How does Edgar Renteria suit you? Atlanta has a young SS ready to step up, and may be looking to trade Renteria. Not a step up defensively for the Tigers, but it would solve the left handed power problem at 1B, with Guillen moving over.
Detroit Tigers
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How does Edgar Renteria suit you? Atlanta has a young SS ready to step up, and may be looking to trade Renteria. Not a step up defensively for the Tigers, but it would solve the left handed power problem at 1B, with Guillen moving over.
Well all the Tigers have to do is win their last 4 games, and the Yankee's lose their last 5 games. Now, if we could only find the Yankee's from May....
Holy crap Jimbo... That is my exact testimony of football fandom! :yikes That's freaky.
I love watching the Steelers and have for years. I really got hooked when Kordell Stewart started working into their offense as a WR/QB. They to me are the opitamy of what football is. Playing the game outdoors in all elements. Hard nose defense and a wear-you-out up the gut running game as the primary offense. Throw in a trick play or two every game, and that is the way football was designed in the early 20th century.
The Lions have been in my family since I can remember. My father is not a sports fan at all, but my uncles all are, and they are all Lions fans. It was natural for me to love them growing up around the family and Barry Sanders was the bomb when I was a kid.
Once I started loving football for football and watching other teams and games over the years, I realized I followed the Steelers rather closely, and when I connected the dots as to why, I have been a fan ever since!
Now that there is such thing as the NFL Sunday Ticket, it is all the easier to be a Steelers fan.
The Lions to me are fading in my life. Last year was the first year I did not watch some of the games at all. It simply is not worth it. Even this year, now that they have their first loss under their belt, and it was on the road, it is a slippery slope. They will lose to the Bears and be 2-2, and then it gets in the players head's that they are playing for Detroit, they are 2-2, and cannot be any better. It happens year after year.
Ford needs to do something drastic to get his team to winning soon. There are a lot of fans that have fallen away from the Lions completely, and I will too if he can not turn things around. He shows no interest in doing that as long as he keeps Millen. Its pathetic that with only 10,000 seats available for each home game to the general public, that their season does not sell out. Its pathetic that we play in a dome. (In my opinion). Its pathetic that merchandisers are backing out of making Lions merchandise because there is not enough money in it anymore. Its pathetic that Ford has owned the team for 40 years now and only had one playoff win in that time.
Anyway... that's my story.
Your story IS quite simular to mine !!
A few comments :
I really got hooked when Kordell Stewart started working into their offense as a WR/QB.
You are very young my friend, I started watching the Steelers in around 69-70, remember Franco and Bradshaw being drafted !!
The Lions are fading in my sports world to, I still follow them , but normally will watch the Steelers as my primary game and flip to the Lions when it's possible.
The Lions need to find a new owner and GM, before anything will change entirely.
Jimbo
The Lions are definitely a curse handed down through family, friends, and proximity.
THE DETROIT LIONS - I'M WORKING ON THE CURE TO THIS INSIDIOUS DISEASE!
THE DETROIT LIONS - I'M WORKING ON THE CURE TO THIS INSIDIOUS DISEASE!
Now to return to our previous programming -----
One man's final grades on the Tigers...
The outstanding - Ordonez - A+. A career season. I would make him and A-Rod co-MVP's. Too bad I don't get a vote. Granderson - A+. I would call this a career season for anybody else, except him, because I can see even better seasons ahead for this guy. What kind of numbers will he put up when he moves to the three spot in the lineup, and he learns how to hit lefties? Should win a gold glove this season. Polanco - A+. 178 games and counting without an error! Are you kidding me? Hitting .340 to boot. Definite gold glove.
The good - Verlander - A. Improved on last seasons numbers, and a no-no. Can win a few Cy Young awards in future seasons. Would have won one this season if he had stayed consistent. Sheffield - B+. Shoulder injury stalled his, and the Tigers production in the second half. Tigers were a better team when he was healthy. Gullien - B+. Good numbers at bat, but he has lost some range at SS. Will see more time at 1B next season, possibly a lot of time, if the Tigers trade for Renteria. Casey - B-. Outstanding fielder, but his power numbers are big negative at what is traditionally a power hitting position. Not his fault, the Tigers knew he wasn't that kind of hitter. When combined with the lack of power from Inge, Monroe, and Rodriguez, a very big reason (along with injuries), why the Tigers fell short this season. Tigers need him back, if only for depth at 1B. Todd Jones - B. 38 saves as of today. Did what he was supposed to do. Holding the job till Zumaya is ready. Leyland wants him back, and will probably be back, barring a better offer. The bench- B. Rabelo, Rayburn, Santiago, Lopez. Provided depth where needed, with better than expected numbers.
The so-so - Inge - C. Outstanding glove at 3B. Severely disapppointing numbers at bat. Would have won a gold glove if he had better numbers at the plate. (I know, that's what the silver bat is for, but for some reason the gold gloves seem to go to the players with the better bats. Check for yourself.) Needs to bring his power numbers back up to last season's. May have saved as many runs defensively as he knocked in - otherwise grade would have been lower. Rodriguez - C-. Slipped defensively and offensively. Hoping it was just an off-year. Tigers will pick up his option - they have no choice. Nobody in the system to replace him. Plus I feel they owe it to him. If he didn't come (who leaves a world champion for the worst team in baseball?), all that followed may never had happened. Roberson - C-. Totally inconsistent. Despite rumors of being trade bait, he will probably will still be here next season. Thames - C-. Had a chance to grab the LF job and didn't. Leyland doesn't see him as an everyday LF. Rodney - C. This grade is for the time he spent while healthy. Either lights out, or total disaster.
The ugly - Monroe - D-. Biggest disappointment of them all. Enough said. Bonderman - D. Don't tell me about him being injured. MRI found nothing in his arm, or for that matter in his brain. This kid needs to work on his mental approach to pitching, as well as a 3rd pitch. Outstanding arm that just can't seem to put it together for a full season. Miller - D. Very young, very talented. Just not ready for primetime this season. Maybe next year. The bullpen in general. - D. It was just scary at times. Losing Zumaya and Rodney hurt big time.
Incomplete. - Rogers. Tigers need to sign him for next season. Don't care about his age, it's not like he put any mileage on his arm this season. Leyland wants him back. Maybin - Too much too soon. Will probably start next season in the minors, but wont stay there. Jurjenns - will get a shot at the rotation next spring. Another one that wont be in the minors too long.
Leyland - A-. Given the injury numbers, he did a hell of a job keeping the Tigers in the race. Needs to lose the pitch count removal system.
Dombrowski - A. Grade is for not panicking and trading away the future before the trade deadline. Will fix the small matters that need fixing.
Overall grade - B. Injuries were a bitch, yet they managed to still play meaningful games in September. Power numbers at third , first, and left field, a concern. As well as middle relief. If everyone was healthy it could have been different. To bad we wasted great seasons from Maggs, Granderson and Polanco. Left handed power hitter a need.
I probably missed some players, but that's what I thought in general about the club. Feel free to comment.
One man's final grades on the Tigers...
The outstanding - Ordonez - A+. A career season. I would make him and A-Rod co-MVP's. Too bad I don't get a vote. Granderson - A+. I would call this a career season for anybody else, except him, because I can see even better seasons ahead for this guy. What kind of numbers will he put up when he moves to the three spot in the lineup, and he learns how to hit lefties? Should win a gold glove this season. Polanco - A+. 178 games and counting without an error! Are you kidding me? Hitting .340 to boot. Definite gold glove.
The good - Verlander - A. Improved on last seasons numbers, and a no-no. Can win a few Cy Young awards in future seasons. Would have won one this season if he had stayed consistent. Sheffield - B+. Shoulder injury stalled his, and the Tigers production in the second half. Tigers were a better team when he was healthy. Gullien - B+. Good numbers at bat, but he has lost some range at SS. Will see more time at 1B next season, possibly a lot of time, if the Tigers trade for Renteria. Casey - B-. Outstanding fielder, but his power numbers are big negative at what is traditionally a power hitting position. Not his fault, the Tigers knew he wasn't that kind of hitter. When combined with the lack of power from Inge, Monroe, and Rodriguez, a very big reason (along with injuries), why the Tigers fell short this season. Tigers need him back, if only for depth at 1B. Todd Jones - B. 38 saves as of today. Did what he was supposed to do. Holding the job till Zumaya is ready. Leyland wants him back, and will probably be back, barring a better offer. The bench- B. Rabelo, Rayburn, Santiago, Lopez. Provided depth where needed, with better than expected numbers.
The so-so - Inge - C. Outstanding glove at 3B. Severely disapppointing numbers at bat. Would have won a gold glove if he had better numbers at the plate. (I know, that's what the silver bat is for, but for some reason the gold gloves seem to go to the players with the better bats. Check for yourself.) Needs to bring his power numbers back up to last season's. May have saved as many runs defensively as he knocked in - otherwise grade would have been lower. Rodriguez - C-. Slipped defensively and offensively. Hoping it was just an off-year. Tigers will pick up his option - they have no choice. Nobody in the system to replace him. Plus I feel they owe it to him. If he didn't come (who leaves a world champion for the worst team in baseball?), all that followed may never had happened. Roberson - C-. Totally inconsistent. Despite rumors of being trade bait, he will probably will still be here next season. Thames - C-. Had a chance to grab the LF job and didn't. Leyland doesn't see him as an everyday LF. Rodney - C. This grade is for the time he spent while healthy. Either lights out, or total disaster.
The ugly - Monroe - D-. Biggest disappointment of them all. Enough said. Bonderman - D. Don't tell me about him being injured. MRI found nothing in his arm, or for that matter in his brain. This kid needs to work on his mental approach to pitching, as well as a 3rd pitch. Outstanding arm that just can't seem to put it together for a full season. Miller - D. Very young, very talented. Just not ready for primetime this season. Maybe next year. The bullpen in general. - D. It was just scary at times. Losing Zumaya and Rodney hurt big time.
Incomplete. - Rogers. Tigers need to sign him for next season. Don't care about his age, it's not like he put any mileage on his arm this season. Leyland wants him back. Maybin - Too much too soon. Will probably start next season in the minors, but wont stay there. Jurjenns - will get a shot at the rotation next spring. Another one that wont be in the minors too long.
Leyland - A-. Given the injury numbers, he did a hell of a job keeping the Tigers in the race. Needs to lose the pitch count removal system.
Dombrowski - A. Grade is for not panicking and trading away the future before the trade deadline. Will fix the small matters that need fixing.
Overall grade - B. Injuries were a bitch, yet they managed to still play meaningful games in September. Power numbers at third , first, and left field, a concern. As well as middle relief. If everyone was healthy it could have been different. To bad we wasted great seasons from Maggs, Granderson and Polanco. Left handed power hitter a need.
I probably missed some players, but that's what I thought in general about the club. Feel free to comment.
Very well done Paul,
Grade : A+
I agree with about everything you mentioned, one exception, I don't know how long Guillen is signed for, but from what I'm hearing, he REALLY wants to stay at short .... IF he does, he will have to play Less games to rest his damaged knees.
This would mean more games for Santiago, I wish he could learn to hit, over the off season.
Maybin needs another year in the minors, hopefully he'll be here in Toledo next year as our LF, he needs ALOT of work in left, he may be fine in CF, but thats NOT where he'll play up in Detroit.
I hope he goes to winter ball.
Bonderman needs a good shrink, don't think that the baseball players don't use them .... (I bet A-Rod does or has too after the year he put up before this one)
Unfortunatly, Maggs will NOT get the CO MVP, because NY made the playoffs. Hopefully the media will put him in the discussion when the award does come out.
I think losing Zoom Zoom early in the year made a huge difference in the teams confidence. He also needs to work on his movement as wall as his breaking stuff, seems he went away from it when he got back in there.
I hope Casey comes back, but I can see him moving on.
There was talk they Pudge would be coming back, it was mentioned that he was very happy at the end of the year, contarary to some reports that he was talking about Detroit in the past tense, rumor was that he had already signed an extension but the Tigers had not yet announced it.
I could see Maggs putting up simular numbers next year, IF Sheff is back in his grove and Palonco too.
You've often mentioned moving Granderson down in the lineup (Tori Hunter comes to mind). IF you did that next year(with the current team) Who would bat lead off (they really don't have one other than CG)
Take Sheff out of the third, I don't see that happening, maybe when he's gone.
I think Guillen could bat third very well too.
Just some thoughts from my end of the keyboard
Jimbo
Granderson moving down would happen in a couple of years. Your are right in that the Tigers don't have another lead off man. Maybe, Maybin down the road. Guillen does want to continue playing SS, but has publicly stated he would move if the Tigers acquired Renteria. Guillen would put the power problem at first to rest. Leyland shot down your idea of moving Inge to SS in this mornings paper. I'm curious to see what Dombrowski has in mind for this team this winter. Locally it's been rumored that Robertson and Inge are trade bait, but I'm having a hard time seeing this. The rotation stands right now as Verlander, Bonderman, and Robertson. Kenny Rogers will probably be back for another season. That leaves the last spot for Miller or Jurjenns. Now take Robertson or Rogers out of this, and you go into the season with 2 unproven arms. The window to win a championship closes as fast as it opened, and I for one would not want to bet my odds on Miller and Jurjenns. Maybe down the road, but not next season. As for trading Inge, again I don't see a replacement on the horizon. To pry Renteria away from Atlanta though will have a price, and Robertson could be it, along with one of our pized pitching prospects. Well I guess they can't all pitch for us. I'd hate to see Casey go, but the speculation in the papers for the last couple months is that he won't ne signed. I think that would be a mistake, unless Dombrowski has his eyes on somebody with some serious pop in his bat for 1st.
Unless Dombrowski has another stud starting pitcher he's planning on signing, no idea who that would be though.
If they decided to trade Inge, (I agree, I don't like the idea) they could use Hessman there, but he's not a youngster either, got power in his bat, typical home run hitters avg though, .250-.280 I'd guess. That said, I don't think that will go this way either.
Jimbo
I agree with everyone's comments here.
I would not have graded Sheffield as high a grade as you guys would. I would give him a C. For the amount of money we paid him, he did not deliver for what he was worth. Despite his injuries he still played in 132 games so far. He is batting .268, with 25 home runs and only 75 RBI's. For a guy who is your DH, he should be at .295 with 30 home runs and 100 RBI's at this point in the season.
Bonderman took a big step back this year. It is all in his head though. You can see how the bug-a-boo's in his head are effecting him. When he is on, he is on. When he's off, it takes him a long time to get out of the funk.
Robertson to me was never a good pitcher anyway. I always said he should be no higher than 5th in the rotation. He is very much like Jeff Weaver was when he played with Detroit, (and still is today). He is light's out until he gives up his first batter to second base. Then it is all down hill from there. If he get's one run on him you can forget it. He needs to learn to calm down and understand there is plenty of game left if he gives up one or two runs. But he has not been able to figure that out in three season's. I think giving up Maroth over Robertson was a mistake. Maroth had poise and control in sticky situations. That is something you cannot teach. And Robertson is the proof of that.
Maggs, Polanco, and Granderson kept the tigers in the wild card hunt in the months of August and September. With out those guys' bats, the Tigers are not even in the hunt.
If I am not mistaken Maggs has one more year on his contract. I believe at the end of that contract, they will let him go, and we will see an outfield of Granderson, Maybin, and Thames, unless they find someone else to start in right field. That will be fun to watch!
I also am worried about Guillen's attitude. His exact words when asked how he would feel about moving over to 1b next year were, "they better bring in the best SS in the league if they want me a 1b". It is obvious that his mind is younger than his body. But he is not thinking of the team and being selfish about it. Dombrowski does not like players like that. So keep your eye out this off season. Guillen may become trade bait if his attitude does not change.
I would not have graded Sheffield as high a grade as you guys would. I would give him a C. For the amount of money we paid him, he did not deliver for what he was worth. Despite his injuries he still played in 132 games so far. He is batting .268, with 25 home runs and only 75 RBI's. For a guy who is your DH, he should be at .295 with 30 home runs and 100 RBI's at this point in the season.
Bonderman took a big step back this year. It is all in his head though. You can see how the bug-a-boo's in his head are effecting him. When he is on, he is on. When he's off, it takes him a long time to get out of the funk.
Robertson to me was never a good pitcher anyway. I always said he should be no higher than 5th in the rotation. He is very much like Jeff Weaver was when he played with Detroit, (and still is today). He is light's out until he gives up his first batter to second base. Then it is all down hill from there. If he get's one run on him you can forget it. He needs to learn to calm down and understand there is plenty of game left if he gives up one or two runs. But he has not been able to figure that out in three season's. I think giving up Maroth over Robertson was a mistake. Maroth had poise and control in sticky situations. That is something you cannot teach. And Robertson is the proof of that.
Maggs, Polanco, and Granderson kept the tigers in the wild card hunt in the months of August and September. With out those guys' bats, the Tigers are not even in the hunt.
If I am not mistaken Maggs has one more year on his contract. I believe at the end of that contract, they will let him go, and we will see an outfield of Granderson, Maybin, and Thames, unless they find someone else to start in right field. That will be fun to watch!
I also am worried about Guillen's attitude. His exact words when asked how he would feel about moving over to 1b next year were, "they better bring in the best SS in the league if they want me a 1b". It is obvious that his mind is younger than his body. But he is not thinking of the team and being selfish about it. Dombrowski does not like players like that. So keep your eye out this off season. Guillen may become trade bait if his attitude does not change.
Joe, I believe Maggs has one yr. guaranteed, and two more if he stays injury free and meets the minimum of games played. (130 games comes to mind). Leyland has said that he doesn't see Thames as an everyday LFer. As soon as I see something about free agents I'll post it.
Sorry Joe,
I don't see Guillen going anywhere .....
Maybe Mr. Illich will look into A-Rod after all ....
When it comes right down to it, Guillen wants to be here, he credited the Tigers with giving him a chance when he was stuck in Seattle.
Jimbo
In this morning's Free Press (Detroit), Leyland declares that he is moving Guillen to 1B permanently next season. Two free agents listed in the same article - Omar Vizquel (SF), and Cesar Izturis (Pitt). Other possibilities include resuming trade talks for Jack Wilson (Pitt), and moving Santiago into the starting lineup. I can't see the Tigers going after A-Rod, but I hope I'm wrong. Guillen's comment - "No problem. I want to help the team get better and get back to the postseason." Guillen begins a 4 yr. contract extension next spring. Don't look for him to be traded (huge mistake). This doesn't bode well for Casey, though.
Bonds is a major free agent, will look good in the Tigers uniform.
Oh, stop already.
Detroit Free Press published their grades this morning - They were nicer than I was.
Bonds is a major free agent, will look good in the Tigers uniform.
Leyland really likes Bonds ...
That said, they better NOT sign him, that would be a huge mistake, Leyland has built this team on TEAM play and Bonds would destroy that idea as soon as he brought his rocker in .....
He can't play the field , he could sit on the bench and be a pinch hitter I suppose, IF he didn't disrupt things.
Jimbo
He would make a perfect DH, he would be back with his old Pirate teammates especially Van Slyke since he called him "The Great White Hope" and "Jerry Cooney" ahhh the stories they could tell
, back with Leyland, and together with Gary Sheffield they can teach the younger players how to think about themselves instead of the team.
