Professional Installers out there....I'm Desperate for Help

[lurch]

Did They Install The Filter That Comes In The Box With It? It Should Be Connected To The Sat In On Back Of Ird.

 

[dragon002]

bill,

it is not coax or electrical system related, just by the fact that you are getting the 101 and 119, so forget the grounding and los issues, you already tried a different ird and had the same problem. that leaves one item, the HSP tech really didnt change the lnb at the service call!!! im not saying he was dishonest, he may have removed yours ,laid it down next to the new one and reinstalled the original by mistake.

BTW i have tried to skim the side of a house and barely caught an overhang, and have GOTTEN EITHER EVEN OR ODD transponders and it has happened more than once, so who ever said that wont happen, is wrong.

dragon

ps i was an HSP tech for 3.5 years and we had to stay till the problem was resolved, why did he leave?? did they charge you?? do you have the insurance??

 

[Bill1955]

bill,

it is not coax or electrical system related, just by the fact that you are getting the 101 and 119, so forget the grounding and los issues, you already tried a different ird and had the same problem. that leaves one item, the HSP tech really didnt change the lnb at the service call!!! im not saying he was dishonest, he may have removed yours ,laid it down next to the new one and reinstalled the original by mistake.

BTW i have tried to skim the side of a house and barely caught an overhang, and have GOTTEN EITHER EVEN OR ODD transponders and it has happened more than once, so who ever said that wont happen, is wrong.

dragon

ps i was an HSP tech for 3.5 years and we had to stay till the problem was resolved, why did he leave?? did they charge you?? do you have the insurance??

Dragon, Thanks for your ideas. I just had a thought, do you suppose the installer DID change the LNB, but because the receiver is sending too strong a signal, it ruined his Multiswitch too?? As I said, the installer had an LNB with a big old gauge attached to it, he couldn't have mistakenly used the wrong one. Is there some other way to hook them up and that doesn't involve replacing the old one? Unfortunately, the installers in my area(only two) are very young, and not very experienced in HD installations. He basically threw up his hands and said "I have no idea what is wrong" He thought we should add a tripod to the roof and try that. There is no overhang the dish is installed at the peak of our roof and its a brand new install paid for by D*, they have been here 3 times and yes they have left each time without fixing the problem.

 

[Bill1955]

Did They Install The Filter That Comes In The Box With It? It Should Be Connected To The Sat In On Back Of Ird.

Lurch, No filter is installed to that port the cable is connected directly.......what would the filter look like, I'll see if I can locate it in the box?

 

[dragon002]

bill,

that little bit of extra voltage isnt going to do squat, and it would ruin the whole switch not JUST the 110 slot. ive seen indirect lightening strikes that wasted the irds and the lnb still worked.
pm me where you live and maybe i can talk to some people.

dragon

 

[Bill1955]

bill,

that little bit of extra voltage isnt going to do squat, and it would ruin the whole switch not JUST the 110 slot. ive seen indirect lightening strikes that wasted the irds and the lnb still worked.
pm me where you live and maybe i can talk to some people.

dragon

Oh yep you're right.....we had a lightening strike on our old equipment. Fried the ird, but the rest of the equipment was fine.

 

[greyghost]

Unbelievable. This has been going on since the 14th. It should take 15 minutes to troubleshoot 99.9% of the problems you can encounter with a D* system. OK, Bill, I'm there are three pages of responses here, so I'm going to go off your original post.

1. You were getting signal strengths of 70s - 90s on the 119. If the 101 and 110 had 90s on all xpndrs (transponders), then there is still a LOS issue. If all xpndrs on all three sats were 70s - 90s, then the dish needs to be repointed. In the end, you should have 90s on all xpndrs, all sats.

2. No even xpndrs on the 119. ATTENTION ALL INSTALLERS!!! Follow these troubleshooting steps faithfully and you will save yourself days of work by the end of the year. I have shortened the steps to apply to this type of issue. For a complete list of troubleshooting steps, email me and I will attach it to the response.
A. Run a test line from the HD rx (receiver) directly to the dish (through a window or door). It must go directly to the dish and therefore have but two connectors on it- one attached to the receiver, the other attached to the dish. Disconnect all other lines at the dish. If this solves the problem, the issue is in the cabling - go to step B. If this does not solve the problem, the issue is the equipment (rx, lnb, multiswitch)- go to step C.
B. Either replace the line (always the best option) or disconnect the test line at the dish, connect it at the next connection point closer to the rx (should be the ground block) and connect the original line from that point back to the dish. Continue this process until you find the faulty section of cable and replace that section. Then replace each additional line, one at a time. Repeat this process if any additional lines display problems.
C. Replace LNB. If problem still exists, replace rx. At this point you have installed a new D* system. If the problem still persists, begin to look at electrical solutions (ie. there may be a ground fault at the outlet that is interfering with the voltage sent from the rx to the dish). The ONLY electrical troubleshooting that should be done by anyone other than a certified electrician should be to test the rx at another outlet or try a two prong adaptor as a test only- never leave the two prong adaptor in place at a three prong outlet.

It really is that simple. In thousands of installations (D*, E*, & V*), I have found but three instances where I was more than 15 - 20 minutes troubleshooting the problem. One was an electrical problem found by using a two prong adaptor. Another was what I called the "fuzzy picture phenomena"- an issue with certain rear projection tvs and something for a discussion in another thread. The third was an issue with Panasonic's first attempt at D* rxs.
Again, the troubleshooting steps above have been shortened for Bill1955's issue. If anyone would like the complete list of steps (only one or two steps longer), please shoot me a PM.

 

[miller5]

We're an HSP in Nebraska. You've just listed the most basic troubleshooting process. No one has suggested a cold drop from IRD to LNB? Wow. Reliance on what you "think" is new or good cable will ruin your day in these situations. Dont trust anything you dont run yourself. Has anyone tried changing out the skin? We've had issues with missing various transponders as a result of a slightly bent skin. Worth a shot at this point, but start with the troubleshooting process listed by grey.

 

[Bill1955]

I know this is a really long post, so its hard to go back and read it all......but we have tried all those things........we did the direct cable from the dish to the rno difference). We changed the LNB(or at least the installer said he changed it out) (no difference). We changed the rwent from a RCA to a samsung, back to the RCA) (no difference). We moved the dish all over the roof and maxed out our signals on the evens(on 119) to 98 (no difference) Our signal on the 110 is the worst and that only registers in the 60's or 70's but we have no problems with reception on those channels. Our installers said that in our area no one pulls 90's to 100's on all transponders. So let's see. The only thing we haven't tried is changing to a difference electrical outlet. We'll do that tonight. We can also try the two prong outlet. Our house was kinda jury rigged when it comes to the electrical work, so maybe that's the issue. I'm very concerned that the installer never did change out the LNB like he said he did....Like I said before he did have a Phase III LNB with him and it had a device attached to it with dials on it (what the heck was that anyways??)

 

[TYORK]

Unbelievable. This has been going on since the 14th. It should take 15 minutes to troubleshoot 99.9% of the problems you can encounter with a D* system. OK, Bill, I'm there are three pages of responses here, so I'm going to go off your original post.

1. You were getting signal strengths of 70s - 90s on the 119. If the 101 and 110 had 90s on all xpndrs (transponders), then there is still a LOS issue. If all xpndrs on all three sats were 70s - 90s, then the dish needs to be repointed. In the end, you should have 90s on all xpndrs, all sats.

2. No even xpndrs on the 119. ATTENTION ALL INSTALLERS!!! Follow these troubleshooting steps faithfully and you will save yourself days of work by the end of the year. I have shortened the steps to apply to this type of issue. For a complete list of troubleshooting steps, email me and I will attach it to the response.
A. Run a test line from the HD rx (receiver) directly to the dish (through a window or door). It must go directly to the dish and therefore have but two connectors on it- one attached to the receiver, the other attached to the dish. Disconnect all other lines at the dish. If this solves the problem, the issue is in the cabling - go to step B. If this does not solve the problem, the issue is the equipment (rx, lnb, multiswitch)- go to step C.
B. Either replace the line (always the best option) or disconnect the test line at the dish, connect it at the next connection point closer to the rx (should be the ground block) and connect the original line from that point back to the dish. Continue this process until you find the faulty section of cable and replace that section. Then replace each additional line, one at a time. Repeat this process if any additional lines display problems.
C. Replace LNB. If problem still exists, replace rx. At this point you have installed a new D* system. If the problem still persists, begin to look at electrical solutions (ie. there may be a ground fault at the outlet that is interfering with the voltage sent from the rx to the dish). The ONLY electrical troubleshooting that should be done by anyone other than a certified electrician should be to test the rx at another outlet or try a two prong adaptor as a test only- never leave the two prong adaptor in place at a three prong outlet.

It really is that simple. In thousands of installations (D*, E*, & V*), I have found but three instances where I was more than 15 - 20 minutes troubleshooting the problem. One was an electrical problem found by using a two prong adaptor. Another was what I called the "fuzzy picture phenomena"- an issue with certain rear projection tvs and something for a discussion in another thread. The third was an issue with Panasonic's first attempt at D* rxs.
Again, the troubleshooting steps above have been shortened for Bill1955's issue. If anyone would like the complete list of steps (only one or two steps longer), please shoot me a PM.

Greyghost ,
I must say that you have told him nothing that the rest of us have no except the electicial part So please don't act like we don't know what we are doing we were just trying to help with the simple things first.

tyork

 

[TYORK]

bill ,

I think you need to try the lmb switch out again that about all that is left to change since you are not 100 % sure he changed this out that would be my next step to try this again.

 

[miller5]

Have you tried changing the dish itself. I'm talking about the reflector specifically.We have had a bent skin do the same thing. It was bent in shipping apparently just enough to throw the refraction out of whack on 2 sats only. Replace the entire dish. Worth a shot.

 

[miller5]

Also, check the polarity on the electrical outlet, and check the voltage from the outlet as well. You can buy a polarity tester from any hardware store.

 

[Bill1955]

Do you guys think its okay if I just call the installer up(since it was a free install) and say come back and change the ENTIRE DISH.......and see what happens??

 

[TYORK]

Do you guys think its okay if I just call the installer up(since it was a free install) and say come back and change the ENTIRE DISH.......and see what happens??

yes you should call him back cause you really have a big problem here and he should be the one that fixes it.

 

[dragon002]

I know this is a really long post, so its hard to go back and read it all......but we have tried all those things........we did the direct cable from the dish to the rno difference). We changed the LNB(or at least the installer said he changed it out) (no difference). We changed the rwent from a RCA to a samsung, back to the RCA) (no difference). We moved the dish all over the roof and maxed out our signals on the evens(on 119) to 98 (no difference) Our signal on the 110 is the worst and that only registers in the 60's or 70's but we have no problems with reception on those channels. Our installers said that in our area no one pulls 90's to 100's on all transponders. So let's see. The only thing we haven't tried is changing to a difference electrical outlet. We'll do that tonight. We can also try the two prong outlet. Our house was kinda jury rigged when it comes to the electrical work, so maybe that's the issue. I'm very concerned that the installer never did change out the LNB like he said he did....Like I said before he did have a Phase III LNB with him and it had a device attached to it with dials on it (what the heck was that anyways??)

bill give me your zip code

dragon

ps ghost, t is right all you said has already been discussed
and you arent the best at directv, i am

and the tech brought a phase 3 lnd with a meter attached to it, aligned the dish and put yours right back in!!!! RIGHT :shocked

 

[Bill1955]

bill give me your zip code

dragon

ps ghost, t is right all you said has already been discussed
and you arent the best at directv, i am

and the tech brought a phase 3 lnd with a meter attached to it, aligned the dish and put yours right back in!!!! RIGHT :shocked

Zip = 04740........oh yes I think you're right, if that thingy was a meter, that's what he did.....and said there's nothing wrong with the LNB..........

 

[greyghost]

Didn't mean to offend anyone, least of all you, tyork. However, although all these steps had been mentioned, and as bill1955 confirms, been tried, it sounds as if they were not attempted all at once and in order, which is essential. For instance, bill1955 said that the direct test line was tried. But were the other lines removed from the lnb at the time? That is a very important piece of the process. No one piece of that process is reliable in and of itself. All the steps must be taken in conjuction with the others. So, yes, what I have listed is only the most basic troubleshooting process. But if it has not been followed completely and faithfully, then the real problem could still be hiding in plain sight.

 

[Bill1955]

Greyghost......Thank you, Thank you. you are absolutely right, we need all the help we can get and we did not try things in the order that you listed them.....it was really helter skelter from our standpoint.....first we'd try one thing, then another. And as I said I think the installers were very inexperienced (and that's okay, everyone has to learn)....so it really is helpful, even if its the same thing thats been mentioned before. To have to written so concisely. I, for one, intend to print it off and give it to our installers.....I hope they won't be offended, but even if they are and more importantly, I hope that they will learn something and the next people won't have to go through all this.........so thank you....actually thank you everyone........BUT, I sure hope we find the problem soon.....I feel like throwing the whole kit and caboodle out the window!!!!!!!!!

 

[TYORK]

Didn't mean to offend anyone, least of all you, tyork. However, although all these steps had been mentioned, and as bill1955 confirms, been tried, it sounds as if they were not attempted all at once and in order, which is essential. For instance, bill1955 said that the direct test line was tried. But were the other lines removed from the lnb at the time? That is a very important piece of the process. No one piece of that process is reliable in and of itself. All the steps must be taken in conjuction with the others. So, yes, what I have listed is only the most basic troubleshooting process. But if it has not been followed completely and faithfully, then the real problem could still be hiding in plain sight.

No offense taken here i guess it just the way you worded your post. And yes i really would like to know what is going on here to . Hang in there bill something has to work sooner or later.