Help me get a sat signal... any sat signal

[redhat27]

Hello all...

I apologize in advance for this long post.

I am very new to FTA. Over over 3 years now, I have been using a Channelmaster 4228 8 bay UHF antenna with a CM 7777 preamp to get very decent OTA terrestrial channels with the Samsung SIR-TS360 receiver.

I stay in Yuba City (zip: 95991) and the closest tx stations are 35 miles away.

Having enjoyed OTA HD for over 3 years (never subscribed to any dish/cable ) I thought of entering the satellite arena with a $175 receiver from eBay (Diamond 9000HD) which boasts of PVR, DiSEqC 1.2/USALS among other things. On the downside, I do not think it supports blind scans.

I also got a 39 inch dish, a universal "bullet" LNB and a GeoSat Pro GS-120 motor from SatelliteAV

Being a penny pincher , I did the installs myself, mounting the dish motor (and the dish) to the pole that holds my antenna. (Now please don't get me wrong: The dish is very stable and does not sway with winds: It is secured to the pole between the two anchors of a chimney mount very securely) I got the install parameters (angles, azimuth, elevations and such from the site Satellite Look Angles Satellite Heading Calculator Azimuth Elevation Skew Tilt LNBF Latitude and Longitude values)

I have the two RG-6 cables (coming from my existing CM-4228 antenna and the newly installed motorized dish) going to a combiner (in my attic) and then
a single RG-6 cable going downstairs to the Diamond 9000HD. It has a diplexer just before it enters the receiver (one to ANT input, one to SAT)

Now with the new Diamond 9000HD receiver, I am now able to get all my terrestrial OTA channels, like I did before with my old SIR-TS360. But the problem is with the satellite feed: I am not able to get a lock on any satellite: When in the satellite menu for any of the preprogrammed satellite, the LNB power meter shows 80 to 97% power, but the quality meter reads at a constant 2%. Scanning for channels always comes up with 0 channels. I have seen the dish moves via the receiver: there is a green light on the motor like the manual says it would and blinking light when moving.

I tried with the 97.0 W IA-5 and some other satellites. No difference. I have followed the installation directions to the word, but still I do not have a signal quality reading on the on-screen meter, so I had my wife on a wireless intercom in from of the TV while I was on the roof to change the angles to get a reading on the quality meter. I varied the dish azimuth and elevation by as much as 30 degrees, but no luck.

If you had the patience to read all of my long post and have a suggestion for me to get *any* satellite channel, I will be very grateful.

 

[jayelem]

I would keep the instalation very simple until you get a signal , I have a diplexer too but that came much later after I had my system setup.

Use a small TV next to your dish and move your dish in very small increments as you search for a signal , it's been suggested to try and get a few satellites before motorizing it .

Personally .... I used one of those cheap analog $10 sat meters and found it very usefull.

 

[Lak7]

You need to confirm your LNB as "Universal" vs. "Standard". It is easier if you can be exact with your equip. The reason I ask is I thought the "Bullet" was a Standard LNB. It makes a differance in setup. I have a Diamind 900 too.

True South Sat(motor at Zero): Galaxy 10R - TP Freq: 11720 Polarity: Vert Scan Rate:27692

Motor / Dish Settings:
Motor Latitude Angle: 39.0°

Azimuth (magn.): 165.0° using Compass

Dish elevation: 24°

 

[redhat27]

Lak7: The LNB is this one: SINGLE UNV FTA SATELLITE LNBF- MINI - SatelliteAV, LLC.

I have a question though: what is the frequency range for this? I lost the box for this LNB, but the site says 10.70 to 12.20 GHz on the top (in the heading in red) and then "L.O. Frequency" as 9.75 to 10.60 GHz under specs...


jayelem: I am now bidding on a sat finder signal meter... Will get it in a few days.. Will update the post with the results.

Thank you very much for your replys

 

[qwert1515]

You need to use a LO frequency of 10600 MHz (10.600 GHz) for the 11.70 - 12.75 GHz band and a LO Frequency of 9750 MHz (9.750 GHz) for the 10.70 - 11.70 GHz (Mainly used in Europe or for 58.0°W Intelsat 9 Ku).

 

[Lak7]

You need to select "Universal" for the LNB type
Then the LO Low=9750 and Lo High = 10600.

Are you using any switches. A Universal LNB should not be used with a 22Khz switch.
Is your "combiner" actually a Diplexer?

Is it easy to get to the Dish?

 

[redhat27]

> Is your "combiner" actually a Diplexer?

It is a Winegard DP-3020 Dual Satellite Off Air Diplexer that I am using as a combiner (picture attached)

I have the Sat_in_1 and the Ant_in connected. Sat_in_2 is capped with a 75 ohm terminator. Rec_1 is going to the 9000HD receiver. Rec_2 is going to another TV directly which has an HD tuner for the OTA channels. Not setup for Sat channels on that one.


> Is it easy to get to the Dish?
No, not really. I have a 24' extension ladder that I use to get up on the roof of my 2 story house. The chimney is right at the edge, and there is only corner that I can use on the chimney to get a good view of the Southern sky. The roof has concrete tiles, and I already seem to have loosened a few around the base of the chimney as I've gone up 5-6 times while installing it and trying to get it to work.

I'll try to post a picture of the setup when I get a chance.

 

[Lak7]

I would set up with out the switch but......
I can't read the switch, but make sure you are connected to the one that has the 22Khz ON. A Universal LNB has a built-in 22Khz switch to go from LO Low to LO High. You need the LO High for North American Signals. Unless you plan on watching the Eastern Atlantic Sats, I would change to a Standard Linear LNB. If it is at all possible, I would do a temp setup on the ground(with decent Line Of Site). Then on the ground you could get most of the tweaking done. Another FYI, the elevation markings are usually off by a few deg., they will get you close.

 

[redhat27]

As far as I know there is no 22kHz switch on the combiner...

 

[Lak7]

It has to go from Sat 1 to Sat 2 somehow. I googled the switch and it is DirecTV approved. If I were to guess, Sat 2 is 22Khz ON.
I would try connecting the LNB to the Sat 2 port and see if you get anything.

 

[Wescopc]

Never put a terminator on a LNB port. The receiver when selecting that port sends 13/18 volts to the LNB. That would be over 4 watts to the resistor - on a 1/8 watt resistor! Put a cap on the switch port if you want to protect it from the elements.
Bob

 

[USDownlink]

I have an urge to slow down this thread a bit, things look like they are going slightly askew..

I would set up with out the switch but...... I can't read the switch, but make sure you are connected to the one that has the 22Khz ON.

It's not a switch. No 22kHz involved on the piece in question.

Is your "combiner" actually a Diplexer?

Actually more of an aside to the reason for my post, but I'm reading this as essentially a semantic difference (within the constraints of discussing the DP-3020; anywhere else it would make sense to differentiate more clearly). I might call it a sort of fancy diplexer, but it is indeed labeled with the word "combiner". Additionally, I don't quite like it because of the 12V it makes available on the OTA input. I'm sure there is a reason, but it isn't clear, I've never come across an application that required it. The downside to this, however, is clear to me. None of this is important at this stage, though.

Never put a terminator on a LNB port. ... That would be over 4 watts to the resistor - on a 1/8 watt resistor! Put a cap on the switch port if you want to protect it from the elements.

Excellent advice. (Although I believe those terminators are usually 0.5w to 1w. Still too small, but while I'm nitpicking... ) No reason to run up to the attic in a panic, however, because:

Rec_2 is going to another TV directly which has an HD tuner for the OTA channels. Not setup for Sat channels on that one.

So the terminator won't see any DC in this configuration. However, do remove it when you go up there next time, red.

Now what to do next? I'll agree with Lak7 and jayelem - get the "thing" out of the line, go to the simplest possible cable configuration. Combining Lak7's and jayelem's further suggestions, forgetting the motor momentarily and bringing it to the ground is also something to consider doing. Find any signal in an easy-to-access fixed-satellite position. This will verify the LNB, cabling, and receiver are all okay, which we cannot say with any certainty now. Is this an option for you?

 

[redhat27]

Additionally, I don't quite like it because of the 12V it makes available on the OTA input. I'm sure there is a reason, but it isn't clear

My guess is it would serve to power a rotor to turn a directional terrestrial antenna. I am not using any antenna rotor though.

But thanks downlink, I'll be sure to remove the terminator. I did panic a bit for an instant till I read your post... Thought I had shorted/overloaded my new receiver.

I am going to bring the dish down only as the last resort (its quite heavy and its perched up high on the pole mounted to the chimney with about 26-28 ft straight drop to the concrete backyard) I've been a fool in not trying this out first before lugging it up there...

I am going to try going up there with the sat signal finder with a audio tone (should arrive in a few days) and try to move the dish around a bit. My guess is the azimuth is wrong... I used a common compass to guesstimate a position of 165°, unlike the latitude setting (on the dish motor) and the elevation setting (on the dish)

All the posts have been very helpful. This is a great forum. :up

True South Sat(motor at Zero): Galaxy 10R - TP Freq: 11720 Polarity: Vert Scan Rate:27692

I will try this satellite to test the signal. There is a GOTO zero command on the receiver

 

[rv1pop]

The 12V on the OTA input is to power an amplified antenna.
And, FYI with the power output, that end is called a combining diplexer! It mates with a dividing (or power insertion, if needed - which you do not) diplexer.... Just FYI (boy, that goes back 40 years!).

 

[red2grass]

I read through this thread and noticed that you seemed to install the dish according to the compass readings, scales on the dish etc and go back to scan the channels. FTA is not OTA, OTA approach for FTA guarantees no signal. You machanical settings on the motor and dish only have millimeters of tolerance of error. You would have to bring a TV and receiver next to the dish and fine tuning the azimuth and elevation angles to lock on anything. In comparison you can turn your CM4228 5 to 10 degrees on each side still getting an OTA digital channel.
Another important thing is to start simple. Don't combine cables with OTA don't even try a motor first.
1. Try a stationary installation first to get one satellite. This will make sure all the settings on your receiver are correct.
2. Try a motor. The mounting pole must be plumb. Go from 1 to 2 is not very trivial for first timers. I spent the whole weekend get to a motor work first time while I could aim a stationary dish to a sat within a few mintutes.
3. Now you can try fancy combinations with OTA.