Installer claims 'new Directv rule' about climbing on roofs - really?

[Joe Diamond]

Replacing a 3 lnb for a 5 lnb should be free and shouldn't incur a contract extension.

Hey Chip,
I know that and you know that but you never know what the CSR will come up with. I forgot the final stop gap. IF the news from the CSR is not what you would expect just call back...ask again. The response could be different. I haven't been keeping up.

Joe

 

[dishcomm]

So how will this new rule effect repairs to already installed systems that are on roofs? My system has the dish on the roof and the switch is mounted on a short wall between roof sections. Does mean that I will not be able to get any maintenance or repair work done?

I guess it depends.
If the rules are as stated in the OP, then you'll have to hire an outside contractor to do the work. But, you'll incur a one time charge.
I knew this was coming. Too many guys getting hurt falling off roofs. Too many others improperly installing antennas which resulted in damage to the roof.
Some shops prohibit roof installs 'over the living area' of the home. In other words, the dish has to be mounted above the soffit or a garage roof.
If no roof install is available, there are other more tricky mounts such as these so called "eave mounts" which the customer must buy because it is non-standard.
Dish requires its employees to use roofers harnesses and the tethering apparatus used by roofers which ironically the tech must drill holes into the roof to attach the safety equipment.
What this will do is increase the frequency of ground and wall mounted antennas.
Oh, I find it funny that the spell check does not like the word "soffit"...

 

[dishcomm]

This subject came up many months ago and I seem to remember that it was because of some new OSHA rules. The tech has to stay on the ladder during the install and cannot step onto the roof.

On any roof with a pitch greater than an 8/12( 33.6*)...I would not get off the ladder. If the dish had to go out on the roof, I would find somewhere else to place the dish.

 

[dishcomm]

Call a local dealer. They will do it because they want to see every sale go in.

Yeah. Some retailers have guys that are mountain goats.
I used to be fearless on roofs. Until I fell off two different homes. Luckily they were one story.
I stopped going on roofs after the second tumble. I figured I had worn out my luck factor.

 

[raoul5788]

My new neighbor across the street had Directv installed in the middle of his roof, so the "no walking on the roof" rule isn't necessarily hard and fast.

 

[twizt3dsist3r]

My new neighbor across the street had Directv installed in the middle of his roof, so the "no walking on the roof" rule isn't necessarily hard and fast.

Oh no, it actually is... its just whether the tech follows it or not, My sup called me while I was on a case management sc today, asked how it was going. My response.. "Oh pretty good im about to walk up a roof to repeak the dish now" hes like umm can you do it safely... my response.. "sure".. that and the cm's rabbit is no longer allowed near the tv since it decided to eat one of the lines running to the combo.

 

[raoul5788]

Oh no, it actually is... its just whether the tech follows it or not, My sup called me while I was on a case management sc today, asked how it was going. My response.. "Oh pretty good im about to walk up a roof to repeak the dish now" hes like umm can you do it safely... my response.. "sure".. that and the cm's rabbit is no longer allowed near the tv since it decided to eat one of the lines running to the combo.

I don't doubt you, but if that's so, why would a tech put the dish at the peak of the roof when they didn't have to get off of the ladder?

 

[Hutch1814]

Because the customer told the tech it goes where the dish network is or it doesn't go in OR dish network was there and it was a dish conversion and the tech was lazy and didn't want to run new lines. That's normally what happens

 

[raoul5788]

Nope, brand new installation, no previous dish anywhere.

 

[Hutch1814]

Nope, brand new installation, no previous dish anywhere.

Like I said "that's normally how it happens". When its a new install somebody was just being ignorant if there is nothing in the way on the eave.

 

[raoul5788]

I've been on the roof many times. It's wide open. You would love to do an install there!

 

[Joe Diamond]

I've been on the roof many times. It's wide open. You would love to do an install there!

You know what would control this ladder thing.....NO DISHES MOUNTED ABOVE LIVING SPACES!.....the responsibility for leaks continues as long as the dish is up there. Insurance wonks will track you down. This would also guide dishes to the edge of most buildings where a ladder install is possible.

I have heard of extra charges for off ladder work....this new rule will go away in some manner. Perhaps a new wave of roof contractors.

Always fun to watch the puppies run around!

Joe

 

[raoul5788]

You know what would control this ladder thing.....NO DISHES MOUNTED ABOVE LIVING SPACES!.....the responsibility for leaks continues as long as the dish is up there. Insurance wonks will track you down. This would also guide dishes to the edge of most buildings where a ladder install is possible.

I have heard of extra charges for off ladder work....this new rule will go away in some manner. Perhaps a new wave of roof contractors.

Always fun to watch the puppies run around!

Joe

That would be a good solution, even though there are ways to install over living spaces that aren't leak hazards. Commdecks.

 

[Joe Diamond]

That would be a good solution, even though there are ways to install over living spaces that aren't leak hazards. Commdecks.

Chip you are up on the good stuff!
Commdecks are a good product. In my opinion they are most appropriate at the time of construction / roof installation but work ok as a retrofit. There is a minor $$$$$ involved so they didn't make it into the bag of tricks for the FREE installation.
ALSO I think we are moving into a period when a next generation of techs is taking over installations and maintenance of the systems. If you can excuse a huge generalization I see the new guys as individuals who seem to love rules and regulations. If they are told what to do they will ignore the sinking ship as they line up the deck chairs. They are afraid of "getting in trouble." So I think they would be happiest not knowing about many of the concepts that might work. In their risk avoidance world they just need rules........like no dishes over living quarters.

Just my opinion,

Joe

 

[dishcomm]

I don't doubt you, but if that's so, why would a tech put the dish at the peak of the roof when they didn't have to get off of the ladder?

Because they did. Or for no apparent reason.
Or, and this is actually funny, the customer believed the more elevated the dish, the better the reception..No kidding.
On numerous occasions I had customers insist the dish be placed as high on the roof as possible.
I played this card..."Sir/Ma'am, the signal comes down 23,000 miles from outer space. Do you think the signal is going to get to the peak of your roof and STOP?"....
Most looked at me with that look of "ok , ya got me on that one"...

 

[harshness]

Sometimes 40s help, but they are going the way of the dinosaur too.

The last I heard, 40's have gone the way of the dinosaurs because OSHA says that it takes two people to handle them.

 

[dishcomm]

That would be a good solution, even though there are ways to install over living spaces that aren't leak hazards. Commdecks.

Commdeck.. A failed product.
The supply house where I bought my stuff was pushing Commdeck like nobody's business. The rub was there was no reimbursement to the tech for the cost and there was no charge to the custy permitted by Dish. So no one bought them. I sure as hell would not buy anything non standard for which I could not recoup my expenses.
The installation issue with this device was most techs did not know the proper way to install them.
Anyway, Dish in house techs in the shop closest to here were prohibited from installing over the living area of the house. Any new connect that could not be done from the ladder, Dish sent to the contractors( RSP's) to complete.
Nice, huh? Dish wasn't concerned with the safety of the techs, they were reducing their exposure to Worker's Comp claims.

 

[dishcomm]

The last I heard, 40's have gone the way of the dinosaurs because OSHA says that it takes two people to handle them.

I am a pretty strong guy with a lot of ladder experience. A 40 footer is a tough ladder to handle. Especially on a windy day. The risk is dropping the thing and damaging property or putting it through a window. Too much exposure to liability.
I almost dropped one on a car. I told the customer I could not do their install.
I got pissed off, threw the thing on my truck, took it back to the shop and left it there.
I told the boss the next day I would not use that thing ever again. he asked why. Told him what almost happened. He had no interest in opening that can of worms. From then on, two men were required on those jobs.

 

[Joe Diamond]

Because they did. Or for no apparent reason.
Or, and this is actually funny, the customer believed the more elevated the dish, the better the reception..No kidding.
On numerous occasions I had customers insist the dish be placed as high on the roof as possible.
I played this card..."Sir/Ma'am, the signal comes down 23,000 miles from outer space. Do you think the signal is going to get to the peak of your roof and STOP?"....
Most looked at me with that look of "ok , ya got me on that one"...

Years ago.....driving through west MD mountains in my 1960 Ford Falcon....with the AM radio I heard a religious presentation along those lines.

"Brothers and sisters we know the Lord hears all. We know it! But we do not want to trouble the Lord...do we? We don NOT want to trouble the Lord! So when we pray we should make it easy on the Lord......EASY ON THE LORD! So what ah propose is that WE make it easy on the Lord my sending him all our prayers from the top of this radio tower. Yes, ah know you can pray to the Lord from your homes in these valleys and he will hear you. HE WILL HEAR YOU. But if you want to make it EASY ON THE LORD come up the mountain to this radio station and we will make it easy on the LORD by sending Him our messages from the top of this radio tower on top of this mountain. See ya all Sunday right here, Amen!"

Those who showed up were promised a prayer shawl to put on their radios. Additional offering required to defray the costs of the radio station prayer.

Joe

 

[raoul5788]

Commdeck.. A failed product.
The supply house where I bought my stuff was pushing Commdeck like nobody's business. The rub was there was no reimbursement to the tech for the cost and there was no charge to the custy permitted by Dish. So no one bought them. I sure as hell would not buy anything non standard for which I could not recoup my expenses.
The installation issue with this device was most techs did not know the proper way to install them.
Anyway, Dish in house techs in the shop closest to here were prohibited from installing over the living area of the house. Any new connect that could not be done from the ladder, Dish sent to the contractors( RSP's) to complete.
Nice, huh? Dish wasn't concerned with the safety of the techs, they were reducing their exposure to Worker's Comp claims.

So you are saying the Commdeck is a failed product only because the moron installing it didn't know how, yes? How does that make it a failure?