Noob trying to install a FTA system

[soundmanjw]

I'm sure you have answered this question before, but I can't seem to find it. I'm trying to install a FTA system, but instead of purchasing a new dish I'm trying to reuse a Dish Network dish that I had. I found on another post that a Dish Network dish wouldn't work because the dish is too small, but I went ahead and tried it because the dish I have is bigger than most Dish Network dishes. The dish is elliptical and it measures 33.5" x 24" so I thought it might work, but so far I haven't been able to get any quality on my receiver so I think I'm just picking up noise. So my question is can I use my present dish to pick up say Galaxy 19, and even if it's possible am I making it more difficult by trying to use an elliptical antenna? Any help would be greatly appreciated. Thanks,
Jim

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[Lak7]

Did you replace the DishNet LNBF with a Linear unit?

 

[soundmanjw]

I replaced the LNBF with a Standard KU LNBF.

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[Anole]

Similar question was asked here:
http://www.satelliteguys.us/threads/319894-EA-dishnetwork-is-dish-useable-for-97W
understand that we are not recommending for an FTA noobie ...
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And also read this thread for more tips:
http://www.satelliteguys.us/threads/320048-Simple-template-for-replacement-of-LNBF
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edit: show us a picture of your dish mod,
what azimuth, elevation, and skew are you using?
what sort of receiver?
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[soundmanjw]

Thanks for the links to the other posts. I'll have to get a picture of the setup later. As far as the azimuth, skew, and elevation data, I'll post what I know, although it's very possible that they're not very accurate. The azimuth is supposed to be 189.2° (true) or 188.5° (mag). I've been trying to use an app on my phone to get the dish lined up, but yesterday it was giving me some off the wall readings so today I tried using the compass on my signal meter, but it's so small that I can only get the dish generally pointed somewhere around a 190° azimuth, and then I'm trying to use the signal meter to zero in on the satellite. As far as the elevation, that is supposed to be 51.9°, and by using the elevation markings on the back of my dish I have the bolt to hold the elevation centered just past 50°. Is there a way that I can check to see if those elevation markings are correct? Finally, as for the skew, it is supposed to be 7.8° clockwise. I'm fairly confused about how to adjust the skew with my setup since both the dish and the LNB can be rotated so I've tried adjusting them both. I hope this helps, and I'll post some pics later. Thanks!

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[soundmanjw]

I forget to mention that I'm using an Omegasat DSB-6000U receiver.

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[polgyver]

There is a way to check the elevation markings, by glueing one or a few small mirrors on the dish and using Sun light with some info from Navy site. Google "sun moon azimuth altitude" and fill in needed info (Monroe, your State... ). A table with data will show Sun's azimuth and altitude depending on hour/minute. Turn the dish left-right and up-down until you get Sun's reflection (from small mirrors) on LNBF's front face. Compare the altitude from dish markings to altitude of the Sun taken from the table, at actual time. The mirrors should be from about half inch to 1 inch, preferably round, or even square, from a dollar store, or "disco" ball, attached to dish with double-sided thin glueing tape, or masking tape over the edges or corners.
My guess is, that you read the center of the bolt as altitude, whereas you should read inner edge of the bracket - sometimes marked with red paint. Cheers, polgyver

 

[turbosat]

If you're patient , you can find the satellite arc with time. A smaller dish will see a lot of the sky, so you might find another satellite before you find 97 but at least you'll be in the neighborhood. Set your dish where you think you're close in elevation, try a blind scan and see if it picks up anything, if not, raise or lower elevation a little, scan again. Half a turn of the bolt, at a time, until you hit something. It's tedious, but it will work. If you don't have a meter to use locating the satellites, the hit or miss method will get you there.
Take the tv/receiver out to the dish, to do this, or you'll wear out the yard going back and forth! Once you find something-post it and we can tell where you are aimed.

 

[KE4EST]

Make sure you have a good "active" transponder in your receiver that you are using to aim with.

 

[soundmanjw]

Here are some pictures of the setup that I'm trying to use.









I hope these pictures help show what I'm trying to do. I tried to take a picture of the elevation setting, but it wasn't showing up in the picture; however, when I looked at it today I saw that I had moved the elevation way past 60° and it's supposed to be around 52° for my area. I think I'll try polygver's method of checking the elevation later on today. I'm also thinking that I might need to get the dish up a little higher since it's basically down in a hole with trees all around. Anyhow, let me know what you all think, and thanks for the help so far.

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[jorgek]

The phone apps are not very accurate for lining up a sat. Have you tried dishpointer.com?

You can skew the LNB or the dish but don't do both. Its probably easier to skew the LNB.

Take a straight edge and place it across the dish top to bottom and place an inclinometer on it to measure the angle of the dish face then add 22º (dish offset) to your reading. The reading will be the actual angle that the dish is looking at.

 

[northgeorgia]

Seems to be pointing too high for Louisiana. Another thought is that your replacement LNBF may be too close to the dish. See the link Anole referenced here: http://www.satelliteguys.us/threads/320048-Simple-template-for-replacement-of-LNBF

If that's the case, you may need to make some modification to extend the arm out a bit further. But I never had success with this project -- maybe someone else can give their opinion.

 

[soundmanjw]

The link that anole referenced regarding the template for placing the LNBF is great, except I don't have the original LNBF so I can't use that to mark the location where the new LNBF is supposed to go. Later on today I'm going to get some mirrors like polygver mentioned so I can check the elevation, and then hopefully the mirrors will show me where the dish is focusing the signal so I can mount the LNBF there. If anyone knows of another way to figure out where to place the LNBF I'd appreciate any suggestions. Thanks so much for all of the help you've provided already.

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[FaT Air]

The mirror method is probably the quickest & easiest. Only other way I know of, and it's only as accurate as your measurements, is calculating. Put your numbers into Parabola Calculator 2.0 (Click on the WIFI tab for offset reflectors)
To get the dish width, to use in the calculations, of an elliptical dish you need to know the equivalent normal offset measurements. Get the width to use by aiming the dish face vertical and fill with water. Water needs to span from the 'upper' lip to the 'lower' lip. The width of the pool of water, centered in the dish face, is the width of the 'equivalent' to use in the calculations.

 

[. Raine]

It looks like you might have the pole for the dish just stuck in the ground and those lines holding it in place? If so, you might want to make a small platform or something more sturdy to hold it so it doesn't move every time that you adjust it, just a tiny movement can throw you off. I have two old pressure treated 4x4's that I bolted together into a T shape and I drilled a hole through one of them to hold a pipe that I'm using for a small dish I'm messing with right now and that seems to work pretty good.

 

[KE4EST]

I agree with North Ga. That dish is aimed too high.

 

[soundmanjw]

I got the mirrors last night so hopefully tonight I can use them to check the elevation and the focus, and then I'll post what I find out. I'll have to see what I can come up with for a base too because right now the pole is just stuck in a hole with ropes tied around it. I did that only because I didn't want to pour the concrete, and then find out that I set the dish in a bad spot because of all the trees on the property; however, it sounds like that may not be stable enough. Also, I think I'm going to get some more cable so I can move the dish into a more open area farther from the house. Does anybody know if by doing that I might cause more problems due to signal loss? Right now it's about a 125' cable run from the dish to the receiver, but if I move the dish then the cable run will go up to about 200'. Thanks for all the help.

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[polgyver]

Since you need altitude 51.8 in Monroe, for 97 W, the Sun will be today, Sept 20, at this altitude, at 11.31 AM and 2.32 PM (respective azimuths 141.4 and 218.4). Azimuth for 97 W will be shown by Sun at 1.21 PM, however, Sun's altitude at this time will be 58 degree, more than 6 degree above satellite 97. Wish you sunny day...

 

[northgeorgia]

Also, I think I'm going to get some more cable so I can move the dish into a more open area farther from the house. Does anybody know if by doing that I might cause more problems due to signal loss? Right now it's about a 125' cable run from the dish to the receiver, but if I move the dish then the cable run will go up to about 200'.

It's possible. However, as Turbosat said, if you can get a dropcord and take a portable TV and receiver to the dish itself, you could have a 3 foot run and not drive yourself crazy running back and forth to see if you got any signal

An offset dish may often look like it's pointing right at your house, but the LNBF itself is aimed higher up to the satellite. The Dishpointer.com site also has an "obstacle" tool that estimates the maximum height of an object in the line of sight of the satellite you want.

Again, I could never get an elliptical to work for me. Then again, you typically can't get some of the weaker signals on it (and there are a few transponders on 97W that are weak). You might want to try for a proper 75 cm, 90 cm, or 1 m dish

 

[soundmanjw]

Thanks for all of the info. Unfortunately, I've been getting home from work after it's dark so I haven't had a chance to check the elevation and focus, and today doesn't look good either since we're supposed to get a few inches of rain. It's supposed to be nice this weekend though so I'll try it then. I did change out my rigged up pole with a satellite tripod so that should be more stable. I also happened to trip across something on the internet that said that the focal length for my antenna (Dish Network Superdish) is 21.75" so I moved the LNB last night so that the front of it is 21.75" from the dish. After I did that the signal strength did go up, but I'm still not getting any quality so I'm just picking up noise better. I didn't have time to re-aim the dish after I moved the LNB, but I'm going to try to do that tonight or this weekend. I'll post how it goes. If I can't get that to work, I got a 100' cable last night so I can try moving the dish into a clearing, and if that doesn't work I think I might just move forward with ordering an 80 cm dish. Anyhow, I'll post how everything goes.

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