Need Birdview experts!

[phlatwound]

Here's the plan, Kevin....I will pull the bushing from my mount within the next couple of days and send it to our resident Birdview guru, Linuxman. He will take it to his machinist and get you some measurements and pics.

 

[kevinv]

I just finished putting up my birdview solid. When I was cleaning up the upper pivot/rack gear I found the offset sleeve bearing completely seized on the pivot so the sleeve was pivoting on the frame. This sleeve is for setting the gear spacing with the worm gear. This bearing should be held in place on the frame by two set screws, the pivot/rack turns in it. My dish would turn about half the arch and then seize. The offset bearing on mine was very hard to get off (I used heat and a pipe wrench). I ended up polishing the bearing and pivot with polishing rouge to clean them up and get it working again. This fix will probably require you to pull the whole transmission out.
When you mentioned using the visegrip, it sounded familiar to me.

This sounds very similar to the problem I had..as when the problem occurs, the dish will only move "maybe" an inch either way before seizing up. Through man-handling the dish I am able to get it moving again, but it's only a matter of time before I will get the dreaded phone call from my parent's telling me the dish quit moving.

Can you be a bit more specific as to where the "offset sleeve bearing" is??

 

[N0EXE]

This sounds very similar to the problem I had..as when the problem occurs, the dish will only move "maybe" an inch either way before seizing up. Through man-handling the dish I am able to get it moving again, but it's only a matter of time before I will get the dreaded phone call from my parent's telling me the dish quit moving.

Can you be a bit more specific as to where the "offset sleeve bearing" is??

OK, if you look at the pivot pin side of the rack gear (top) you should see a spacer like round piece with notches in it. It is between the rack and cast frame of the transmission. The notches are for a tool (screwdriver, allen wrench, rod, whatever) to turn the offset bearing in the cast frame and adjust the spacing of the gears. On both sides of the cast frame are allen screws which should be keeping the offset bearing from moving. If you move the dish (while watching the rack move) the notched piece 'should not move', also try moving the spacer with the tool. If it moves, this is the problem. The offset sleeve is turning in the cast frame and changing the space between the gears and binding them up.

Fix: Loosen the allen screws, stick your tool in the notches and adjust the gear spacing, tighten the allen screws.

If the sleeve will not move independent of the rack gear, you have the same problem I had, offset bearing siezed to the pivot pin.

Fix: Time to remove the whole top mount plate from the dish (4 bolts on the rack, 6 on the dish) and put it on the bench. Yeah, that means probably taking the dish off the post unless you can support it. Warning: The top plate assembly is REALLY heavy, I used a crane to get mine in place, it was too heavy to haul up the ladder.

Hope you get the easy one. If not, let me know and I'll try to walk you through the repair.
Michael

 

[kevinv]

I believe I know exactly what this "notched" piece is that you are referring to. In fact, I have a new one that was given to me many years ago by a local satellite installation shop that was going out of business. They had a few spare Birdview parts and just gave them to me. It's about 3 inches or so in diameter with (I think) 4 notches cut into the edge, evenly spaced apart. Along the inner edge are a series of small ridges (for lack of a better term). Below the notched collar is a sleeve which is slightly smaller in diameter and about 2-3 inches in length. Basically it looks like a fat "T." Until now, I had no idea what this part was for. It appeared to be made out of aluminum, but I am not positive.

The "offset bearing" that apparently is inside this "notched" piece...is that what adjusts the space between the worm drive and the gear?

Again, I won't be near the dish until I visit my parents during the Thanksgiving weekend...so can't take a closer look until then.

I greatly appreciate all this info. What I have learned from you and the other Birdview users on this forum has been priceless. It's been a pain trying to figure out the guts of these dishes without any sort of installation or shop manual.

Kevin (N7AVS)

 

[phlatwound]

Here's the plan, Kevin....I will pull the bushing from my mount within the next couple of days and send it to our resident Birdview guru, Linuxman. He will take it to his machinist and get you some measurements and pics.

Update: The bushing has arrived at the Birdview Reclamation & Analysis Center (aka Linuxman's casa), should have measurements and pics within the next few days.

 

[linuxman]

Here is the long awaited "drawing" of the pivot bushing for your Birdview dish.

Sorry it took so long, but I had to co-ordinate with my Buddy to get the measurements.

The drawing is not to scale but is in fact pictures with corresponding lines drawn for dimensions that were taken with a Caliper. My Buddy said it was made out of brass, and it could be possible to find one of the same dimensions at a motor shop, or parts supply house.

Hope it helps Kevin!



EDIT: The bushing is now headed back to Phlatwound via USPS First Class mail!

 

[kevinv]

I appreciate GREATLY the time and expense you all put into this. I will pass this info on to someone that will know how to make one. Also will look more into the "offset bearing" that N0EXE mentioned. Can't do much until the Thanksgiving weekend when I am in the area.

At present, the dish is working normally, despite half of the top pivot bushing being broken off.

 

[linuxman]

I appreciate GREATLY the time and expense you all put into this. I will pass this info on to someone that will know how to make one. Also will look more into the "offset bearing" that N0EXE mentioned. Can't do much until the Thanksgiving weekend when I am in the area.

At present, the dish is working normally, despite half of the top pivot bushing being broken off.

No Problem!

That's what we are here for!

My only regret is in not being more specific about "worrying" the top bushings out.

I used 3 flat screw-drivers and would wiggle and turn each one in turn a little at a time until I coaxed it out of the hole. It took me at least a half an hour to get it out.

Might have save you the broken collar.

 

[phlatwound]

.....EDIT: The bushing is now headed back to Phlatwound via USPS First Class mail!

The bushing is back home, safe and sound, thanks.

 

[Anole]

restoration and renovation

I talked to my machinist buddy today about making some of these.
He sounded pretty confident he could make up a dozen or so, and the bulk of the cost would be in the raw material.
(Which could be substantial)

Does anyone have some pictures of where they are fitted?
I've never seen this piece in any Birdview pictures , anywhere.
Some of the dimensions are probably critical, but some would not be, based on its use.
Which surfaces are critical? (needs discussion)

Also, is this the piece some of you have "broken" the lip off?
Brass should bend or deform, but breaking it doesn't sound right.
Has it been determined for sure this is standard brass, all the way through?
(critical question)

Also, are there other pieces to be fabricated?
After reading the comments above, I'm glad the offset gear adjustment is not part of this.
If it had been, and the hole needed to be offset, that could have been accommodated, but since it's not, that's wonderful!

There is some talk of making up the magnet wheel, and I'll look into that in the appropriate thread.


edit: By the way, making one of these brass pieces would cost a lot, but making a bunch of 'em all at once would lower the average price.
Obviously, if you do one "production run", ya need to be absolutely confident the parts are made right the first time.

It would be helpful to get a clue how many folks would want to get one (even as a spare).
For instance, I'd want two. One for a future dish, and one if I were to need to help out a friend in the future.
And that goes hand-in-hand with the eventual price being so reasonable, no one would mind getting in on the deal.

 

[14karat]

McMaster-Carr
Search for part number 6338K441
It's too long, but otherwise, will it work? (Under $5)

 

[stogie5150]

Does anyone have some pictures of where they are fitted?
I've never seen this piece in any Birdview pictures , anywhere.
Some of the dimensions are probably critical, but some would not be, based on its use.
Which surfaces are critical? (needs discussion)

Had I known I could have taken pics. I just got mine out Friday. I called Linuxman before I did it, but mine really came out easily, I started with a couple putty knives and lots of PB Blaster, then moved up to small screwdrivers. But, be aware, I have metalworking experience, so I know what 'taking it easy" is...plus mine was VERY clean inside once I got it out, Linuxman advises me that they aren't all as easy as mine was to remove, that some of them were nasty inside, therefore making the bushing hard to get out.
I would guess that they would need to be made exactly to the dimensions that Linuxman posted. It is a press fit, but I would call it a 'loose' press fit. I started it back in with a plastic hammer, then I put huge washers on the bolt, and used the nut to slowly press the bushing in place.

Also, is this the piece some of you have "broken" the lip off?
Brass should bend or deform, but breaking it doesn't sound right.
Has it been determined for sure this is standard brass, all the way through?
(critical question)

Yes, undoubtedly this is the piece that can and will be broken if care is not taken. It is VERY soft. From looking at mine when I took it off I would guess it is some form of bronze bushing material. My guess also would be as long as the material is softer than the steel bolt it would be fine. But you want it hard enough so it doesn't wear out in six months....LOL

Also, are there other pieces to be fabricated?
After reading the comments above, I'm glad the offset gear adjustment is not part of this.
If it had been, and the hole needed to be offset, that could have been accommodated, but since it's not, that's wonderful!

There is some talk of making up the magnet wheel, and I'll look into that in the appropriate thread.

My magnet wheel is different. My wheel is on the MOTOR side of the shaft. Linuxman got a phonecall on this one too. The magnets are imbedded within the wheel, it just looks like a steel wheel there. Maybe an older mod, I dunno.

By the way, making one of these brass pieces would cost a lot, but making a bunch of 'em all at once would lower the average price.
Obviously, if you do one "production run", ya need to be absolutely confident the parts are made right the first time.

It would be helpful to get a clue how many folks would want to get one (even as a spare).
For instance, I'd want two. One for a future dish, and one if I were to need to help out a friend in the future.
And that goes hand-in-hand with the eventual price being so reasonable, no one would mind getting in on the deal.

Man, I don't know. Once you get it out and shoot some white grease under it and put it back in, you might NEVER need to take it out again. EVER. So,unless for some reason B'views take off like a rocketship again with a c-band resurgance (fat chance of that) there will be little need for them.
BUT, if someone's doing an order, hell, sign me up for a couple if it helps getting the price down.

 

[linuxman]

McMaster-Carr
Search for part number 6338K441
It's too long, but otherwise, will it work? (Under $5)

I'll go along with what Stogie said above.

As far as the part 14Karat refers to, the dimensions aren't exactly the same, but the critical one is the length which would have to be cut down to size.

I don't mean cut off with a hack saw either. It would have to be milled down to the proper length. These are machined parts and as such require machined surfaces to do their job properly.

EDIT: Here is a picture of the nut and bushing assembly. The bushing goes upside down and the flange you see under the nut is the top part that lays on the steel plate.

 

[14karat]

It could easily be cut down to the exact size with a lathe. Not sure how much the machinist was looking at to mill & lathe the entire bushing, but for 5 bucks and about 10 minutes of lathe work each, I would think cost would be minimal...

 

[1captain]

Also, is this the piece some of you have "broken" the lip off?
Brass should bend or deform, but breaking it doesn't sound right.
Has it been determined for sure this is standard brass, all the way through?
(critical question)


Talked to my old boss yesterday that got me into satellite years ago, an he was a Birdview dealer here in FL. an this is what he told me about that bushing, that it is made from "Oil-lite Bronze" an that type of metal will absorb oil. he also said the best way to lube those bushing is to soak in oil over nite, then lube an reinstall. before yesterday never heard of a oil-lite before, so maybe this is a type of metal that is not that ready avaible anymore.

 

[Cadsulfide]

Also, is this the piece some of you have "broken" the lip off?
Brass should bend or deform, but breaking it doesn't sound right.
Has it been determined for sure this is standard brass, all the way through?
(critical question)


Talked to my old boss yesterday that got me into satellite years ago, an he was a Birdview dealer here in FL. an this is what he told me about that bushing, that it is made from "Oil-lite Bronze" an that type of metal will absorb oil. he also said the best way to lube those bushing is to soak in oil over nite, then lube an reinstall. before yesterday never heard of a oil-lite before, so maybe this is a type of metal that is not that ready avaible anymore.

Oil lite is a sintered bronze product, also called SAE 841 bronze they make it by pressing and heating bronze powder in a mold until it partially fuses, providing microchannels for oil to be stored and to lubricate the bushing/shaft interface. Since it's not a true solid, it's brittle rather than ductile, breaking along the grain boundries. Still in use for many applications like shaded pole motor bushings, it's been replaced by slippery plastics like delrin or graphited nylon in many others. McMaster-Carr has lots of these, perhaps a standard size can be modified