Birdview Satellite Dish Conversion to Titanium Satellite ASC1

[KI5SS]

Thanks to AI6US and all of the others for my learning by emersion!

MY PROJECT: I will scrap the antiquated hinge-type HTH mount limited to geostationary satellites. In its place I will find or fabricate a slew gear drive system for both the 360° Azimuth and the 5 to 100° Elevation for both the geostationary and polar orbiting satellites.

R & D RESULTS: I just now Googled and found the Titanium ASC1 DiSEqC Positioner Satellite Motor & Polarity Controller Dish Mover >>AND<< the Dr. HD1000S+ Satellite Finder Meter. My instincts tell me that these two items are exactly what I need for my conversion of the 30-year-old, solid aluminum dish, Birdview Satellite Dish for today's satellites, including amateur radio satellites.

NEXT R & D: I will have to learn all I can about LNB/LNBFs to select the right LNBF for the amateur radio satellites and FTA satellites for R&R. Is there a Two for One LNBF for my project?

YOUTUBE: I stumbled onto Titanium Satellite YouTube Channel. And Titanium ASC1 YouTube videos. A wealth of learning there.

TITANIUM SATELLITE ASC1 DiSEqC Positioner WEBSITE: What a find that is! I found the buffet of LNBF selections page. Lots of emersion learning to do there!

I feel like a kid in a candy store!

 

[Titanium]

The ASC1 would be a good choice if using the dish with the current HH mount for geosynchronous satellites. Not suitable if you are planning on dual axis for non-Clarke belt radio communications.

Amateur radio and FSS/DSS/DBS are on different bands and the feeds would not be interchangeable.

LNBFs are receive only and if using either LNBs with a feedhorn or LNBFs, each is designed to operate on a specific band. For amateur radio, one would likely have transmit and receive capability with separation filtering, waveguides, bucs, etc. Two different creatures...

 

[KI5SS]

AHHHH CRAP!

I thought I had a bull's eye with that dart toss. What controller would you suggest for the full 360° Azimuth and 5° to 100° Elevation for the dish?

"Amateur radio and FSS/DSS/DBS are on different bands and the feeds would not be interchangeable." That is EXACTLY what I need to learn so I can weigh the benefits on the choices available. I will most likely go with the Amateur Radio Satellite Communications conversion but learning about FSS/DSS/DBS are enticing for the educational aspect. With that stated, can you provide choices for Amateur Radio Satellite Communications components?

What would I need to transmit and receive for the Amateur Radio Satellite Bands?

 

[KI5SS]

Oh, yeah. Just in case someone would be interested to know whats what on the Shortwave (HF) Band and 6 Meter Band (50 MHz) I have uploaded my 174 page 2017 SHORTWAVE FREQUENCY GUIDE in MS Word. You can add to it if you are a Shortwave Radio Listener. Note the last page has the satellite frequency bands but has no data. I have been interested in the satellite communications for a long time. Now I have my chance to get on the Amateur Radio Satellite Bands. Which one and how many is yet to be determined. I was a U.S. Coast Guard radioman. As a kid I listened to the AM band at night to find the farthest radio station. It was fun.

 

[KI5SS]

Now I do have these to tinker with. Will the ASC1 work for these dishes?

I want to see if I can salvage one of these for the FSS, DSS and DBS.

 

[Magic Static]

You got to think in terms of, the ASC1 is a dish MOTOR controller. Like a linear actuator or a C-Band H-H mount motor. If your dish has a motor and needs a control, it probably can be controlled by an ASC1.
Those pictured dishes have no motors. Not that you can't put a motor on one.


This dish was motorized and controlled with an ASC1.

 

[radio]

For standard rotation...If his birdview has the horizon to horizon motor already installed and is old enough, it probably has the proprietary potentiometer sensor for position. Easy to see on the end of the gear system. If not, and it's more modern the motor would already have a reed-switch kit installed...but without the conversion to the reed-switch kit, there's nothing to pulse the incredibly powerful titanium controller....which, I think would be the BEST for the very heavy birdview, and I myself need to get one soon....Make sure that the drive if the dish has one (I would have to look back at your pics) has the non-proprietary reed switch magnetic pulse kit installed. Even at that, a more modern upgrade with more pulses will lend itself to more accuracy.

Here at the station we have a rotary encoder on mine, but we had to. With 4 volts running in the air at all times, NO positioner running on 5 volt pulses would work, so my engineer stepped up the voltage through a box of his design, and it works in conjunction with the rotary encoder so the pulses at the dish are more than 5 volts and the "on/off" is readable. Without it, the positioner only sees a 1 volt drop here, and that's not enough for it to make a pulse to read. You won't have that issue, but a rotary encoder can be used for the purpose of providing position reporting back to whatever box you buy for motor control.

 

[KE4EST]

KI5SS what you need to do is first join AMSAT. You also need to get a couple of books.
Amazon product ASIN 0872596583Which can be just bought through the ARRL if you are a member.

AMSAT has a great book also, if you can find one. They sell out fast.
2018 Edition of Getting Started with Amateur Satellites – AMSAT-NA

AMSAT also has great resource guide: ftp://ftp.amsat.org/amsat/articles/intro/resguide2000-04-23.pdf

 

[KE4EST]

The FTP link about you will have to copy and paste into your address bar manually.

 

[Trust]

Look for EGIS in Germany they sell autotrack rotors 360º AZ / 90º ELV
I have used a 180º / 40º version long time ago , not the one at the picture .
Before you look for the pricelist , find yourself a solid chair .

 

[KI5SS]

OHHHH GREAT! MORE HOMEWORK! (LOL!)

I would have eventually delved into AMSAT-NA. But now that you brought it up? OKAY. AMSAT-NA was inevitable, sooner or later. (LOL).

 

[KI5SS]

For TRUST, from Nijmegen Nethelands:

EGIS - Antenna-Rotor

EGIS - Antenna-Rotor

 

[KI5SS]

Now this is the gun slinging set up I'm looking for! (LOL!) If only I had the money.

 

[KE4EST]

Now this is the gun slinging set up I'm looking for! (LOL!) If only I had the money.

That don't have to be very expensive. Many have built their own yagi's.
That looks like Bob Heil's old set-up.

 

[KI5SS]

I guess I don't have to redesign the wheel after all.

Kinematis Dual-Axis Positioner as seen above.

Kinematics Dual Axis Position for satellite dish (video)

http://www.kinematicsmfg.com/wp-content/themes/kinematics/techspecs/common/catalog.pdf

See pp. 47–56 in the catalog for the Dual Axis Positioner above. This may be exactly what I need for my Birdview Satellite Dish.

 

[N6BY]

...
See pp. 47–56 in the catalog for the Dual Axis Positioner above. This may be exactly what I need for my Birdview Satellite Dish.

I have an 8.5' Birdview Solid Dish too. I think I remember it being about 80 or 100 pounds when I put it up. The Kinematics catalog gives the torque specs, of their various models, but I am not sure what amount of torque is required for an 80-100 pound dish?

I will be curious to hear which one they recommend for Birdview Dish's and the price they quote you. Whenever I see a website or catalog that says 'call for price', it usually means its going to be a lot.

 

[KI5SS]

FOR N6BY,

The specs for the different diameters are here: SDE Dual-Axis Positioner.

My guess on the diameter of the pipes in relation to the torque required the rotate the pipe is based on my theory that the larger the diameter of the pipe the less torque required to rotate the pipe. If that is true, then my choice on the size of the two pipes are NOT the original 6 inch diameter of the Birdview Satellite Dish mast-pipe but the larger Size 12 (12 inches); 14 (14 inches); or my maximum size 17 (17 inch) diameter pipe. That's for both the vertical mast-pipe (azimuth) and the horizontal cross-pipe (elevation). These sizes put me at ease for the stability of the dish-to-positioner component and the stress to balance aspect of the assembly. A counter-balance will shift the center of gravity back to the Dual-Axis Positioner, reducing the required torque even more. That's a physics problem that must be solved before the a fabrication/welding. (I try to sound smarter that I really am. (humor)) Wall thickness of the pipe is an added factor.

 

[Cham]

These guys make a dual-axis rotor:
Alfa Radio Ltd. Home of the ALFA LINE OF ROTATORS.
and yes, an AMSAT membership would be a great start. Lots of "Elmers" to help you out. I started out in satellite using two yagis mounted on a cross-mast and manually pointed them at the satellite. Just watched the down-link signal for pointing. Was a bit much though coordinating two radios and pointing the array at the same time while working someone on CW. Was lots of fun though! Just used old TV antenna parts and whatever was kicking around for the antenna builds, minimal cost. I never spent the big-bux to automate everything, and building a big az/el rotor is beyond my time/fabrication capability.
Having said that though, check out local ham flea markets and swap-nets. Never know what's kicking around that someone needs/wants to get rid of...