OTHER Universal LNB - Linear - on a DISH NET 1000.2 dish (1 Viewer)

T.J.M.

Thread Starter
Well-Known SatelliteGuys Member
Feb 11, 2017
27
10
Michigan
Hi Everybody,

I am brand new to the fta arena and have some questions. First though I will list my current setup.

  • Dish network 1000.2 dish (I measured this across and it was 25")
  • iSmart F1 hd fta receiver
  • X2- Full HD KU Single Universal LNB "0.1 DB"
I am in the Michigan area and I seem to get good signals with fair quality (0-60%) the universal lnb however I was unable to pick up any "FTA" channels. Today was cloudy though and I have read that using a smaller than 30" dish it is more likely a novelty and will only work on clear days.

Anyway questions are here:

1) After I failed to get any FTA channels, I switched the rg6 cable back to my dish network receiver (I am a paid subscriber currently) and surprisingly my one lnb was able to pull in all 3 dish satellites (110, 119 and 129). If that is the case, what is the reason the dish 1000.2 has 3 lnb's on it? Is it just to help ensure better potential to hit all 3 satellites?

2) Is it normal for a universal linear lnb to be able to pick up dish network signals and send them to the dish network receiver ? just seems odd to me that this worked and everything i have read said the dish network lnb's are circular polarity and not linear.

3) My dish is a 25" oval and I have read that for FTA you typically need a bigger dish (30" or larger) to make up for the lower power of those satellites like Galaxy 19. I have seen for sale a 36" oval Direct TV dish (Directv 36EDS International) that was used for subscribers to get international channels. Are the odds good that this dish will work fine for FTA reception? Or is it better to go with a more traditional circle dish instead? Would a circular dish pick up a broader range of signal compared to an oval one?or vice versa?

4) On my fta receiver I noticed that the TP of the listed satellites was off somewhat from what was listed on lyngsat. Does that matter much? An example of this is that lyngsat would say I could find FTA channels at 12058 H 22000 but on my receiver it might have said (I am not looking at it now) 12060 H 22000? Is this significant or do the satellites drift a little bit over time?

5) My universal lnb would say that it could handle up to Input Frequency Range LOW Band:10.7~11.7GHz High Band:11.7~12.75GHz however the settings in my receiver only went up to like 1175 for the LNB. Does that mean my receiver can't support the full range of the lnb? Is that maybe why I couldn't hit fta channels with my 25" 1000.2 dish?

6) My receiver had settings for the LNB to be ON, 13v or 18v. I noticed when playing around with it for a satellite or two if I switched it to 18v that I could sometimes get better quality of signal... however that still didn't help me pick up any stations today. What is the difference between 13v or 18v with the LNB?

7) Has anybody had decent success using a tripod with a 33" or 36" dish that is placed on a deck (maybe 3 feet off the ground) ? I have a deck that faces nicely to the south but I have some fairly tall trees (50feet) that are about 3/4 of an acre away from the deck). Was thinking this might be easier for me to tune FTA until I get better at lining up the satellites -- although i realize maybe once leaves come on the trees I might not get signal then lol

8) Has anybody used the winegard DS-2076 dish for FTA with success?it says its a 30" (76cm) dish ?

Also sorry in advanced if this is the wrong forum for this post and questions. Thanks for answering my questions... I am excited about this new hobby and hope someday soon I can get some fta reception!!
 

KE4EST

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:welcome to SatelliteGuys!!!

1. Not sure what you mean by this. Did you leave the dish pointed in one direction and "thought" you were getting all three? If so, you were not, the DISH receiver is just confused. For proper reception the DishNet dish does need 3 LNBF's to point at the 3 birds at the same time.
2. A linear LNBF will pick up circular transponders with about a 3.0dB loss.
3. You will for sure need a larger dish. Your DN, dish is not large enough. You will pick up a few transponders, but not most. DISH pumps out WAY more power than most other satellite transponders. If you go with an oval dish you will need the proper LNBF that has the proper feed-horn to properly illuminate the dish surface. You will be better off if starting from scratch to get a dish made for what you are trying to do and to better match that LNBF you already have.
4. Either your receiver is off or your LNBF, or both. Anyway yeah as long as you are aware you are off a bit you will be fine.
5. Which setting in your receiver? What was it called? You need to go in where it says LO or Local Oscillator and set it for 9750/10600 universal.
6. Not sure what signal you were looking at but if it was a circular transponder like a DN bird that sounds right. However, on other birds they have vertical(~13V) and horizontal(~18V), transponders. In your previous example that is what the H stood for in 12058 H 22000. H being horizontal and V being Vertical.
7. Yes, several people have. I would get a 5gal or larger bucket though and cement in a pole and do it that way, much sturdier. The satellite on an offset dish is higher than where the dish is seeming to point. There are a few APPS for smart phones that you could down load to get a better idea of where the birds are at in the sky.
8. Yes, just will not get all transponders due to the smaller size. People used to have much better success with them, however once most everything went to DVB-S2 it got harder to receiver those on that size dish.

I hope I answered some of your questions. If you don't understand something, please feel free to ask. I myself am getting ready to go to bed, but there are many more knowledgeable guys here that love to help out a newbie.
 
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T.J.M.

Thread Starter
Well-Known SatelliteGuys Member
Feb 11, 2017
27
10
Michigan
Thanks for the welcome...

Reply to your 1) answer.. i actually didn't move my dish at all since the 3 lnb were already set up properly for my dish receiver and I'm a customer. I have two rg6 cables coming from the dish. When they changed me to dish 1000.2 they only used one of the cables and the other has been not hooked up.

I just climbed up to the dish and added my universal lnb to the extra cable , switched the lines over inside the house at my block where they came together and that's how i set it up. After i was done messing with the fta receiver i moved the rg6 input back to my dish receiver and did a scan while it was connected to the linear universal lnb. This picked up signal and i switched to about 10 channels sample and when you click info on the remote twice for each channel it tells you what satellite that channel is pulling from. I was able to see channels from each sat working 110,119,129) on my one LNB. To verify i wasn't actually using the 3lnb setup i undid that line from the block and the channels still came in clear.
 

T.J.M.

Thread Starter
Well-Known SatelliteGuys Member
Feb 11, 2017
27
10
Michigan
For 3) and 8)

For now i ended up buying the dishnet 36EDS because it was cheap so i don't have to worry about that 30" winegard. I am concerned though that you say i need a proper lnbf to handle the oval shape of the 36EDS (world view) dish?? It seems like the x2 universal linear lnb i bought was picking up sats from my 1000.2 25" dish so I'm hoping that the extra 11" that the 36EDS brings will help me pick up channels better.. Especially once i get it mounted on a tripod and can tune in directly on to say galaxy 19 at 97w. Once i verify that is working I can consider doing what you suggested with a 5gallon bucket and mounting a pole but i live close to a lot of trees and want to make sure i can clear them first especially in summer when they have leaves on.
 

T.J.M.

Thread Starter
Well-Known SatelliteGuys Member
Feb 11, 2017
27
10
Michigan
For 5) yep thank you i read another thread after posting this and it explained that..i looked at my lnbf and see an L.O. listed that matches a setting i saw on my receiver. When i first saw this while trying to get tuned in i was worried i bought a wrong or not completely covered range lnb but not it seems to be OK... This explanation helps a lot.

Also for 6) thank you that is helpful to know.. my receiver had 3 settings for the lnb voltage..on, 13v and 18v... Do you think it's possible that On is auto detect and set? Or are most receivers fussy enough that you have to tell it be at a certain voltage? Seems like that's a good way to only tune into H or V transponders but it also limits the reception to only those types as specified if that's the case.
 

T.J.M.

Thread Starter
Well-Known SatelliteGuys Member
Feb 11, 2017
27
10
Michigan
Finally for 4 the receiver came preset with usa accessible sats and i didn't see an easy way to add/adjust the corresponding tp settings that lyngsat was showing. When you say either the receiver or the lnb is off.. for the lnb do you mean off as in position (like not hitting direct center of the dish) or off as in digital precision (nothing i can do to adjust it.. Was just manufactured that way)? When i added the lnb to my 25" dish it was definitely not centered because i didn't take off the 3 circular lnb for dish network since I'm still using them with my dish receiver and i was just quicky trying to play with fta to get an understanding of how it works and it's terminology. Definitely a lot to absorb but I'm slowly getting an understanding :)
 

Titanium

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May 23, 2013
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A 25" dish is far too small for anything but the strongest transponders. Nothing will be received unless the Universal LNBF is exactly mounted and the dish is re-aimed.

In order for the universal LNBF to work, it would need to be mounted in place of the existing center LNBF at the same height,distance and angle. On this tiny dish, a side mounted LNBF will not gather enough signal to work.

I would try channels from Galaxy 3c @ 95w The STB LNB Type would be set to match the LNBF (9750/10600) and the power would be set to Auto. Select an active and STRONG transponder from the list (11780 H 20760 - CCTV channels). Is this satellite in the STB list of satellites?

Use Dishpointer.com to find where the dish must be aimed to receive this satellite from your location. Rotate the dish skew angle on the rear bracket to the correct angle. Set the approximate elevation angle on the rear mount bracket. Identify a landmark in the far distance that Akins with the approximate compass reading of the satellite.

Place a small TV next to the dish and watch for Signal Quality reading to increase as the dish is moved SLOWLY east and west (10-15 degrees either side of the landmark) of the satellite location. If no Signal Quality is found,increase or decrease the elevation in one decree increments and SLOWLY sweep EAST/WEST again. Repeat until satellite is located.
 

jorgek

SatelliteGuys Pro
Mar 11, 2013
1,214
221
Near Toronto
I have a 25" offset dish with a linear LNB and it works well with 30w or 97w. Its not ideal but adequate.
However if the 25" dish above is an elliptical probably it will not work because the LNB will only see the center of the dish rather than receiving signal from the entire surface of the dish.
 
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T.J.M.

Thread Starter
Well-Known SatelliteGuys Member
Feb 11, 2017
27
10
Michigan
I have a 25" offset dish with a linear LNB and it works well with 30w or 97w. Its not ideal but adequate.
However if the 25" dish above is an elliptical probably it will not work because the LNB will only see the center of the dish rather than receiving signal from the entire surface of the dish.

1000.2 25" dish is elipictal :( I ended up buying a DirecTv World Dish 36" elliptical for $40 (including the lnbfs - I have read the 95lnbf is a linear one and might work as-is) because I have heard it can get in 95w (Galaxy 3c) and 97w (Galaxy 19) by other people. I set it up yesterday on a tripod and was playing around with it for a few hours but didn't get any locks (signal strength was in the high 70s and low 80s though which I think is great news but quality was 0) - mostly because I wasn't sure what to set the skew to for the lnb and also it was windy and the tripod was taking a beating from the wind with this heavier dish on (I am sure my vertical plumb was not plumb for very long lol). However I have done more research and feel a bit more confident the next time I go out how to set it up properly. I did get a dish augmented reality app... and the data from dishpointer.com.. which match up so I know I have a clear view of these 2 sats at my place (the augmented reality app is awesome because I can see where the sat is in comparison to all my trees!!). Thanks for the info though I am sure it will help somebody out.
 

hank123

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Hitting FTA sats is not as easy as hitting Dish or Directv stuff. if your getting 70s-80s it means your receiver sees the dish, but the dish is not seeing anything out of the sky. You can point it at the ground and it will give you the same reading.
 

T.J.M.

Thread Starter
Well-Known SatelliteGuys Member
Feb 11, 2017
27
10
Michigan
Hitting FTA sats is not as easy as hitting Dish or Directv stuff. if your getting 70s-80s it means your receiver sees the dish, but the dish is not seeing anything out of the sky. You can point it at the ground and it will give you the same reading.

It is funny you say that about pointing it at the ground because I kind of did that by accident when I was adjusting the elevation and the harness it was on dropped to make the dish point down. I did notice that the signal strength was still high so I was kind of baffled by it. I tried 2 nights ago for about 45mins to lock in but I still couldn't do it. When the weekend comes I am thinking about take the dish off the tripod because it seriously easy for it to get out of plumb and try to attach the tri-mast to a piece of plywood or something so I can rule that out. I am using the 95 lnbf that came with the 36EDS - which has the following specs:

Eagle Aspen 6500001
95 KU Feed
Input Freq: 11.7 - 12.2 GHz
Output Freq: 950 - 1450 MHz

From what I have read this is only a H polarity lnbf however the sat I am trying to hit 95 WEST - Galaxy 3c - is supposed to have some very strong CCTV/CGTN channels that are available. I also think there are still some DirecTV H channels on that same satellite but I don't know if they are as powerful as the traditional DirecTV sats that use the circular lnbs.

For my location it states the skew is 9.6 so I have been adjusting the dish to 99.6degrees SKEW on back of the pole mount. Dish pointer is stating that my az is supposed to be between 195-200 with an elevation of 39 and I have a perfect landmark visual to line it up at according to their map where the signal goes over, but that didn't work.

When I used the augmented reality app it was actually telling me the sat in the sky was more to the left (closer to due south) and was stating an az of 166 i think -- but I wasn't sure that would be correct at all. Maybe it was getting a bad gps reading and that was messing it up... actually that very well could be to be honest.

Anyway i know with patience I will hit it at some point. Right now its just been too cold to spend more than an hour or two outside and do the fine tuning (I have read a few strategies of adjusting elevation by a degree and panning sat left and right slowly, rinse and repeat). Plus I have a digital sat finder that is coming in a short while and that has sound / beeps which is supposed to help me lock on better. Unfortunately I don't think my receiver has beeps :( But I know the receiver, when I had it hooked up to my 1000.2 dish, was able to get good quality measures on the 110/119/129 sat so I think I can rule out that the receiver is faulty.
 

jorgek

SatelliteGuys Pro
Mar 11, 2013
1,214
221
Near Toronto
I would stick with dishpointer.com rather than the location app. If you align your dish following the line pointing to the sat, you should right on.
Also if you can, bring the receiver and monitor out to the dish so you can see what is going on as you fine tune the azimuth and elevation settings. 97w is a good sat to start with as they put out strong transponder signals.
 

Shicks4

SatelliteGuys Pro
Aug 29, 2015
470
253
Kansas
I have had success with all dish network dishes i have experimented with to receiver fta signals. I receive everything on 97w with about a 60% Q on my wetek play 2 if im pointed directly at 97w. It drops about 10% if i point one lnbf at 103w and place a second lnbf at 97w. I have had minimal success with a third lnbf pointing at 87w. I only pick up the patient channel and the MTA mux, and only using a dishnetwork turbohd dish not a dish 500. The Dish 500 will do 97w and 103w fine though. Its also important to mention neither dish will receive any pbs mux at all. Was hoping they would but even pointed directly at 87w or 125w no pbs with the exception of 125w does now receive montana pbs (assume its due to recent power increase). IM attaching photos of my first attempt at small dish useage with the results using a sathawk pro receiver. the 3 satellites i was receiving were 91w 97w and 103w with 103w being the main lnbf.
 

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T.J.M.

Thread Starter
Well-Known SatelliteGuys Member
Feb 11, 2017
27
10
Michigan
Great news to report today!! I hit pay dirt with my 36EDS direct tv world view. My first success was galaxy 17 at 91degrees. I was able to get 9 channels. Then my next success was Galaxy 3 at 95 degrees. I was able to get about 9 channels here as well.

This confirms that the 95 eagle aspen lnbf that came with this dish works with both H and V polarity on a fta receiver. It also confirms that my cheap receiver is able to pick up fta signals!!

Woohoo!! When i get back im going to try to pull in galaxy 19 at 97w since everybody says this is very strong signal.
 

T.J.M.

Thread Starter
Well-Known SatelliteGuys Member
Feb 11, 2017
27
10
Michigan
I have had success with all dish network dishes i have experimented with to receiver fta signals. I receive everything on 97w with about a 60% Q on my wetek play 2 if im pointed directly at 97w. It drops about 10% if i point one lnbf at 103w and place a second lnbf at 97w. I have had minimal success with a third lnbf pointing at 87w. I only pick up the patient channel and the MTA mux, and only using a dishnetwork turbohd dish not a dish 500. The Dish 500 will do 97w and 103w fine though. Its also important to mention neither dish will receive any pbs mux at all. Was hoping they would but even pointed directly at 87w or 125w no pbs with the exception of 125w does now receive montana pbs (assume its due to recent power increase). IM attaching photos of my first attempt at small dish useage with the results using a sathawk pro receiver. the 3 satellites i was receiving were 91w 97w and 103w with 103w being the main lnbf.

Any chance you can take some closeups of how you setup your lnb holders?? Looks like you are using hose clamps to hold them in place??

I'm going to try to do something similar to add my universal lnb that i bought to pull in 2 satellites at the same time. I like it that you can add more too... Looks like the horizontal bar you have might be easily adjusted.
 

T.J.M.

Thread Starter
Well-Known SatelliteGuys Member
Feb 11, 2017
27
10
Michigan
Great news to report today!! I hit pay dirt with my 36EDS direct tv world view. My first success was galaxy 17 at 91degrees. I was able to get 9 channels. Then my next success was Galaxy 3 at 95 degrees. I was able to get about 9 channels here as well.

This confirms that the 95 eagle aspen lnbf that came with this dish works with both H and V polarity on a fta receiver. It also confirms that my cheap receiver is able to pick up fta signals!!

Woohoo!! When i get back im going to try to pull in galaxy 19 at 97w since everybody says this is very strong signal.
20170219_114818.jpg
20170219_102953.jpg
20170219_102927.jpg
20170219_103012.jpg


Here are some pictures i took to verify that i was getting good signal today.

Sent from my LGLS665 using the SatelliteGuys app!
 

Shicks4

SatelliteGuys Pro
Aug 29, 2015
470
253
Kansas
Any chance you can take some closeups of how you setup your lnb holders?? Looks like you are using hose clamps to hold them in place??

I'm going to try to do something similar to add my universal lnb that i bought to pull in 2 satellites at the same time. I like it that you can add more too... Looks like the horizontal bar you have might be easily adjusted.
Ill snap some pics soon as i go back over to the shop, im going to be working on a hughesnet dish this afternoon and ill post some pics then. Basically i took a medium duty 90* bracket and bent it in my vice to the proper angles to position the lnbf at the right height and close to the distance away from the focal point. Then i took a medium duty 12" strap and cut slots on either side so i could slide my lnbf holders, and i used standard 1 5/8" pole clamps with standoffs as my lnbf holders. I finally just bought a 6' piece of metal strap to bend whatever I want for future playing. IM actually pretty surprised at how well it actually does work, but its no where near as good as a 90cm dish but it does work, even worked while it was drizzling the other day but id wager a real rain shower and it would go away. Im kinda interested to see how well the Hughesnet dish does as its quite a bit bigger them the turbohd dish. And im going to try the lnbf that came with the hughesnet dish as i seen lots of places on sathint and lyngsat that show the signals being horizontal and vertical. Will certainly be interesting to be sure.
 
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Shicks4

SatelliteGuys Pro
Aug 29, 2015
470
253
Kansas
BTW im pretty sure the F1 receiver you are using is almost identical to the X2 M1-HD+ receiver. I got one for the Neighbor who asked for the dish I took the Photos of. It is VERY similar in performance and the software is Identical down to the version release. I just gave him the dish, and he paid what i did for the lnbf's and the brackets and receiver. For about 50 bucks he gets around 50 channels he can watch (english) though a lot of them are the religious channels.
 
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