Dish messing with Voom, All are now HD-Lite 1280x1080i: Discuss this issue HERE!

[Gary Murrell]

Things were discussed with members of this forum and Dish, Dish told them that they have chosen quantity over quality, it is over and now we can start speaking with our wallet's

HD-Lite has been accepted by everyone because it is better than SD

HD-Lite is set into motion by Dish, again they have chosen this over quality(confirmed from Dish), nothing can be done now

I want at least one other big $$ sub to confirm cancelling with me and we will tell them why, any volunteers ??

-Gary

 

[hammerdown]

I cancelled my SD channels over 3 monthes ago. My bill is only $20/mo so I can't help you. And even though I think your intentions are admirable, if the game is over you can't score any points.

My plan:
Part 1 - If the new subscription packages will allow it, I will keep all the real HD channels and probably cancel Voom. And I have been waiting for NHRA in HD so I will upgrade my hardware just to get ESP2.
Part 2 - I now have the C-Band/BUD equip, it's just a matter of installation.

Hammer

 

[BrettTRay]

I am going to drop Voom and keep the rest of the HD pack as long as they stay True to the game. I sub to HBO and Showtime so I get the HD channels anyway from them. I damn sure ain't worried about getting a MPEG4 receiver since all this happened. I think we should play the game the way it should be played. Don't drop Dish all at once. Lets be real there isn't anyone who can provide us with what they are. When they down rez the HD pack then drop it. All I'm saying is for everyone to make a decision when they are level headed or you might just regret it.

 

[Tom Bombadil]

Well I wonder if Scott brought this up to Charles while out at the CES Show??

Well, if I'm reading the message that Scott posted correctly, he and two other reps from this forum sat down with the Echostar Director of Communications, listened to E*'s position, and then agreed with them that offering more HD channels with VOOM-lite was a better strategy than offering fewer HD channels (such as not offering ESPN2-HD and Universal-HD) with VOOM true/1920 HD.

If this is a correct reading, then Satelliteguys, as a group, has endorsed (or at least has officially accepted) VOOM 1280. At least that is how E* is going to read it.

Thus there really is no way for Satelliteguys to formally complain about 1280 VOOM.

I guess we might still be able to make a stand on channels like HDNET, but even here that argument has been undercut.

 

[Gary Murrell]

Dish will have all mpeg2 HD at 1280x1080i ASAP, there is no doubt about this, that is why I am looking to dump right now

Dish is headed for HD-Lite and there is no ?'s about it

what happened to all this talk of sticking up against HD-Lite at CES, sounds to me like a bunch of ass-kissing went on ??

bottom line is that very few folks agree with the very few of us, who wish to stand up for quality, I am not fighting it anymore, what is done is done and Dish has made their bed

-Gary

 

[BFG]

Well if they aren't going to be changing the PQ how come we can't get 11 more voom channels instead of 5 now?

 

[Gary Murrell]

Dish no doubt cut Voom back to make room for stuff like Universal and other HD-Lite garbage

-Gary

 

[gutter]

I hate to admitt it but Gary is right. I was shocked by Scott's comment that we wanted more HD at the expense of quality. I remember no such thing. it was exactly the opposite. I really hate to say it but was Scott in aww of all the attention he was getting from DISH and therefore, he crumbled. Again, I hate to believe that but his own comments brings this into question.

Against all hope, I will hold until the Charlie Chat but I doubt that Charlie will even comment about HD resolution nor will he allow any question to slip through on it. It is a real shame. I just sold my old 4DTV receiver and was going to take down my BUD after over 20 years of use. Yes before encription. I didn't have the HD module and they are not easy to find since Motorola is not making them anymore. WFT are we to do. I will write my emails on Tuesday if nothing changes. I don't expect anything to change. All the good news and even the swap of my 942 or a 622 doesn't excite me anymore. Santa Clause has been replace by the Grinch of HD... Good ol' Charlie.

 

[BrettTRay]

what happened to all this talk of sticking up against HD-Lite at CES, sounds to me like a bunch of ass-kissing went on ??
-Gary

This is what alot of us are wondering.

 

[schwa]

Let's just hope that the "real" HD channels, particularly HDNet and HDNet Movies, stay that way. I suspect that Mark Cuban wouldn't like it too much if the quality of his flagship network was undermined by Dish...maybe that's an avenue we can pursue if all else fails.

I sure hope that folks at Dish monitor these forums so they know how upset their highest-tier customers are getting at these new announcements. Let's just hope we're all pleasantly surprised on Monday.

 

[BrettTRay]

The sad thing is the customers are the ones losing right now. The ones that paid alot of money to support a up and coming technology. Then we get sh*t on. I don't have any desire to get a MPEG4 box now and I really don't have near as much drive to preticipate in this forum and I think alot of others feel the same. Nothing against anyone but I think that the excitement of Satellite HD is gone and dead. I feel the forums that concentrate on OTA and BluRay/HD DVD content is where the people will be rushing.

 

[Tom Bombadil]

Dish doesn't need to monitor these forums right now. They just went to the extraordinary step of sitting down with multiple representatives of this forum.

 

[BFG]

Sounds like dish used some voodoo magic at the show and got the folks their to somehow understand this profound position they have where they can't add more channels without reducing quality, which is just a flat out lie.

Remember 2 months ago when they said the MPEG4 technology wasn't there yet. Well now they've realized this marketing marvel of making folks that want the new channels to buy new equipment and switch to a new programming package that costs another $5

 

[ksload]

Satelliteguys.us endorsement of HD Lite is very disturbing..tantamount to a sell out. If this is true, Satelliteguys has outlived its usefulness...as has Voom...and, ultimately Dish Network.

I'll also dump Voom and hope that other technologies coming down the pipe can be a real alternative to DBS. Dish has pulled one too many anti-customer stunts.

 

[Reefer123]

You know I am still amazed some people are holding out for Charlie Chat on monday. What a joke. Its done, over, finished. In time you will (IMO) have everything down rezzed except one channel...The Demo Channel. And you know what, if Charlie told Lifetime (the 8th rated cable channel) to go pound snad what do you think they will tell Mark Cuban??? Trust me HDNet will in time be downrezzed so it looks similar to the remaining channels. You know what, I don't have the Vooms on cable (and lets be truthful the content sucks and thats why Voom went under) and am missing some other channels, but at the price I am getting, along with and I still smile when I say this $0 dual tuner HD DVR I no longer saw any reason to stay with Dish.

Plus my wife has already "thanked me" today for getting Lifetime back.

 

[gutter]

Satelliteguys.us endorsement of HD Lite is very disturbing..tantamount to a sell out. If this is true, Satelliteguys has outlived its usefulness...QUOTE]


Boy...Scott... pay attention. I don't think you realize what you started. Just because you were surrounded by billionairs doesn't make them right. What made or makes this site viable was our willingness to fight for what is right. Please review your postion and see how it has been viewed by your loyal subs.

 

[Reefer123]

Oh and who was the genius at E* that decided to carry all the subchannels also?!?! Here in philly between the big 4 we have 5 subchannels. Now I know they will be compressed to hell and back but if you say 3 subchannels per each of the 50 markets they will launch thats another 150!!!! channels they will carry if that is not a waste of valuable bandwidth then I don't know what the hell I am talking about.

Just another nail in the HD coffin.

Ohhh and one more thing. Alot of people here are a bunch of pu&^^%$s. They said "if they don't give true HD I am cancelling right away" yet I have already read a few saying something along the lines of "well at least we still have more channels than x and y." Way to take a stand...

Thats EXACTLY what dish wanted to hear...idiots!

 

[spindoctor]

REEFER

easy solution lets not buy MPEG4 equipment , it will take at least 3 years to replace all of them old receivers

then get FIOS.

 

[Tom Bombadil]

Sounds like dish used some voodoo magic at the show and got the folks their to somehow understand this profound position they have where they can't add more channels without reducing quality, which is just a flat out lie.

From reading Scott's message, it appears that one key point was Dish convincing them that most existing HDTV sets show very little difference between 1920x1080 vs 1280x1080. This can be close to the truth for some sets, and I have written so in these forums.

However the point that needed to be strongly made to Dish is that we are not talking about the past or present, we are talking about the future of HD. The future is that many, many true 1920 sets are coming out and more will follow. 1920x1080 is poised to become the defacto standard over the next 3 years, with ownership of those sets already growing.

One could also point out that there is a visible difference between 1920x1080i vs 1280x1080i on CRT RP sets (even 5 year old ones), Sony SXRD sets, all 2005 DLP sets with the 960x1080 TI chip, and the high end LCD sets with 1920x1080 pixel counts.

It is also arguable that a 1280x1080i image, when resized to 1920x1080 (which has to happen), and then downconverted to 1280x720p will be degradated as compared to a true 1920x1080 source being converted to 1280x720p. Thus even on today's 720p sets, there can be a noticable difference. Although perhaps not noticable on a 20" LCD 720p set.

Downrezzing to 1280 now is not an argument that we should readily accept, or at least agree to. I would not have conceded this point to Dish. Just because the lowest common denominator for HDTV sets are those with a max resolution of 1280x720, does not grant Dish the unquestionable privilege of downrezzing to 1280. Also noone should ever accept the statement that 1280x1080i is an official HD standard, it simply isn't. Dish saying so 100 times does not make it true.

I know I'm spitting into the wind on this because this discussion is now over. But it seems to me that Dish put out an argument that was questionable and got away with it.

 

[Gary Murrell]

Yes we were represented real well in front of Dish , give me 30 seconds with a Dish Rep

If we fellas who are cancelling can't get anyone to join us then Dish will see that HD-Lite is ok

on the other hand Dish just pissed away a high $ sub like me, I pay 140$ a month and so do lots of other HD sub's, a bunch of those guys drop Dish and something may be noticed

I wanted to organize a massive cancelling of service if Dish screwed us and they have, the last and final step is for all HD to go to 1280x1080i and that can't be long

If 500 high $ subs like me cancel, then that is almost 1,000,000$ in revenue lost for the year, think that won't be noticed
even 250 High $ sub's cancelling will put a 500,000$ dent in things

bottom line is that I am very disappointed in our reps at the CES show, I don't know all that was asked or said of course, but it wasn't much

-Gary