Intermittent Actuator Problem

[FTA4PA]

I have a problem that I just can't figure out. I purchased an 8' mesh dish a while ago and have been setting it up. Got everything working this week and had it tracking 72W to 107W with a new HARL-3612+ actuator that I already had. I wanted to scan a little more of the arc and had bought a new HARL-3618 actuator that just came. After installing the HARL-3618 I was able to program two satellite locations and then it just stopped moving and the positioner gave ER2 code when trying to move either direction. Here is what I have done so far:

Checked dish for binding: OK
Reset diseqc positioner in case of limits problem: OK
Tighted down all connectors: OK
Checked all wires to actuator for continuity with meter: OK
Check for voltage at actuator when E/W buttons pressed: OK
Checked reed switch with meter: OK
Checked function of limit switches with meter: OK


Still nothing so, opened motor case:

Checked internal wires going to motor: OK
Checked motor brushes: OK
Added a bit of grease at each end of the motor shaft in case it was binding

After doing this and putting it back together it ran ok. I was able to extend it and retract it to the limits more than a dozen times. Thought great, that's got it. Put it back on dish, went inside and a short while later it quit again with ER2 on the positioner. ARRRGH! After more tinkering I found out that if I loosened the two screws on the motor case, jiggled the armature assembly and retightened the screws it would run sometimes but not reliably. Has anyone ever got one of these that acted like this new? If so, were you able to track the problem down? The thing wants to run but something is just not letting it. One more thing, I hooked up the HARL-3612+ again and that runs with no problems so 99.9% sure it's something with the motor on the HARL-3618. Any ideas are appreciated!

Additional info
Positioner: DiseqcBox from DMS International
Receiver: X2 Premium HD
Dish: TEK2000 8' Mesh

 

[waylew]

Not familiar with those units,but,can you just swap the motor/gearbox from the 12 to the 18?

 

[Magic Static]

ER2 is a sensor circuit problem= No pulses sensed. You need to carefully check the sensor circuit. I have experienced intermittent reed switches.

 

[FTA4PA]

You read my mind waylew. I was wondering if that's possible if I can't get the 18" working. A bit worried about taking the 12" apart. If it gets damaged or won't go back together right then I'll be without any actuator. Might be my only option though, or just stick with the 12" for now as getting another is out of the question money-wise.

 

[. Raine]

Check that the correct motor is on it, 36V, and not one of the 24V or 12V units installed onto it by mistake by the manufacturer.

 

[FaT Air]

bought a new HARL-3618 actuator that just came.

Contact the seller for a replacement?

 

[FTA4PA]

ER2 is a sensor circuit problem= No pulses sensed. You need to carefully check the sensor circuit. I have experienced intermittent reed switches.

Magic Static, thanks for replying. Did read online that ER2 is no pulses detected. Reed switch works great when I can get the motor to run. Problem is motor is not running so no pulses to count. Since I didn't bury the cable yet, I actually had the actuator in the house in the same room as the receiver and positioner. When I pressed the buttons for east and west there is no movement at all in the motor hence no pulse as magnet doesn't turn. When I undo the two screws on the motor case, jiggle the armature and redo the screws, sometimes the motor runs then the pulses count great. Also, removed the magnet and passed it over the reed switch manually and positioner shows pulse counts every time. Really appears to be something in the motor itself but can't figure out where. Really frustrating!

 

[FTA4PA]

Contact the seller for a replacement?

No returns. Bought on ebay, great price, only one available and was listed as new.

 

[FTA4PA]

Check that the correct motor is on it, 36V, and not one of the 24V or 12V units installed onto it by mistake by the manufacturer.

Thanks for the reply! How do you check which motor is installed? Nothing I saw on motor case to tell?

 

[waylew]

If it's like a typical actuator,if the tube diameters are the same remove 1 bolt,slide the gearbox/motor off the tube then slide back on.Check that the drive/driven parts are the same,usually something like a bar into a slot.Probably will have to align the drive/driven to get the other gearbox on and the bolt hole lined up.

 

[. Raine]

Usually there's a label on the case that has the voltage printed on it. If there's no label, the only difference would be the windings and probably not obvious by just looking it.

You could try measuring the windings of the motors with an ohm meter, a lower voltage motor would read a lower resistance, if both motors read the same resistance, then chances are they're both 36V.

If you can't return it, Waylew's idea is what I'd try.

 

[FTA4PA]

Usually there's a label on the case that has the voltage printed on it. If there's no label, the only difference would be the windings and probably not obvious by just looking it.

You could try measuring the windings of the motors with an ohm meter, a lower voltage motor would read a lower resistance, if both motors read the same resistance, then chances are they're both 36V.

If you can't return it, Waylew's idea is what I'd try.

If it's like a typical actuator,if the tube diameters are the same remove 1 bolt,slide the gearbox/motor off the tube then slide back on.Check that the drive/driven parts are the same,usually something like a bar into a slot.Probably will have to align the drive/driven to get the other gearbox on and the bolt hole lined up.

It's a SuperJack HARL-3618. No labels on the motor, just on the actuator tube. I'm going to bring it back inside and check it out again tomorrow so I will test the windings with my meter. If they are the same I may get brave enough to try the 3612's motor on it. Wish me luck!

 

[primestar31]

These are notorious for bad solder joints on the diodes on the east and west limit switches. I had to resolder mine right after I took my actuator out of the box. Try pushing on those connectors with a screwdriver as you are running it. If it starts working, resolder those connections correctly.

 

[FTA4PA]

These are notorious for bad solder joints on the diodes on the east and west limit switches. I had to resolder mine right after I took my actuator out of the box. Try pushing on those connectors with a screwdriver as you are running it. If it starts working, resolder those connections correctly.

Thanks for replying primestar31! That is something I didn't think of. I will look at them later today. The lawn needs it's first mowing. Didn't miss that!

 

[FaT Air]

Don't think a 'wrong voltage' motor would necessarily produce these 'symptoms'.
But a 12 V motor on 36 volts sure would track the arc 'quick'. And produce quite a bit of heat/premature failure.
Got a 'feelling' there's a missing part in the new motor. Missing a washer on the armature. Now the armature can move fore-aft. one way- no problem. the other 'jams up' the brushes against the armature.
Should be a piece of cake to interchange the motor/gearbox assemblies. (unless the shaft diameter is different)

 

[FTA4PA]

Well, I found out what the problem is. A wire is not connected in the windings of the armature. Sure looked alright until I did a really close inspection. Brushes travel over it but no electricity flows. If it happens to stop there - dead motor. Then when you undo the two motor case screws and jiggle everything it works again until it one of the brushes happens to stop there again.



Took the motor off the HARL-3618 (that was a bear - really on there tight) and replaced it with the one on the HARL-3612 (came off easy). After I got everything back together it seems to be running fine. Gonna put it on the dish and try it out. Will post the results. Wish me luck!

 

[FaT Air]

Ok, I was wrong. Good 'investigative' job. :up :up
Don't know 'how' the limit switch works in those. But you may have to retract the arm all the way. Then back the limit all the way with the motor in the motor/gearbox. Then install it and reset the limit.

 

[FTA4PA]

So far so good! The actuator has been working fine all night. : Thanks for all the great suggestions from everyone! :

 

[KE4EST]

Very Cool.