I have a 6 foot wsi dish that I got a while back and I don't have the instructions so I can mount it to the pole. Can anyone help with a manual or pictures so I can figure out the bracketry?
Help with 6' WSI polar mount dish setup
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I never was able to find a manual or anything like that when I installed my 6' dish. I just had to rely on pics of other people's install and that horrible exploded diagram of the dish that was included in the package. I've found that its mainly a trial and error setup for this dish. I've attached a pic of how mine is setup, so you dont have to search through the install thread for a pic.
I installed the L plate down, because on my setup it seemed to keep the actuator more linear than the other way. I thought I remembered reading somewhere that it was better for the actuator to only have to work in a linear plane, rather than working at an angle. There is some slop in my setup, I believe it is from west to east. I usually have to pass the satellite I want then go back to it. My only complaint really, is that main bolt is just horrible. Its too weak/flimsy for this dish.
Oh, i guess i should have added, I get 139w to 91w. I can go lower, but i dont have enough magnets on the wheel of my von weise to dial in on the lower sats. I tried for 87w or 83w and had trouble getting any TP's to give me enough signal. I can find the birds, but if I move it 1 click past finding them, I lose the signal. I dont get alot of S2 signals, but I do get some. I'm curious how much more I will get later this summer after I restore and setup my 8.5' birdview.
Cool Thanks! Now I just need to find the bag of hardware that I misplaced. I mounted a pole to a pallet and put bags on it for stability. I will probably just make it a fixed mount for now. I should be able to figure it out with that picture.
FWIW, this is how I set up a pallet for the 6' WSI.
First, I read the excellent threads on this site, took notes and scavenged for parts such as shingles and pallet.
The legs are 3/4" conduit pinched and bent in a vise.
Installation in November required scraping snow away to expose the ground. The first warm spell caused some settling and re-plumbing was necessary.
I set the mast off center of the pallet so that the brick ballast would be more effective leverage against the wind.
It is the 6' WSI dish and the information on this site that opened up the world of c-band for me.
BTW, I'm receiving from 55.5W to 139.0W but missing a lot of S2 signals.
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I am still looking for the hardware and I would like to purchase new feedhorn arms. They got bent during a storm. Hopefully I can find the bag of hardware next week and finally use this thing.
Someone on this forum mentioned replacing the east-west axis bolt with 1/2inch threaded rod to reduce loose play as the bolt supplied allows about 3/16inch gap between the bolt and the edge of the holes. I found that a 1/2inch bolt would not fit in the hole without reaming the hole, but that 1/2inch threaded rod fit the hole with a minimal tolerance of about 1/32inch, thus reducing the loose play considerably.
Since replacing the bolt with the threaded rod, I haven't re-aligned the dish due to inclement weather. But I *do* anticipate that reception will improve once the dish is aligned and able to track without flopping around.
I used standard 1/2inch - 13tpi rod with lock nuts at both ends and slipped the new rod in as I slipped the old bolt out. Avoid windy conditions when performing this retrofit!
@Babadem, the FECs of the S2 frequencies that I haven't been receiving vary across the arc. I've read that some FECs are harder to receive than others (ie 9/10). I've attributed some of this lack of reception to the flopping around that I just described in combination with the limitations of a 6ft dish.
Since replacing the bolt with the threaded rod, I haven't re-aligned the dish due to inclement weather. But I *do* anticipate that reception will improve once the dish is aligned and able to track without flopping around.
I used standard 1/2inch - 13tpi rod with lock nuts at both ends and slipped the new rod in as I slipped the old bolt out. Avoid windy conditions when performing this retrofit!
@Babadem, the FECs of the S2 frequencies that I haven't been receiving vary across the arc. I've read that some FECs are harder to receive than others (ie 9/10). I've attributed some of this lack of reception to the flopping around that I just described in combination with the limitations of a 6ft dish.
I just did the same thing. The wind caused the top mount bracket to break the welds and come off, lucky it didn't damage the dish and I caught within 5 minutes of it happening and clamped it together until I could bolt it back together. I'm also adding braces from the elevation pivot bolt due to the high winds we have in Palmdale which is causing the welds to crack at the top of the pole mount and joint of the primary frame where the elevation frame is bolted. The braces will go from the pivot bolt to the pole itself as I've already threaded the retaining bolts into the pole itself through the mount, the dish doesn't turn on the pole anymore from the wind. it only did very slightly before when the wind would hit 60 mph, but just some added strength since it's 15' up. Guy wires on the pole keep the shaking down from the wind and from blowing over, 3' square block of reinforced concrete in the ground holds it in place. I can get from 72W to 139W with a 24" actuator when everything is dialed in. Funny, as thin as the dish is, the wind hasn't deformed it and it holds up well. The polar mount on the other hand could be retired and one like Sadoun uses on their 6' would definately be better. When I'm done beefing it up, it will almost be the same anyway. I also noticed the actuator mount flexes when turning, so going one direction is always 4-5 clicks off when going the opposite direction. I'll be replacing that piece of angle steel as well with a flat wider piece of 15-5 PH 1/4" thick stainless I got at work. I'm open to other suggestions and will post some pics when I'm done.
Hello The handyman, I like what you have made. I have a similar problem as you had. I have a Northern Satelite Corp NSC 18-1 dish 2.1 x 1.85 m. (probably 6' 6"x 6' 0" or so) Complete with stays, feed horn and dish mount.
Problem 1. I have attached 2 pics of my dish with the rotating mount, I would also like to convert it to a polar mount. I have copied your photo to see if i can figure it out but would appreciate some ideas from some of the big dish experts. I just cannot understand which 2 ways this changes angles. Is the bottom U channel fixed to the round pipe or does this rotate along a horizontal axis, as mine does? Or is all the turning motions taking place on the approx 45° axis ? After studying yours I think that is the most logic, if so the U channel is fixed to the pipe. I think I could utilize my dish mount with the 4 large bolts etc.
Problem 2. I do not know the manufacturers offset angle of the dish so I trien using a straight edge from top to bottom on the front side of the dish then using apiece of wood from the underside of the bottom rim to the feedhorn. This gave me an angle of 24° maybe someone could enlighten me if they have such a dish.
I have made an inclinometer and assume I have to add the dish's offset to the Offset angle of the Satelite which I am at 46°18'36"Nx 14°54'0"E Sat 28.2E which has a Elevations angle of 35.19°. These added together come to practically 60° making my dish very flat wereas I know it should be quite steep.
Hope you and anyone else can enlighten me, all help appreciated. I live in Austria by the way.
I have also added a scan of a data sheet for Astra 1N at 28.2°E
Best regards
Problem 1. I have attached 2 pics of my dish with the rotating mount, I would also like to convert it to a polar mount. I have copied your photo to see if i can figure it out but would appreciate some ideas from some of the big dish experts. I just cannot understand which 2 ways this changes angles. Is the bottom U channel fixed to the round pipe or does this rotate along a horizontal axis, as mine does? Or is all the turning motions taking place on the approx 45° axis ? After studying yours I think that is the most logic, if so the U channel is fixed to the pipe. I think I could utilize my dish mount with the 4 large bolts etc.
Problem 2. I do not know the manufacturers offset angle of the dish so I trien using a straight edge from top to bottom on the front side of the dish then using apiece of wood from the underside of the bottom rim to the feedhorn. This gave me an angle of 24° maybe someone could enlighten me if they have such a dish.
I have made an inclinometer and assume I have to add the dish's offset to the Offset angle of the Satelite which I am at 46°18'36"Nx 14°54'0"E Sat 28.2E which has a Elevations angle of 35.19°. These added together come to practically 60° making my dish very flat wereas I know it should be quite steep.
Hope you and anyone else can enlighten me, all help appreciated. I live in Austria by the way.
I have also added a scan of a data sheet for Astra 1N at 28.2°E
Best regards
Although this page say Prime Focus tracking, it's applicable to any dish that tracks the arc. (Should have been called Polar mount tracking.) The only difference is the 'offset angle' of an offset dish. Whereas a prime focus dishes face angle is 90° from the arcs due south elevation. An offset dish is 'looking' offset degrees above the perpendicular of the dish face.
Just have to add the Declination to the dishes offset.
Adjusting the Polar Mount for Prime Focus Antenna
The polar axis, which the dish moves about, is aligned parallel to the earths axis. This is modified slightly when using the "Modified Declination" angle. This results in better tracking at the ends of the arc. Latitude Declination Chart
Software tool to use to calculate you dishes offset, sun azimuth(usefull to set your "due South") Satellite Antenna Alignment (Satellite Dish Alignment)
Another is Parabola Calculator version 2.0 (click WIFI tab for offset dishes)
Just have to add the Declination to the dishes offset.
Adjusting the Polar Mount for Prime Focus Antenna
The polar axis, which the dish moves about, is aligned parallel to the earths axis. This is modified slightly when using the "Modified Declination" angle. This results in better tracking at the ends of the arc. Latitude Declination Chart
Software tool to use to calculate you dishes offset, sun azimuth(usefull to set your "due South") Satellite Antenna Alignment (Satellite Dish Alignment)
Another is Parabola Calculator version 2.0 (click WIFI tab for offset dishes)
Thanks a lot, I have looked at the different links and downloaded the calc progs plus the seperate charts. I think to start with I will try to set my dish to one satellite probably Astra 2A/2D at 28.2E using my existing mount ( in the pic above) as it will take a bit of time to contruct the polar mount. At least I will know what the signal and the dish and LNB are working fine. I should also know what the offset angle of the dish is as well.
Using the parabolica calc programme using the wifi as you said I hope to at least achieve a signal.
When I find out the offset angle of the dish is this added to the elevation of the satellite in a northern hemisphere. My position is 46°18'36"N x 14°54'0"E
Also what Freq. should be entered in the wifi calculation? That is the first box to fill in. That is my first problem.
Thanks again for the tips.
Using the parabolica calc programme using the wifi as you said I hope to at least achieve a signal.
When I find out the offset angle of the dish is this added to the elevation of the satellite in a northern hemisphere. My position is 46°18'36"N x 14°54'0"E
Also what Freq. should be entered in the wifi calculation? That is the first box to fill in. That is my first problem.
Thanks again for the tips.
I've just use a mid-band frequency. Usually just entered 12Ghz. (1200Mhz) seemed to work well calculating the offset of my 1.2's very closely. (don't think the frequency is used for calculating offset, just used in the 'gain' figure. BWDIK) (11.7 to 12.2 is the 'main' Ku band here)
Once the offset angle is determined, and an understanding of the angles of a polar mount is grasped, It all falls together quite easily.(close eyes, imagine 3D imagesof 'where a 'prime focus' and an offset dish 'aim' Ah-Ha! offset [dish face angle] degrees apart.)
My first 1.2 came with no mount. So didn't have a clue where to position the dish to 'look X degrees above the horizon'(satellite elevation) The calculator made measuring dish face angles and calculating for said 'elevation' angle possible. The calculator was within 1° and I had lock and tuned in, in less than 1/2 and hour. (measurement 'ball park' inaccuracies and all)
The 'offset' can be 'seen' on the .7 meter that I have on the BUD's 'lip'.
Once the offset angle is determined, and an understanding of the angles of a polar mount is grasped, It all falls together quite easily.(close eyes, imagine 3D imagesof 'where a 'prime focus' and an offset dish 'aim' Ah-Ha! offset [dish face angle] degrees apart.)
My first 1.2 came with no mount. So didn't have a clue where to position the dish to 'look X degrees above the horizon'(satellite elevation) The calculator made measuring dish face angles and calculating for said 'elevation' angle possible. The calculator was within 1° and I had lock and tuned in, in less than 1/2 and hour. (measurement 'ball park' inaccuracies and all)
The 'offset' can be 'seen' on the .7 meter that I have on the BUD's 'lip'.
Attachments
Hello again and thanks again. The calc tables obviously help the duffers like me who have forgotten all about geometry.
I have now hopefully calcuated my dish offset, also the elevation of astra 2D 28.2°E.
Attached a screen prints to help you think my thoughts on the outcome.
Having found the dish offset angle24.8° by cal, in the first screen print. Then the elevation of Astra 2D in the second screen print 35.134°. Do I add these together to get the angle the dish must be tilted from the vertical tilting backwards? this being 24.8 + 35.134 = 59.934°.
Looking at the third screen print does the sum of the 2 green angles equal the sum of the red angle? Or am I up the wrong street?
I started in this thread after seeing the polarmount setup by The handyone from 14th May 2012 as I want to change my mount which I assume is a fixed mount to a polarmount. I did want to see if I could get any other pics of his set.
Another thing the frequency doesnt come in the equasion as you said.
At the moment to see if the dish works ok I am just fixing on astra 28.2 and when that is ok I will start on the polar mount.
I think I will have to get someone in but I will keep trying to understand these points myself on setting up a big dish which is obviously more difficult than my pther 2 dishes.
Again thanks for your help, I hope you are still around.
I have now hopefully calcuated my dish offset, also the elevation of astra 2D 28.2°E.
Attached a screen prints to help you think my thoughts on the outcome.
Having found the dish offset angle24.8° by cal, in the first screen print. Then the elevation of Astra 2D in the second screen print 35.134°. Do I add these together to get the angle the dish must be tilted from the vertical tilting backwards? this being 24.8 + 35.134 = 59.934°.
Looking at the third screen print does the sum of the 2 green angles equal the sum of the red angle? Or am I up the wrong street?
I started in this thread after seeing the polarmount setup by The handyone from 14th May 2012 as I want to change my mount which I assume is a fixed mount to a polarmount. I did want to see if I could get any other pics of his set.
Another thing the frequency doesnt come in the equasion as you said.
At the moment to see if the dish works ok I am just fixing on astra 28.2 and when that is ok I will start on the polar mount.
I think I will have to get someone in but I will keep trying to understand these points myself on setting up a big dish which is obviously more difficult than my pther 2 dishes.
Again thanks for your help, I hope you are still around.
Thanks again, Maybe I am making a little progress, its just that I put the angle the wrong way. Is it to do with N Hemisphere dish tilts back and Southern forewards, I cant quite grasp it. BUT as you put it which is the main thing the equasion is Sat Elv - Dish offset angle.
Now in my mind, tell me i am wrong but if I set the dish vertical and then tilt back 9.935° I should be up the correct tree.
Incidently the 3 pics yesterday were using hyperthetical figures as there was a big thunderstorm here last night and raining cats and dogs, but this morning I entered by exact location which gave a slightly different Sat elevation. See pic.
Assuming figures are correct so I have the tilt corrrect, my next problem is setting the 28.2°.
With a big dish this is not that easy, I was thinking marking a line due south from the centre axis of my pole then another 28.2°, now does true north play its part or am I just using magnetic north? In which case it could be some 7° different as far as I can remember.
The small dish's I just turned a bit here or there but I imagine getting the buig dish set up must be very accurate.
Please comment.
Now in my mind, tell me i am wrong but if I set the dish vertical and then tilt back 9.935° I should be up the correct tree.
Incidently the 3 pics yesterday were using hyperthetical figures as there was a big thunderstorm here last night and raining cats and dogs, but this morning I entered by exact location which gave a slightly different Sat elevation. See pic.
Assuming figures are correct so I have the tilt corrrect, my next problem is setting the 28.2°.
With a big dish this is not that easy, I was thinking marking a line due south from the centre axis of my pole then another 28.2°, now does true north play its part or am I just using magnetic north? In which case it could be some 7° different as far as I can remember.
The small dish's I just turned a bit here or there but I imagine getting the buig dish set up must be very accurate.
Please comment.
Hello again, I seem to have made some progress and wanted to add a postscript to my last thread.
To start with I set my dish to vertical, then added an inclonometer (an old Variable set square) I set the dish with the 9.9° tilt back, turned the dish approximatly to 28.2° and I had a wonderfull signal from the Astra 1D/2D.
One problem I tried a search for channels but maybe this old stb doesnt have the correct values. Maybe I can find them on my Spiderbox 9000Hd STB.
Have added the picks, the inclonometer worked well, I just used a spirit level on the vertical and it was correct without fiddling. Maybe someone else has a better idea but this is rustfree and easily readable with the scale.
Now it seems I shall have to get started on the polar mount, with the exception of the one I mentioned yesterday, which I think I can convert mine similar to that unless anyone has any better ideas.
Please answer my questions from my last post.
Thanks again.
To start with I set my dish to vertical, then added an inclonometer (an old Variable set square) I set the dish with the 9.9° tilt back, turned the dish approximatly to 28.2° and I had a wonderfull signal from the Astra 1D/2D.
One problem I tried a search for channels but maybe this old stb doesnt have the correct values. Maybe I can find them on my Spiderbox 9000Hd STB.
Have added the picks, the inclonometer worked well, I just used a spirit level on the vertical and it was correct without fiddling. Maybe someone else has a better idea but this is rustfree and easily readable with the scale.
Now it seems I shall have to get started on the polar mount, with the exception of the one I mentioned yesterday, which I think I can convert mine similar to that unless anyone has any better ideas.
Please answer my questions from my last post.
Thanks again.
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