motor declination...setting

Status
Please reply by conversation.

pmow

Member
Original poster
Sep 19, 2010
7
0
California, USA
I'm a new guy at this....I have a pansat 4500, 36" dish, and DISEqC 1.2 Motorized H-H motor....does anybody know the decllination setting using these components....I'm trying to set up for the 101.0 AMC 4 ku and 97.0 Galaxy 19 Ku satellites....the motor apparatus apparently changes the settings....zip 92677 in Calif., USA

Thanks in advance,

Mike
 
its not in the manual ? there should be a table with values in it. without knowing what hh motor your using its hard to guess at the correct settings.

crackt out,.
 
Shouldn't it simply be his Latitude + ~.6? That is the angle you want the axis of rotation to match the earth's axis. It's the setting for his dish that depends on the amount of bend on the rotor arm for his rotor.
 
My motor manual shows 7.8 degrees declination for that latitude . Subtract 7.8 from the dish elevation angle given by a calculator for your location, and use that dish elevation as the starting point for tuning your setup. The dish elevation setting is one of the adjusting points, so precision isn't necessary, just close enough to start so you can get some Q on your meter, then dial it in.
:)
 
The declination to be used should be ~ 4.8 degrees. (NOT 7.8 , unless there was an earthquake and California is now up in Alaska :) )
However setting the declination requires knowledge of the motor's shaft bend angle, so there will usually be something like 30-decl, or 35-decl, etc, etc, calculation which tells you what to set the elevation scale on the dish attached to the motor.

The initial setting of the declination is just a starting point though, and will be fine tuned by peaking on the due south sat.
HOWEVER, it is recommended that before doing this, you set the motor's latitude (or elevation) setting as carefully as possible. This is where the above mentioned 0.6 deg comes in. Set the motor's latitude to ~ your latitude PLUS 0.6, which will be seen on the elevation scale as 90 minus this number. It's not real critical to get this accurate, but it helps to be aiming at the proper number. Assuming the latitude there is 33.5, then set the latitude just a bit above 34 deg. Peaking on the south sat, don't touch the motor elevation, but peak using the dish elevation.
 

Use the "Modified Polar Mount" chart on this page. It gives the 4.8 declination and the ~34.1 (if you interpolate) "LATITUDE" setting (incorrectly identified as elevation angle on chart, but really the latitude setting)

crakt has best suggestion.

Using SG2100 manual Lat - Long Finder: This page helps you find Latitude and Longitude and paste your zip code in, manual shows 5.5 declination.

You didn't give enough info about your motor.

Manual is simply wrong re 5.5 declination. 5.5 is the declination of a sat to the south, but sats to the west are 0.6 deg lower than that. 5.5 is good enough to get you close, but you'll be off on the extremes if you use that. Use 4.8, and you'll be OK on the extremes, and add the 0.6 to the motor latitude setting, and you'll be OK on the south too, and will track across the arc.
 
Mike,

Don't get confused with trying to compute your declination and using each member's unique calculation method. Review the motor installation guides that are available in the FTA FAQ area. The receiver models in the guides are different, but if you apply the principals of the outlined procedure, you will be successful! Simply set the motor latitude scale to match the latitude of your location then set the dish elevation angle using the chart provided with your motor. The chart provided in the motor's owners manual will be close enough for you to locate then peak the satellite arc of satellites.

Advice.... Use the USALS motor control method to install. Fixating on locating the satellite that is directly south of your location is so outdated and old school!!!! The true key to a successful install is to start with a PERFECTLY plumb, level and stable post.
 
thanks for backing me up bj and satelliteav. the motors "shaft angle" is the reason for needing the manual. they all seem to vary between 30 to 40 - declination table value. i think there may be some confusion between aiming a polar mount and aiming a hh motor.

crackt out,.
 
Motor Elevation: 33.53
Dish Elevation: 24.55
True Azimuth: 117.7
Magn. Azimuth: 104.83

this would be for a sg2100 or hh90. is it the same for a dg280 or 380 ? since the OP didnt post the model of motor it is only a guess. for example the dish elevation for an dg280 for 92677 is 29.55. quite abit of difference.

crackt out,.
 
Even the SG2100's did not all have the same angle in the shaft; some were 40 degrees and some had 30. In any case once that angle is known (from the manual or by measurement) then subtract the declination angle from the shaft angle for example 30 - 5 degrees would be 25 degrees on the dish.
Bob
 
Last edited:
Skjellyfetti said:
Motor Elevation: 33.53
Dish Elevation: 24.55
True Azimuth: 117.7
Magn. Azimuth: 104.83

Not sure where this information is from, but it is incorrect. Before providing technical information, we need to be sure to provide correct information!

The installation latitude is 33.5 not the motor elevation setting. The motor elevation angle would be 90 - 33.5= 56.5 degrees or simply set the motor latitude setting to approx. 33.5 degrees.

The dish angle depends on the design of the motor. We will not be able to advise until the op reveals the motor brand and model.

The installation location longitude is 117 degrees. This is not the azimuth setting for aiming the motor. The magnetically corrected azimuth setting of the install location for the motor aiming is approx. 165 degrees.

Good luck to the op! Hope we can assist!
 
Last edited:
Motor Elevation: 33.53
Dish Elevation: 24.55
True Azimuth: 117.7
Magn. Azimuth: 104.83


Re Motor/Dish Elevation..... This is the conventional method, which will be off by ~0.6 deg at the extremes.

Re Dish Elevation... ALSO, you can't know this without knowing the bend in his motor shaft, which hasn't indicated, so in addition to subtracting the wrong declination, it's been subtracted from a number that could be 15 deg off, depending upon what motor he has.

Re Azimuth,..... I don't know what this azimuth is "to". Perhaps to one of the 2 sats mentioned, but if so, there isn't any way for this info to be used with a motorized system.


Mike,

Don't get confused with trying to compute your declination and using each member's unique calculation method. Review the motor installation guides that are available in the FTA FAQ area. The receiver models in the guides are different, but if you apply the principals of the outlined procedure, you will be successful! Simply set the motor latitude scale to match the latitude of your location then set the dish elevation angle using the chart provided with your motor. The chart provided in the motor's owners manual will be close enough for you to locate then peak the satellite arc of satellites.

Advice.... Use the USALS motor control method to install. Fixating on locating the satellite that is directly south of your location is so outdated and old school!!!! The true key to a successful install is to start with a PERFECTLY plumb, level and stable post.

While I agree that if you use the {incorrect} charts included with most motors, that you will be close enough to lock most sats, but as you mention, it is "close enough for you to locate then peak the satellite arc of satellites", which means that many people will be unhappy enough with the results to end up spending hours tweaking this and that, making things worse before better. I really think that it's better to start aiming at the correct values, because it will end up with less frustration in the long run.

Re the use of USALS, all things being perfect, I agree that USALS SHOULD make alignment much easier, however all things aren't perfect. USALS can only work at all if the motor's zero position is correct, and that isn't always the case. My motor was off be about 2 degrees right from the factory, and has a habit of getting off by as much as 12-15 deg at times. USALS will not work if the zero position is off. Also, as has been discussed in other threads in this forum, most receivers do not calculate USALS properly anyway, at least at high delta longitude values.
All things being perfect, and if USALS was working properly, you should be able to send the dish to any sat, then peak on that, and you'd be aligned, but I really believe that it is much preferable to manually go to your true south sat, because that is where the motor and dish elevation adjustments are most critical, and that is where the actual sat elevation varies the least from sat to sat, so if you use a true south sat, adjust your motor elevation via the modified declination method, and peak on a sat using dish elevation, then you will be MUCH closer to the proper motor/dish elevation, even if your motor's zero is off, and all you will need to do to tack the arc perfectly will be to tweak the motor's azimuth on the pole while on an extreme sat, an adjustment which works best if you can also tweak the motor east/west via diseqC-1.2 for best signal while peaking the azimuth. I use USALS to get close to sats, but use diseqC-1.2 after I've found it. I also try to use USALS for the initial true south sat, but I don't trust it... ie I check the motor's longitude on the scale at the motor shaft to make sure that USALS has sent it to the right place, which as often as not, is not the case.
Anyway, I agree that your advise will usually quickly get people operational, but I really think that your advise will also generally leave people in a situation where they'll end up spending hours tweaking things.
 
I used to live just about 2 miles west of that zip code, and the info came from Satellite dish look angle pointer calculator, I used my old settings as a reference for pmow to get a start on his quest for setting up his dish and motor.


Skjellyfetti, Understood, but the information that was posted is not correct for the ops location. :(

I officially declare satcalculator calculator broken........ just tried the calculator certainly appears to be spitting out bad data!!! Wouldn't calculate correctly for my location either.
 
Last edited:
Status
Please reply by conversation.

Users Who Are Viewing This Thread (Total: 0, Members: 0, Guests: 0)

Who Read This Thread (Total Members: 6)