ASC-1 Question

[arlo]

Here's one for you Brian.
Does the ASC-1 have dynamic braking? In other words when motor power is shut off to the actuator will the motor coast to a stop or not?
And if the motor shuts off will the counter still increment/decrement? If I go out and spin the encoder by hand will I come in and see the display has changed?

 

[Magic Static]

The ASC1 hits the brakes so hard that there was a concern of causing premature wear on the dish mount. So the ASC1 was coded to slow down before it hit the target position. It was later decided the feature was not needed and coded out. The sensor circuit shuts off when the motor does so spinning the encoder by hand won't change the count. Aside from that most actuators have some kind of worm drive and it's hard to get a worm gear to coast at all.

 

[KE4EST]

The sensor circuit shuts off when the motor does so spinning the encoder by hand won't change the count.

Mine will still count whether the power is applied to the motor or not.

 

[Magic Static]

Mine will still count whether the power is applied to the motor or not.

.Interesting. I was told it wasn't so. But I never checked.

 

[arlo]

Thanks. Usually I pop the lid off of my stuff to see what's inside..
Wouldn't really want to on this beast but it would be nice to know how to without hatcheting it if there was a day it needed it cracked open.
Reason I asked was I think there's a little coast-by when doing things like bumping to peak a new sat or finding one. Doing just that a few times knocks of the numerical reference of the rest several counts. You know what happens after that.
No slop in the polar mount pivots as they have been replaced with pillow blocks. 2 on top, 2 on bottom.
Was just wondering if there was actually braking resistors on the N.O. relay contacts.
Maybe the grease I used was just slicker 'n cat s .........errr. Stevens. Yeah Stevens. Let's roll with that.

 

[KE4EST]

.Interesting. I was told it wasn't so. But I never checked.

Now, you have me wanting to test it again.
I know it did last time I checked, but that has been awhile.

 

[Magic Static]

Thanks. Usually I pop the lid off of my stuff to see what's inside..

I can't keep my fingers off either......

 

[dreambox59]

hi guy !
what is this moded titanium ?
a prototype model ? or you have just take the box and put something else in it ?
Why two LCD with 2 different sat ?
does it drive 2 dish ?

my project :

positionner

hi everybody especially Mr. Titanium I live in FRANCE and I have made a positioner which can drive two motors and a lnb changer (made with a diseqc motor) also drive polarotor like corotor. I have create this device just for me and 2 friends . as you stop building ASC1 do you...

www.satelliteguys.us

Home made diseqc positioner

since a few months i decided to make my own positioner : -i need to manage 2 actuators (azimut elevation) -i need polarotor command (co-rotor chapparal) - 200 positions (c/ku/ka) - and lnb changer !!! - remote control + keyboard + usb for upgrade . i have used an old moteck positioner and a...

www.satellites.co.uk

 

[Magic Static]

hi guy !
what is this moded titanium ?
a prototype model ? or you have just take the box and put something else in it ?
Why two LCD with 2 different sat ?
does it drive 2 dish ?

my project :

positionner

hi everybody especially Mr. Titanium I live in FRANCE and I have made a positioner which can drive two motors and a lnb changer (made with a diseqc motor) also drive polarotor like corotor. I have create this device just for me and 2 friends . as you stop building ASC1 do you...

www.satelliteguys.us

Home made diseqc positioner

since a few months i decided to make my own positioner : -i need to manage 2 actuators (azimut elevation) -i need polarotor command (co-rotor chapparal) - 200 positions (c/ku/ka) - and lnb changer !!! - remote control + keyboard + usb for upgrade . i have used an old moteck positioner and a...

www.satellites.co.uk

It's basically two ASC1 positioners in one case. They share the power source and the keyboard. I have a C-band and a Ku dish that I control with this.



I did the same with some Vboxes for a backup unit. One has VBox 7 boards and the other has VBox X boards. All of them have more powerful transformers from older Japanese made actuator controllers.

 

[dreambox59]

good job !
good idea to change transformer in vbox models !
do you find a truck full of titanium cases ??
do you read any software in vboxes ???

 

[Magic Static]

do you find a truck full of titanium cases ??
do you read any software in vboxes ???

I made some deals with Brian at Titanium on some returns he really didn't want to sell. I also had bought a 4 unit case of the 1st run ASC1s that had some build discrepancies and Brian just sent us new ones and we didn't return the old ones. So I was heavy on ASC1s .

I would like to read the VBoxes. The two VBox 7s I have paired up actually have different firmware on them. The early 7 is just the same as the X models but the late model 7 is way different. Different hardware on the board too.

 

[dreambox59]

here is schematic of two old issue !
may be useful to draw the new one !

 

[arlo]

Speaking of. Big sustained wind storm here a few nights ago with heavy rain.
Lost signal on all sats. No biggie. Amazon Prime to the rescue.
The next morning, no signal. Hit 131W and got a motor stall.
Nothing mechanical at the dish. My super-crap actuator bracket is drilled for a set screw and the screw housing is dimple drilled for it. Nothing moved. Looks like the wind blew and "unwound" the actuator.
Looks like for me no motor, no encoder count. Answers the question in my OP.
Got everything back in whack. Just a few counts off from the stored settings. Bump to peak for each sat, store the position. You know the drill.
Fill me in. Something in the ASC-1 manual about resetting or re-indexing sat positions to be covered in future-something. Can I do it w/o finding and peaking each sat?

Edit:
Oh yeah. What's the deal with inclined orbit satellites where there is a second small actuator I'm seeing here and there?

 

[Titanium]

Perform a "Positioner Count Reset Resychronize Satellites" as described on page 11 of the ASC1 manual. All satellites will be resynched to the new reference 0000 position.

Some hobbyists have replaced the threaded elevation adjustment bar with a 12" actuator jack and use a second controller to offset the elevation for declines orbit satellites.

 

[Magic Static]

Now, you have me wanting to test it again.
I know it did last time I checked, but that has been awhile.

I was talking with Titanium yesterday and he brought up the fact that the sensor circuit was coded in the firmware to shut off when not in use. It originally was left on. So if yours stays on, you have some old firmware

 

[KE4EST]

I was talking with Titanium yesterday and he brought up the fact that the sensor circuit was coded in the firmware to shut off when not in use. It originally was left on. So if yours stays on, you have some old firmware

Well it was 2014 when I tested that. When I was working on the first home brew controller.

 

[dreambox59]

as time goes on i have find all source of lost pulses .
today i never have to Resychronize Satellites (except if a power shut down occurs while moving)
in my software i count pulses during moves and still count 50mS after stop it s enought .
when motor stop no pulses can occurs (or hidden command appears and it s not good!!)

 

[arlo]

as time goes on i have find all source of lost pulses .
today i never have to Resychronize Satellites (except if a power shut down occurs while moving)
in my software i count pulses during moves and still count 50mS after stop it s enought .
when motor stop no pulses can occurs (or hidden command appears and it s not good!!)

A little hard to digest your description.
I find a few sources of lost counts come from bumping your dish to peak signal back and forth.
Adding a satellite or scrolling past one in any of the setup menus where the dish heads towards others as you are forced to go all the way through the list again because you can't go back one sat. A bug in images.
"Coasting" I'll coin that phrase. Motor power shuts off, sensor is shut off, and the motor slows to a stop.
I added molybdenum grease to my actuator shaft and lubed the motor gear reduction with it. First winter where -10 and below didn't give a motor stall error.
At any rate those missed counts add up.
Slop in the motor coupling. Enough of that. Hobby store brass tubing and JB Weld to the rescue.
In my bag 'o tricks I'm thinking of a relay and braking resistor inside of the motor housing. If the real estate allows. I haven't been inside my ASC-1 to see if that was in the design concept or how braking was handled in previous firmware as magic mentioned. Or why we would shut off the sensor circuit.
Reviving a Heathkit (Gohlkit) of the ASC-1 would be awesome because that baby is a monster.

 

[Titanium]

Not sure Arlo of some of your descriptions. If you call out a satellite from a saved list, the ASC1 moves to that location directly. The "goto" callout for the dish does not happen when scrolling through a satellite list. The motor power is only provided when OK is pressed to accept the entry.

The ASC1 sensor circuit remains active and times out after 5 or 8 seconds (???) Forget what the setting was on the final firmware release. Most actuators land almost immediately when power is removed. If an actuator "drifts" for that long of period after power removal, you "gots a bigger problem"... LOL If you need the sensor to be active at all times, likely to result in greater positioning errors.

The bump count errors were in early firmware versions and resolved within the first few releases in 2014. The sensor logic was being intermittently interrupted when external or internal "goto" commands were inputted or received during a previous command execution. Only happened with select STBs or method of button presses, but this was also resolved. I believe in 2015?

The reason that I opted to remove sensor circuit logic after a time out is due to electrical events (lightning / Static / etc.) causing sensor cyles and resulting in miscounts.

Hope this information is helpful.

 

[arlo]

Not sure if TNAP does it. Vix, Pli, PurE2, OpenATV all do though.
In the Blindscan screen for example. If you scroll through your sats list sure enough each one you pass wants to move the dish. Some bug happens where sometimes you're allowed to go back to a previous sat and sometimes not. Forcing you to only go one direction all the way until you get back to the one you wanted. Like in language selection. One way only.