Professional baseball in south Florida last chance...

salsadancer7

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Original poster
Jun 1, 2004
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South Florida
Today, Dade County and the City of Miami will have two seperate votes to decide the fate of whether south Florida will fund a new retractable roof stadium for the Florida Marlins....the FINAL hurdle. Now, the way it looks....it is 50-50 right now as far as all the reports I have seen on local news and read. It might have favored toward NOT happening due to the HUGE ruckus formed by the teachers union that was promised a raise in the last contract agreement between the county and the teachers union...and they will NOT be getting it....in fact, they have been asked to work less hours and a whole bunch of things that is somewhat TOO political to get into on this thread.

I am torn between REALLY wanting a stadium, but NOT at the expense of teachers, firemen and cops losing their jobs and watering down my children's education. It is also a VERY WELL known here how much I HATE BILLIONAIRE owners holding cities hostage for stadiums when they full well can afford to built it themselves. To the Marlins ownerships defense, they are putting more of THEIR OWN MONEY than any owner has to build a stadium in the last 50 years....somewhere in the range of $160 million dollars. BUT the city and the county has to come up with the remaining $350 million. The Marlins state they WILL pay for "any overages" above the $515-$525 million dollar price tag.

So needless to say, it is a big day here.

The Florida Marlins Get your Marlins Tickets now! have clamored repeatedly for the construction of a new ballpark to begin. The team, closer than ever to its goal, now faces a last-minute struggle to pay for a new home in a sinking economy.

Two crucial votes today should determine whether the Marlins will be able to break ground this summer on a $515 million stadium at the former site of the Orange Bowl.

Marlins President David Samson calls today's meetings "the vote of all votes." Approval is not assured.

Contracts to build the ballpark need three of five votes at the Miami City Commission, and nine of 13 at the Miami-Dade County Commission, where the team is likely to run into more opposition.

The ballpark would be financed mostly from taxes paid by tourists. But county commissioners, some of whom have supported the project in the past, are concerned about pledging a large sum of money during a recession. Some also worry that certain general fund revenue could be tapped as a backstop, should bed-tax dollars run short.

"That means we could cut services," said County Commissioner Joe Martinez, who also questions team financing for its portion of the deal.

The plan's specifics call for the county to contribute $297 million from hotel bed taxes and $50 million from a general obligation bond issue. The city would provide the land and $13 million in bed taxes, and build $94 million worth of parking garages and lots. The team would contribute $155 million. The Marlins have always stressed they don't want to redirect tax dollars for social services to the ballpark.

"That's not the intent of the deal, and it will not happen in this deal," Samson said.

County Commissioner Sally Heyman supports keeping the Marlins in South Florida but doesn't like the county carrying the burden of the project.

"The Marlins want a new home and they want us to give them their home loan," she said.

County Commissioner Carlos Gimenez worries about a variety of issues, including the amount the Marlins are contributing and encumbering hotel tax dollars for decades.

"When you start doing this, you're also mortgaging the future," Gimenez said. "You're also tying the hands of future generations of commissions from having any money to do projects of their own."

County Commissioner Natacha Seijas, who hasn't always favored the ballpark, said she is pleased that her concerns that labor unions and wages be protected have been addressed. She said county staff assured her there is enough hotel bed tax revenue to cover the project.

"To this point, right now, I'm comfortable with what I'm seeing," Seijas said.


Marlins stadium teeters on 'vote of all votes' -- South Florida Sun-Sentinel.com

EDIT: I have added some pics of the proposed new stadium
 

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Boy this really burns me up. As much as I really like sports and enjoy watching my favorite teams. I think they should pay their own money to build their own staduims. Quit making tax payers foot the bill unless you let people come to the games for free.
 
Boy this really burns me up. As much as I really like sports and enjoy watching my favorite teams. I think they should pay their own money to build their own staduims. Quit making tax payers foot the bill unless you let people come to the games for free.

Ramy, you are preaching to the choir. THIS IS THE MAIN REASON I rarely side with the owners in ANYTHING when it comes to labor agreements!! They ALWAYS want SOMEONE ELSE to foo the bill....ALWAYS!! AND....the owners are NEVER to blame!
 
The timing couldn't be worse on this. I'm shocked that they are even going through with the vote. South Florida has been hit worse than average in this recession and the team wants taxpayer money for a stadium? That's like having a referendum on bank executives getting bonuses. I never get over the nerve of some people.
 
Ramy, you are preaching to the choir. THIS IS THE MAIN REASON I rarely side with the owners in ANYTHING when it comes to labor agreements!! They ALWAYS want SOMEONE ELSE to foo the bill....ALWAYS!! AND....the owners are NEVER to blame!

Now this might not hurt Miami, being a tourist attraction and everything, but imagine how much money Miami will lose if the team left.


Now small cities like Pittsburgh needs their sports team for revenue.

The Penguins made a lot of money for the city during the Stanley Cup finals. I'm glad they are getting a new arena, it will in the long run help the city.
 
The timing couldn't be worse on this. I'm shocked that they are even going through with the vote. South Florida has been hit worse than average in this recession and the team wants taxpayer money for a stadium? That's like having a referendum on bank executives getting bonuses. I never get over the nerve of some people.

Yep! Like I stated before....I ma torn because I think Miami would be a great market for baseball because of the latin connection. The problem is we don't have enough BASEBALL FANS but ALOT of Yankee, Mets, Cubs, Phillies, Red Sox and Braves fans to EASILY load ANY stadium. They estimate that almost 60% of the state is NOT native Floridan....and in Miami, even MORE...around 70-75%. The above mention fans are VERY loyal to their teams...and the LAST THING a Phillies, Braves or a Mets fan is gonna do is root for the local team that HAPPENS TO BE in the SAME division as their team.

Florida has been hit VERY hard with this recession...their unemployment rate is just at or above 8 and the housing is either 2nd or tied for 2nd with the worse loss of value in homes in the US...somewhere around 20-33%. The good news is if this passes, MOST of the money will come from hotel taxes on out of towners, bad news is....the hotels are suffering because early in the heavy winter vacationers, they are down like 15% from last year.....that is huge.

We shall see....
 
Now this might not hurt Miami, being a tourist attraction and everything, but imagine how much money Miami will lose if the team left.


Now small cities like Pittsburgh needs their sports team for revenue.

The Penguins made a lot of money for the city during the Stanley Cup finals. I'm glad they are getting a new arena, it will in the long run help the city.

This is very true and I have seen that this is rarely talked about.
 
This is very true and I have seen that this is rarely talked about.

Because of the NHL lockout, Pittsburgh lost a lot of money.

Because of the NHL lockout last year, Pittsburgh already has experienced the economic impact of a lost hockey season. The Greater Pittsburgh Convention & Visitors Bureau estimated the lockout cost Pittsburgh $48million. A Carnegie Mellon University study figured the Penguins' yearly financial impact at $104.4 million.

Will Pittsburgh become the next Hartford? - Pittsburgh Tribune-Review
 
Because of the NHL lockout, Pittsburgh lost a lot of money.

And see, those are the things they don't much about.

Here is how Miami Mayor Manny Diaz started the for the push for the stadium.

Miami mayor pushes Florida Marlins stadium before crucial vote

BY MICHAEL VASQUEZ
mrvasquez@MiamiHerald.com

Miami Mayor Manny Diaz, in his opening statement as city commissioners took up the Marlins stadium issue Friday, called the public works project an important part of the ''blueprint'' for keeping Miami a world-class, competitive city in the decades to come.

Diaz placed the stadium in the same category as public investments in park space and performing arts centers.

Most of the stadium's cost would be footed by the public. But Diaz seized upon on the fact that the contribution is primarily in the form of hotel bed taxes -- which are often paid by tourists.

The stadium, Diaz said, is a $600 million local investment ``using other people's money.''

And the investment could not come at a more needed time, Diaz said. With the economy struggling deeply, the mayor said, government has a responsibility to create jobs -- and stadium construction would create some 2,000 jobs, with hundreds of new, permanent jobs once the facility is complete.

Diaz said he recently visited the construction site of an office building being built on Brickell Avenue, and the workers there urged him to secure passage of the new stadium. Diaz quoted one worker as telling him, ``I have no idea what I'm going to do once I'm done here.''

The mayor also said he was ''offended'' by talk that the kinds of jobs a stadium produces are low-wage, less-desirable jobs.

''It is my opinion that a job is a job,'' Diaz said. ``My parents washed dishes, they cleaned homes and they washed cars.''

Those jobs, Diaz said, made it possible for him to become the first in his family to attend college.


Miami mayor pushes Florida Marlins stadium before crucial vote - Florida and Local Politics - MiamiHerald.com
 
Met fans will come.


Sandra

ONLY if the METS play the Marlins. Like I said, FORMER northeners are very loyal to their teams.

If they build it, will anybody come?

The will come....because they will not have to worry about hot as Africa days from July through mid October and they will be closer to Miami, the beaches and shopping and entertainment....you do not have that where they are now.
 
Never underestimate the importance of a new stadium in rejuvenating a franchise.

Just ask the Indians.
The Marlins have still won two WS titles in spite of playing in the worst stadium in baseball. The Indians and other teams that built new stadiums couldn't compete in their old stadiums and they built those new stadiums when the economy was good and money was cheap. The Marlins are crazy to ask taxpayers to pay for a new stadium in this economy. As if there hasn't been enough construction of things in south Florida that people couldn't afford. :rolleyes:
 
The Marlins, to me, can be schizophrenic.

I love their talent- Uggla and Hanley are on my fantasy baseball team- and when I watch their highlights on MLB.com, they have very enthusiastic announcers (especially when there's a walk-off win), but the stadium can be strangely empty at time.

If only more Marlins fans cared about the team like salsa does.

If there were 50,000 clones of Salsa, they'd pack the stadium!
 
The Marlins, to me, can be schizophrenic.

I love their talent- Uggla and Hanley are on my fantasy baseball team- and when I watch their highlights on MLB.com, they have very enthusiastic announcers (especially when there's a walk-off win), but the stadium can be strangely empty at time.

If only more Marlins fans cared about the team like salsa does.

If there were 50,000 clones of Salsa, they'd pack the stadium!

And you know what.....50,000 would NOT fill the stadium! When it is set up for baseball, capacity is around 63,000.....football, it's like 72,000.

We get 35,000 for all the big series....Braves, Mets, Phillies, Cubs and any AL team that is good. For alot of BASEBALL STADIUMS, that is almost 90% full or more because most BASEBALL STADIUMS that have built for capacity at anywhere between 38-43,000....at Dolphins Stadium, that is barely 50%!
 

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