have lost faith that the management of this company has a clear technology plan to get them where they need to be in 2 or 3 years time. I know everyone is saying that they will have lots of HD channels once the next 2 sats go up but I doubt it. I don't think they will want to pay for the content and will be tempted to fill those sats with all kinds of in-house created diversions.

 

[dragon002]

That is why DBS has hit its Apex IMO. It made great inroads into cable territories. But that day is over end it will soon start decreasing as FIOS grows. Even wall street recognizes that in their recent downgrades in DBS stocks. The DBS internet experiment failed, DBS phone service would fail as well, and now HDlite is the result of DBS bandwidth problems. IMO this is the beginning of the end for DBS. I for one am not looking forward to having a birdbath sized 5 LNB monster strapped to my roof. And anyone that tells you they dont lose signal during a heavy storm is simply lying. As soon as Verizon finishes in my area Im going to FIOS.

vurbano.

you are usually pretty level headed. fios will only be in the urban and hi density suburbs. good lord some people act like fios is the second coming . they will have thier problems, issues and price increases as do the cablecos ans satcasters..

 

[CPanther95]

Many of us stated more than once that we believe things are NOT perfect, but OK now and that things will only get better - whereas bashers jump in at a moments notice and insult anytime who states any positive things.

Except, you don't say "OK" you say "excellent", "tops" better than E* and Comcast.

I know that in my area, my HD viewing is not only excellent, its tops among at least 2 dozen of us who repeatedly visit each other's homes and view each other's HD programming. It includes a mix of large DLP and Plasma TVs, as well as DLP and CRT projectors. That's not MY opinion, that's a unanimous opinion of the other people, who have told ME that.

It's hyperbole like that which takes it from opinion to propaganda. Repeating the same mantra about the scores of unbiased viewers who have the same "opinion" you do has no relevance (no matter how many screen names you post the same thing under).

D* is my choice of provider - and if I had no investment in D* equipment and were choosing a provider today - I'd still choose D*. The reduced HD PQ is not significant enough of an issue to offset the many other reasons I have D*. However, ignoring the issue of PQ - or claiming that reduced bitrate and resolution does not affect PQ, is ridiculous. It is not just an "opinion" where we "agree to disagree". These are facts and you don't just disagree with facts - if you can't see the difference, it is your equipment, eyes, or seating distance (assuming you even have an HDTV). Your limitations don't change the facts, they only result in you not being able to distinguish a difference.

If you don't like seeing something, fine, but don't tell anyone else here we are any less knowledgeable, intelligent, or experienced in HD observations just because we don't agree.

You can tell me you don't notice a difference between a 4:3 TV and a 16:9 TV and have the opinion that one is no better than the other - but when you try to tell people that the 16:9 TV is no wider, and 12 of your friends agree with you - you are no longer offering an opinion, you are in conflict with the facts - and that would make you less knowledgable, intelligent or experienced (take your pick).

 

[herdfan]

This discussion was about Chase calling VOOM crap.

VOOM is shown in HD Lite.

Wouldn't it be ironic if CC was calling it crap because it is HD-Lite?

I got some heat for my exagerated statement of the importance of HD subs. If we are so unimportant, then why is D* spending Billions to provide HD networks? Simple, they want to pull more higher-end subs (HDer's) from cable. They sure aren't launching the networks in HD to attract more SD TCer's.

So right now they are caught between a rock and a hard place. They want to attract high dollar city subs, but for the most part they can't compete with cable in terms of national channels. Even Charter and Adephia here in the #64 market beat D* in terms of national channels.

CC called V* crap because Charlie caught him off guard.

 

[Satmeister]

These are facts and you don't just disagree with facts - if you can't see the difference, it is your equipment, eyes, or seating distance (assuming you even have an HDTV). Your limitations don't change the facts, they only result in you not being able to distinguish a difference.

They're obviously YOUR "facts", because YOU said them. We all see plenty of difference, and the difference is that DirecTV is decidely superior in pQ, in the specific sites observed, to the other providers HDTV PQ at those other locations.

You can tell me you don't notice a difference between a 4:3 TV and a 16:9 TV and have the opinion that one is no better than the other - but when you try to tell people that the 16:9 TV is no wider, and 12 of your friends agree with you - you are no longer offering an opinion, you are in conflict with the facts - and that would make you less knowledgable, intelligent or experienced (take your pick).

Who the heck ever said anything about 4:3 and 16:9? Your point is obtuse at best. Apples and refrigerators.

When dozens of people are 100% in agreement at a specific location. on what they ALL see - it is what it is. Live with it.

Two immediate neighbors with DISH HD and Comcast HD (both of which who had dumping those services the past 30-60 days) have seen HD here for hours on end, and both have done their OWN comparisons (as have I) with their own HD PQ. I can point you to hundreds of posts on how customers of those particular services that switched to DirecTV felt that the DirecTV service was "clearly superior", "much better picture quality", "drastically improved PQ" and the like. What does it all mean. In this part of the world, or those other posters, DirecTV is not "a problem". If it is by you, sorry to hear that. Hopefully your issues can be resolved ASAP. You and everyone else with DirecTV should get quality HD service. Perhaps you'll all be singing a new song in the next 3-15 months when the rest of the sats are up and both bandwidth and content growth exponentially. Right now, the "bashing song" sounds like the off key tunes on American Idol.

 

[CPanther95]

No matter how many of your multiple personalities (or as you call them, "friends") make the same observation, it doesn't change the fact that reduced resolution and bitrate has an impact on picture quality. Repeat a thousand times that you can't see a difference - or even more ridiculously that the reduction results in superior PQ - it only shows your own ignorance, or at best, poor eyesight.

That's what's similar to the TV analogy. You telling us that a reduction in bitrate/resolution results in "superior PQ" is the equivalent of telling us that a 16:9 TV is square. It's not an "opinion", it's just flat out wrong.

 

[Satmeister]

No matter how many of your multiple personalities (or as you call them, "friends")

- it only shows your own ignorance, or at best, poor eyesight.

Totally lame attempt at cleaver - Multiple personalities? - now even YOU have reached a new low. Still weeping over the Panther's loss in the playoffs, huh?

The bottom answer from every naysayer - everyone else is ignorant or blind because others like what they see. How compelling.

Chances are when DirecTV naysayers get a dedicated transponder just for their home with 1000mbps per channel, they'll still not be satisfied. Such is life. :neener

 

[CPanther95]

"The world is flat - I've seen the edge - all my friends have seen the edge - I've bet a hundred people and they've all lost the bet - I'm not ignorant, it's just my opinion - we can agree to disagree"

 

[Satmeister]

"The world is flat - I've seen the edge - all my friends have seen the edge - I've bet a hundred people and they've all lost the bet - I'm not ignorant, it's just my opinion - we can agree to disagree"

Thanks for proving my point about your lack of one.

 

[vurbano]

vurbano.

you are usually pretty level headed. fios will only be in the urban and hi density suburbs. good lord some people act like fios is the second coming . they will have thier problems, issues and price increases as do the cablecos ans satcasters..

ANd those are the areas that D* and E* need to grow their numbers. Where they are battling cable. The game is over or near over IMO as FIOS develops in those areas because that is where the potential customer base is located. D* and E* took the rural non cable areas years ago. I live in one of those dense areas where I have seen Dishes flying up onto roofs over the past 2-3 years due to HDTV on DBS and non availability of local HD network affialiates on cable, but those Dishes are going in the trash can as soon as Verizon offers FIOS. Its already happening in cities near here.

 

[sixteenbynine]

As I said before:

These guys in 20 years:

"Anything in less than 5500p 360 degree 3D holographic with Dolby 99.1 and Smell-O-Rama and Taste-O-Riffic is unwatchable."

 

[CPanther95]

There's a big difference between "unwatchable" and disputing the claims that degrading the signal improves the PQ.

 

[vinnyv07]

I have both Directv an Dishnet and I would take Dishnet PQ for HD over Directv PQ for HD anyday. However, Directv's PQ on STD ch's is a bit better than DIshnet's. But I'm waiting for Directv's HD pack to improve before I make a choice. I don't think anyone in here could be truely satisfied with what Directv is offering as far as HD goes. They won't add TNTHD....they won't add StarzHD....they won't add any movie ch's in HD....mainly because it won't translate into any cash for them. If you are happy with that HD pack and its PQ then you most likely will be happy with anything that is provided. There is a huge difference in PQ as far as HD goes between the two providers.

 

[boston area dtv]

Twelve pages, what a moronathon. Wheres the petition I will sign. Send it to everyone..Egren, Murdoch, Chase, FTC, CIA, FTA, MADD. and the PTO. Lets go baby.

No more whining, no more fighting. This thread is giving ma a popsicle headache.

I have DIRECTV because they offer what noone else does, the Sunday Ticket. IMO that trumps the other providers.

Does it make my opinion right? Hell no. Do I want change hell yeah. I call and annoy the people at Directv all the time...ALL THE TIME.

Lets get going you guys are the experts. Im ready to move forward to see what I can do to solve this. For everyone that says oh just cancel your subscription be real. Thats like telling sports fans that dont like the way a team is going to boycott the stadium. Its just unrealistic.

 

[NVBlue]

VoOm was crap. He was right.

 

[T2k]

That is why DBS has hit its Apex IMO. It made great inroads into cable territories. But that day is over end it will soon start decreasing as FIOS grows. Even wall street recognizes that in their recent downgrades in DBS stocks. The DBS internet experiment failed, DBS phone service would fail as well, and now HDlite is the result of DBS bandwidth problems. IMO this is the beginning of the end for DBS. I for one am not looking forward to having a birdbath sized 5 LNB monster strapped to my roof. And anyone that tells you they dont lose signal during a heavy storm is simply lying. As soon as Verizon finishes in my area Im going to FIOS.

1. Cable is much more f*cked than anyone here, in NYC - they are completely screwed by their lack of bandwidth, they cannot send up another bird.

2. After my initial Voom setup was upgraded, I NEVER LOST signal again. NEVER EVER.