Well, I'm impressed. Maybe that bodes well for VW diesels. Off to test drive a gasser Jetta now. Gotta drive to Sterling tomorrow to test drive a mini. Pretty far drive for that- I'm surprised there's no closer dealer.
Smart Car?
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Well, yeah. However I also said the 95 GTI-VR6 was my worst car ever. Constant electrical failures from day 1. An engine fire caused by the electrics that almost totalled it in 1997. Continuous coolant failures at 100k, including bad heater core. Finally excessive oil consumption at 160k. VW definitely lost its way in the '90s, and hopefully it is back now.
edit: The Mini thing was intentional on the part of BMW. They initially limited dealerships to foster a feeling of exclusivity. For some reason, they have not expanded them since. The good news is that most any BMW dealership will provide factory service, so you don't have to take it back 100 miles for routine maintenance and repairs.
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So we're at this VW dealership, and I see a Rabbit for sale. I said to my wife, "I was sure they'd stopped making those years ago!" I then related that I knew someone with a Rabbit that was extremely unhappy with it, but I couldn't quite remember who. She said "You're sure it wasn't a Golf?" Uhhhh..... Now I'm not sure about any of it, so I apologize for slamming the Rabbit, I probably had my misrememberer in gear.
Anyway, the Jetta looks great, drove great. Wife unit definitely liked it. Sales critter said they had NO information on the upcoming diesel version, not even a brochure. They were supposed to get one demo unit in June, but it looks like that's not going to happen. He did not seem too enthused about the chances of getting sellable units in September either. Each dealer was supposed to get just the one diesel demo and use it to sell the cars. He fully expects them to all be pre-sold, and kinda danced around them having a "market adjustment" added to the sticker price. No idea what options will be available, or which model lines will have the diesel. His best guess is something over $27,000 as a minimum. Sigh.
Below that, mpg wise, we get into things like the Yaris. I found I had more leg room in a Yaris than in the Scion xD. I lucked into being allowed to sit in a Yaris that was already sold. Dealer said he can't keep any in stock, they're all sold before they ever hit the lot. He had 4 Corollas in stock, and he normally has 80. He also had a very few Camrys. I said things are going good, eh? Then he said sure, until you look at all the SUVs he has sitting in the back lot.
A Yaris, which has significantly lower mpg, costs around half that. So a diesel Jetta would only pay for itself if it retained something like over half it's value after 5 years. And assuming the Yaris would lose way over half it's value (per Edmund's) in the same period. Edmund's shows the TCO for the Yaris to be over $33,200 and 44 cents average costs per mile. Rates for depreciation and operating costs are almost pegged at the max. Not encouraging.
The Aveo comes in at almost $33,900 TCO, and 45 cents/mile. The Accent, $33,800 & 44 cents/mile. And the Fit, $33,000 and 44 cents/mile. All high depreciating, high operating costs. BTW, the Mini Cooper comes in at just under $35,600 and 47 cents/mile. The Jettas are even more, but may turn out to be less, given their very high resale value and the likelihood that Edmund's is understating future fuel cost. Or that could be me grasping at straws.
We'll look at a Mini tonight, where they have a demo.
Anyway, the Jetta looks great, drove great. Wife unit definitely liked it. Sales critter said they had NO information on the upcoming diesel version, not even a brochure. They were supposed to get one demo unit in June, but it looks like that's not going to happen. He did not seem too enthused about the chances of getting sellable units in September either. Each dealer was supposed to get just the one diesel demo and use it to sell the cars. He fully expects them to all be pre-sold, and kinda danced around them having a "market adjustment" added to the sticker price. No idea what options will be available, or which model lines will have the diesel. His best guess is something over $27,000 as a minimum. Sigh.
Below that, mpg wise, we get into things like the Yaris. I found I had more leg room in a Yaris than in the Scion xD. I lucked into being allowed to sit in a Yaris that was already sold. Dealer said he can't keep any in stock, they're all sold before they ever hit the lot. He had 4 Corollas in stock, and he normally has 80. He also had a very few Camrys. I said things are going good, eh? Then he said sure, until you look at all the SUVs he has sitting in the back lot.
A Yaris, which has significantly lower mpg, costs around half that. So a diesel Jetta would only pay for itself if it retained something like over half it's value after 5 years. And assuming the Yaris would lose way over half it's value (per Edmund's) in the same period. Edmund's shows the TCO for the Yaris to be over $33,200 and 44 cents average costs per mile. Rates for depreciation and operating costs are almost pegged at the max. Not encouraging.
The Aveo comes in at almost $33,900 TCO, and 45 cents/mile. The Accent, $33,800 & 44 cents/mile. And the Fit, $33,000 and 44 cents/mile. All high depreciating, high operating costs. BTW, the Mini Cooper comes in at just under $35,600 and 47 cents/mile. The Jettas are even more, but may turn out to be less, given their very high resale value and the likelihood that Edmund's is understating future fuel cost. Or that could be me grasping at straws.
We'll look at a Mini tonight, where they have a demo.
Are you sure about BMW dealership will service Mini? I was just told last month by a BMW dealership (where I have my wife's car oil change) that they cannot service my Mini because they don't sell Mini there.
Oh and speaking of VW Rabbit, my brother just bought a VW R32. That thing is fast... but eat gas like a SUV.
When you test drive, make sure to ask them to show you the "Sport Button". The default is with the sport button off to save gas. With the sport button on, it drives like a different car.
That cut back in engine power is a result of torque management software in the engine computer. It is usually some form of spark retard or electronic throttle pullback or any combination of both.
Almost all automakers do this. That is the first thing car enthusiasts tune out with some aftermarket tuning devices when they buy a muscle car. Makes a big difference. I deleted torque management on my 2005 Pontiac GTO.
Quite honestly in a way I think it is almost counterproductive at this point to invest in new fuel efficient car assuming you have your present car paid for and owe no balance. You have to decide if the fuel savings offset the purchase price and payment and consideration for how many miles you drive per day.
For some it would make sense for others it would not. In my case it would not make sense for me since I owe nothing on any of my two trucks and car. I only drive about 50-60 miles per week.
That cut back in engine power is a result of torque management software in the engine computer. It is usually some form of spark retard or electronic throttle pullback or any combination of both.
Almost all automakers do this. That is the first thing car enthusiasts tune out with some aftermarket tuning devices when they buy a muscle car. Makes a big difference. I deleted torque management on my 2005 Pontiac GTO.
My 2003 s10 2.2L get around 28-29 mpg highway, probably 20 mpg in town.
The gto gets around 25-28 mpg highway with a 6.0L LS2 V8 w/6 speed tremec manual trans. My '98 s10 4.3L V6 Vortec only gets about 14 mpg city and 20 highway.
amazing the GTO is producing a little over 450 Hp and 400 ft lbs torque is returning that kind of mileage. Seems like a conspiracy to me LOL The GTO is modded with aftermarket heads, cam, intake, headers, dual 3" exhaust with X-pipe, magnaflow mufflers, Nitto 555R drag radials, K&N air filter, 160 T-stat.
Car weighs in at 3700 lbs.
Well, we test drove the Mini tonight. No new ones on the lot for sale, everything currently on order is already sold. Might be able to order some 2008s for delivery in 2-3 months, or 2009s in October. Yes, you can get a nice one for around $22,000 - but most were well above that.
We liked the cockpit sort of surround. Seat bolsters were too hard. No one would ever be able to ride in the back seat behind me, even in the club wagon. But hey, we were looking at a two seater Smart, so the back seat is no biggie. Lot's of switches, lot's of nice features. But overall, it just didn't seem quite right for us. More of a sports car feel, I guess. And the Smart Car seemed to have more space around the two of us than the Mini.
And for a few thousand more, the diesel Jetta will offer much better mileage and more space. That's probably what we'll get, it's pre-approved by the boss, if we ever get the chance to actually place an order.
We liked the cockpit sort of surround. Seat bolsters were too hard. No one would ever be able to ride in the back seat behind me, even in the club wagon. But hey, we were looking at a two seater Smart, so the back seat is no biggie. Lot's of switches, lot's of nice features. But overall, it just didn't seem quite right for us. More of a sports car feel, I guess. And the Smart Car seemed to have more space around the two of us than the Mini.
And for a few thousand more, the diesel Jetta will offer much better mileage and more space. That's probably what we'll get, it's pre-approved by the boss, if we ever get the chance to actually place an order.
Yes, like all VWs of a certain era the Rabbit had some problems. Recently though they've been hyping VWs as having the *best* Kelly Blue-Book resale values out of any maker (above Acura and Honda):
VW Takes Lead in Resale-Value Rankings - WSJ.com
The old Rabbit became the Golf and then this model year for some bizarre reason VW switched back to the Rabbit name in the US market even though they still sell the vehicle as a Golf in Europe. Here the Rabbit comes in 2 and 4 door versions. Other "Rabbit" versions available in the US include the GTI (2.0T gas engine - quite sporty) and the ridiculous R32 (all-wheel-drive 3.2L engine).
But incidentally what we get of the VW range is quite limited compared to across the Atlantic. In Europe they have those plus a "Golf Plus" which is slightly longer but not as big as the up-coming SportWagen (essentially to be sold as the Jetta wagon here). Euro Golfs come in a variety of engines, including (of course) diesel. And then they sell two *smaller* models: the Polo and the tiny Fox (the latter which seems to be a newer version of what was previously the Lupo, no relation to the Fox sold in the US in the 1980s). The diesel Polo lists fuel consumption at a stunning 57.6mpg urban, 88.3mpg extra-urban, but those are Imperial gallons. Mpg with US gallons are "only" 46 city and 70 highway, using the British equivalent of the EPA tests. No idea if those bear up under real world driving.
Can you tell I've been looking at VWs?
CDH.
Sigh. Now I want a Fox.
Oh wait, I married one!
I read that the overseas Golf, the US Rabbit and the US Jetta are all based on the same platform, just with different body, trim & interiors.
And thanks for the link, it's a great read.
Oh wait, I married one!
I read that the overseas Golf, the US Rabbit and the US Jetta are all based on the same platform, just with different body, trim & interiors.
And thanks for the link, it's a great read.
"Platform" doesn't necessarily mean much. For example the Ford Focus, the Mazda3 and the Volvo S40 all share a platform.
But I think you're right that the current Rabbit and the Golf are almost the same, with the Jetta a longer version to accomodate that enormous trunk.
If you're interested in reading about the European versions the UK VW site is pretty interesting: The Official Website for Volkswagen UK : Volkswagen UK One thing you'll notice is the much higher price of cars in the UK! The low end models are cheap, but the Jetta starts over GBP 15,000, or about US$30k!
I really like the look of the new Scriocco. Yet another VW not due to cross the Atlantic.
CDH.
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Yeah, I call it a "four body" trunk.
I like that web site. Simple, direct. Just click on the picture of the car you're interested in. But sadly, it seems to be a different diesel engine coming to the US model.
I like that web site. Simple, direct. Just click on the picture of the car you're interested in. But sadly, it seems to be a different diesel engine coming to the US model.
I just noticed a teaser on the Honda website:
A Honda Hybrid Within Your Reach - Starting in Early 2009
There look to be *three* upcoming Honda hybrids including the sporty CR-Z, but also two cheaper (smaller?) ones:
Honda to preview new hybrid in Paris - Autoblog
It is supposed to be cheaper than the current Civic hybrid.
CDH.
A Honda Hybrid Within Your Reach - Starting in Early 2009
There look to be *three* upcoming Honda hybrids including the sporty CR-Z, but also two cheaper (smaller?) ones:
Honda to preview new hybrid in Paris - Autoblog
It is supposed to be cheaper than the current Civic hybrid.
CDH.
Fiend of mine had a Jetta I guess it was new around 2004 or 5. TYhe manual said that it would burn oil. It was designed that way. He talked to a mechanic and was told that VW goofed and installed rings backwards I think in each piston chamber or something like that. Rather than recall all of the engines they wrote that into the manual. Many think they have worn rings but this crap was planned. He traded it in for a Fusion. http://www.consumeraffairs.com/automotive/vw_oil.html
I had a horse and carriage until recently. Trust me, it is NOT the economical solution!
Also, don't forget that major cities welcomed the automobile as relief from the significant air pollution problem brought on by horses' methane production.
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