ASC1 Users

[lme]

My unit is stopping with the message "limit switch....", when the dish travels for long run like say 135W TO 50W.
When touching the unit with a finger, there is clinking noise coming from inside, like lose parts (power off, installing/removing wires).
Anybody else had those situation ?

 

[Cham]

Maybe a bad conection or intermittant short to the motor causing the relays to chatter? Also could be motor brushes wearing out. Check the wiring between the dish and ASC1. A sudden open circuit might cause the unit to indicate the motor has hit the internal limiter switch.

 

[KE4EST]

Is there in binding in the dish mechanics?
Motor brushes going south?
Really long run of two small a gauge of wire?
Intermittent connections on the control wires?
There are mechanical relays inside the ASC1 so there will be a audio click and sure you can feel it when you press east or west.
Only doing it on a long travel? Sounds like motor is going out or brushes and it is getting to slow or dish is binding somewhere.

 

[Titanium]

Additional information for consideration on Ime's motor movement question is that this has happened on on multiple units and we recently stress tested this unit on the bench to verify proper operation. We were unable to repeat the error even with excessive current draws on all circuits and over a hundred long run moves with loaded Von Wiese actuator. Something has caused a relay to fail (arc closed) on previous units and we have had suggested that there might be an intermittent problem with grounding, wiring or a system component.

The rattling is something that I would immediately check out. A loose metallic object could be dangerous, damage components. Maybe a nut, screw or washer came loose or something broke in shipping? You are welcome to ship the unit in to get checked out. If you want to look into this on your side, unplug from power outlet and stand on the top and side to see if item can be identified through the vents? Maybe you could remove the front panel screws like you had done before to provide better component viewing and noise identification?

The error message is generic display when something isn't moving, a signal not received, interference or failure on a servo or sensor.

 

[lme]

Is there in binding in the dish mechanics?
Motor brushes going south?
Really long run of two small a gauge of wire?
Intermittent connections on the control wires?
There are mechanical relays inside the ASC1 so there will be a audio click and sure you can feel it when you press east or west.
Only doing it on a long travel? Sounds like motor is going out or brushes and it is getting to slow or dish is binding somewhere.

The set up is working fine (no issues) with Vbox. As I said, the noise is coming from inside at a touch of a finger with NO POWER to the unit !
I opened the unit (as per brian suggestion), and found a lose screw for the metal base plate, but the message is still coming on display.

 

[KE4EST]

Loose screw may have shorted something and now the MCU is confused.
Have you tried a global reset?

 

[lme]

Well boys & girls, my asc1 finally collapsed.
After 4 times of reflashing with the latest firmware (witch came to light last october, when I asked if any user is having problems!), the unit is moving the dish only to
the WEST, while if is required to go to East it gives the dreadful message:"limit switch...." All tests done with ONLY the motor & sensor wires connected.
The same setup works perfect with the vbox, except for the polarity, of course. I think its time for me to give up on this unit and go back to the C/Ku combo.

 

[Titanium]

I have been providing email support for Ime for many months and with this situation for the past few days. A few hours ago I suggested to troubleshoot by reversing the M1/M2 wires to test if the motor drive direction followed the polarity reversal, but it does not. Even with the M1/M2 motor polarity wires reversed, the actuator only drives the dish West. This test would rule out the controller function as the East and the West circuits both will not drive the dish to the East. Why will the actuator only move in the West direction even when polarity is swapped?

The history with this system is that it has had four power related failures. The first DC power regulator failed from an unknown cause, the second controller had a fused DC motor relay of unknown cause, a failed polarity servo motor of unknown cause and now twice intermittent motor movement issues in the past few months. The unit operated without error when tested on our system a few months ago. Based on the history of this system, I suspect that there is either a stray voltage potential or intermittent issue with a system component or distribution wiring.

I would be happy to bench the unit again and repair or replace if it is a failure under warranty. I agree that something is amiss with the system, but suspect that the actual cause of the problems has yet to be identified. Could it be that a G/VBox has no ground connection and the ASC1's grounding plug is bringing into play a grounding issue?

No need to reinstall the same firmware repeatedly. A simple Global Reset sets everything back to the default. We loaded the latest firmware when it was sent in for testing a few months ago.

I am puzzled with the system gremlins and remain committed to resolving the system failures.

 

[lme]

only when pressing the EAST button, the message is on.
west button is ok.
the asc or the software needs more tuneup. it will probably happen when more users will report issues as it was last october.

 

[Titanium]

Thank you for clarifying. Understood that the ASC1 east button only works and only moves the dish in one direction that follows the M1/M2 polarity change.. This is same system failure as happened last year when the relay was welded closed.

This is not a firmware issue and no other user is reporting this problem. The October release firmware has been downloaded by over 1400 individual IP addresses and we have loaded onto over 300 units, tested and shipped since last October. Something in your system is causing these repeated electrical problems.

How do you wish to address this situation? Do you wish to continue troubleshooting or return for testing?

If you wish to provide additional testing results: A clicking sound is heard when the relay engages to send DC voltage to the motor. Do you hear a click when the East and West buttons are depressed?

 

[primestar31]

Sounds like a 'Hot ground' to me...

 

[primestar31]

Here's a test, if this works, it might prove the "hot ground" theory, and you'll need to take further steps to get that issue corrected. Do NOT use this as a permanent solution as it could be dangerous with unknown reasons as the true cause of where the stray voltage is getting into the mix. Do NOT connect the grounding tab to anything, leave it floating, and make SURE it doesn't touch the screw on the center of the outlet you plug it into. I also stress that while you do this test, you disconnect your receiver from the coax, and do NOT touch the ASC1 case, or anything else!

Cheater plug:

plug this into your outlet, and plug the ASC1 into it.

 

[KE4EST]

I have sold hundreds of the ASC1 controller and have never ran into any customer complaints like this.
Many, many happy customers. Had some with counting errors using un-sheilded cable, but that was quickly remedied.
Had a couple of other issues, here and there, but not like this. All this stuff is man made and yes you could get a dud, it happens, but I highly doubt you have gotten 4 duds in a row.

I think Primestar is dead on the money here. It is obvious there is something wrong on your end and not with the ASC1.
I would be checking my house wiring, not because of the ASC1 but because of fear of burning down the house!!

 

[lme]

using this device everything is normal

 

[Titanium]

That is a correct light display for the outlet wiring, but how about the interaction between the satellite dish ground and the electrical outlet to structure ground?

Is the satellite dish ground bonded to the structure ground? If no dedicated bonding wire is connecting the satellite dish to the structure ground, stray voltages may be traveling back through the control wires, circuits and exiting to the structure ground via the ASC1's grounded 3 pin AC plug. This would be an example of "voltage potential" and the plug LED tester would not indicate this wiring problem.

 

[. Raine]

Eliminating the ground with a cheater plug would be good to see if the problem is with grounding, but reading through the posts, it seems as if the damage is probably already done, welded relay contact, etc.

It still would be worth trying, but the unit will probably act the same if it's already damaged. Power introduced into grounds can be intermittent and very hard to find sometimes, a bare spot on a wire in a crawl space barely touching a water pipe and only conducting when the area becomes damp is one good example, it can really be tricky finding a intermittent power/ground problem.

Something to note, V Boxes have only a two wire plug, no ground terminal, so if it is a grounding/power problem, it may not affect them.

 

[N6BY]

Eliminating the ground with a cheater plug would be good to see if the problem is with grounding, but reading through the posts, it seems as if the damage is probably already done, welded relay contact, etc. ...

I agree. I think the O.P. now has 2 problems -- a hot ground and a ASC1 that has been damaged by the resulting overcurrent.

Before trying another ASC1, I would highly recommend that the O.P. install protective fuses in both power wires going to the motor. Better to blow a fuse than damage another ASC1.

...Something to note, V Boxes have only a two wire plug, no ground terminal, so if it is a grounding/power problem, it may not affect them.

Definitely, that would explain why the V Box works in this situation

 

[Titanium]

Ime emailed that the ASC1 is once again running in both directions, but now fails after multiple manual positioning bumps. Removing the AC power for some time restores the full motor movement and repeated positioning.

Maybe the stuck/welded relay has broken loose or a protection has reset? In the continued operation something is over heating or stressing the circuit and kicking in the thermal/power protection Unplugging the unit resets the protection.

Just been thinking out loud, but feel that there is an unidentified problem behind all of these failures of multiple components.

 

[Cosmo Blatz]

Just been thinking out loud,...

Me too. Who else provides this level of customer support?

 

[lme]

Here's a test, if this works, it might prove the "hot ground" theory, and you'll need to take further steps to get that issue corrected. Do NOT use this as a permanent solution as it could be dangerous with unknown reasons as the true cause of where the stray voltage is getting into the mix. Do NOT connect the grounding tab to anything, leave it floating, and make SURE it doesn't touch the screw on the center of the outlet you plug it into. I also stress that while you do this test, you disconnect your receiver from the coax, and do NOT touch the ASC1 case, or anything else!

Cheater plug:

plug this into your outlet, and plug the ASC1 into it.

Did this test & no improvement, so the outlet is fine.
I started to replace all "adds on" parts needed to have this unit to run (capacitors, resistors, etc), & the last one was 1000mF capacitor from the servo, witch looks like the culprit, but need to do more tests.