Voomware design and software problems

billr

Member
May 22, 2004
5
0
First, I want to say that I'm not going to be a reactionary Voom customer and threaten to
cancel, or file a complaint with the FCC, or register voomsucks.com and start an activist
web site. I think the service has potential and it's evident that the people behind it have
vision and good intentions.

I do believe however, that there is a fundamental problem that, unless corrected, will
cause a level of customer dissatisfaction that will prevent Voom from reaching a
critical mass and enjoy long term growth and success.

The problem? The Voom receiver's software.
I'm just an observant customer. I don't have inside knowledge of Voom's source code,
or what the constraints are in the hardware and firmware supplied by Motorola.
I have developed, or been involved in the development of enough software based
consumer products that after a few months of using some device, I can get a feel of
what lies beneath.

It's not really question of features or the user interface path, although "the problem"
is reflected in those things. Here's my guess, and it is a guess, of what's wrong.

Voomware appears to be one of those projects that incorporates "modern" software
development methodologies. Things are planned out "on paper" to the smallest detail.
Tools like Rational Rose, UML and use case planning and testing. An architecture is
developed that's message based and object oriented. Then, after it's all planned out,
coding starts and the paper model is turned into reality. Because everything is modular,
you can have separate teams that can work on those modules, and then, when it's all
plugged in together, it's hoped that the result is a perfect, bug free, feature rich product.

But what often happens is software that's slow to boot, sluggish in operation, and is
plagued with strange bugs that are as unpredictable as they are perplexing for both
customers and the developers charged with fixing the bugs.

We see reports of odd behavior in the Voom forum, things like mismapped
channels, the preview window sticking in the upper right corner, the boxes hanging
and requiring reboot, inexplicable wonky behavior... there's "the problem". We know
that there are bright people building the product, how could they release something
with such obvious problems?

When you base a product on such an architecture, when a feature is requested that
wasn't envisioned during the design phase (like OTA channel scanning), the ripple
effect to graft in new functions can be maddening. Suddenly, all kinds of unforeseen
side effects pop up and delivery of the software is delayed again and again.

This clever object based approach also takes a lot of cpu cycles to run. Every time a
single bit changes in the state of the machine, thousands of bytes need to be moved
around to pass messages between software modules. It all seems good on paper during
the pre-implementation phase but in the real world, it runs like a slug and the user
sees peculiar side effects and system lock ups. You can see this effect when rapidly
changing voom channels. The massage passing starts to swamp the relatively meager
set-top cpu and it takes several seconds for the box to catch up, or occasionally, the
messages get out of sync and the box locks up.

Although it's possible to ....eventually... fix these problems, it's not likely until voom
changes it's design and development methods. In the old days, when we were not
so "smart", when programmers could get down to the hardware and not add this level
of abstraction to give management the illusion of participation in the coding process,
stuff would "just work". (Apple seems to kind of get this concept).

Voom needs to start looking at the project from the user on down, not from the computer
on up. Just because the code fits the model designed "on paper", and the use cases
all pass testing, and the flowcharts map everything out to the smallest detail, doesn't
insure that you can ship a product that actually -works-.

(I wish Apple was building Voom boxes...)
Bill Romanowski
TQworld.com
 
I agree. The voom software sucks! Its like a new computer company developing the lastest computer but outfitting it with a non upgradable windows 3.1 knockoff that cannot be removed and only changed by them. Voom is ruining this idea with mickey mouse incomplete buggy software.
 
billr said:
We know that there are bright people building the product, how could they release something with such obvious problems?

Because they were rushed into operation.

The satellite frequencies didn't have a "stable" owner, until CableVision's Rainbow aquired them outright. There were two owners prior to Rainbow and the last one was a joint ownership of Rainbow & Loral.

Added to switching ownerships leaving the frequencies in limbo for years there was satellite redesigns delaying launch. A major delay was redesigning the satellite with 26 spotbeams and adding conus beams, the original plan was to offer niche service to 26 cities, and aquire the remaining EchoStar 61.5 frequencies after Dish and DirecTv merged (which fell apart).

The satellite launch was also delayed, and Rainbow had to start providing service by December 2003 or loose the 11 frequencies they had (Dish wanted those frequencies bad and was itching to get them). There was also delays getting a STB manufacturer, and a few weeks before the scheduled October "beta" launch there was no VOOM STB.

They didn't have much choice. It was either issue the buggy STB or never launch.
 
One of the best threads on this forum! :up

Thanks, billr, for your insights. You are onto something. I am a commercial app developer and appreciate your perspective.

And bryan27, those are some amazing insights about the company if true, and I have no reason to doubt them.

I hope nobody is under any illusion that this is a mature company or technology. For me, all the wackiness is part of the fun. We never know what content, channels, software, or news will happen next.
 
too late

Domain Name: VOOMSUCKS.COM
Record created on 15-Nov-2003
Registrant:
Rainbow DBS Company LLC (KIXXZBTSFD)
1111 Stewart Avenue
Bethpage, NY 11714
US
 
Voom never should of started up until some of the problems were fixed. It's like they said, oh well, were cross that bridge when we get to it. Guess what, the bridge is falling.
 
Billr,

I agree its possible they could be in the situation you describe, although we don't know for sure. This is one of the reasons I still write my own OS for real time embedded systems when I start a project. They don't need to be complicated and I can throttle the complexity on my own. I still write in C, not C++ and even assembly for many of the more simple projects. Once you are tied into the compiler its bad enough, but then getting tied into the compiler and someone elses OS, it becomes a debug nightmare. Let alone actual communication to on chip peripherals.

C++ and other OS works well for certain situations, but I try my best to avoid them.

It is amazing to me that the horizontal and vertical picture shift doesn't work. That is very telling to me about the development process. An extremely simple function that is broken, and possibly still broken in the new release.
 
I'm going to disagree. I have 2 boxes, both of which are amazingly stable. I can count on about 3 fingers the number of times I've had to reboot because of lockups in 3 months with Voom. The receiver is a bit sluggish, but not bad in comparison to some others I've seen. Is there room for improvement? Sure. But take a look at all the other major sat HD boxes, and they ALL have issues. Voom isn't unique here.

-MP
 
Just 'cause there not unique, doesn't make them OK. Mine would go to the red antenna at least once a day and require a reboot. Then it would work for a little while before showing a white vertical stripe outside the SD border. Horizontal dashes on a number of channels (which could be a gain issue and nothing to do w/code). Lock onto displaying one OTA channel while showing info for any other channel i asked it to switch to. Pixelate and blank. Planner only worked sporadically. I have asked a number of times and still could not get an answer on DVI levels as far as displaying blacker than black and > 100 IRE.

Certainly interaction w/hardware has some place here, but it doesn;t seem to be working all that well.
 
1080iBeVuMin said:
And bryan27, those are some amazing insights about the company if true, and I have no reason to doubt them.

The failed merger between Dish and Direct provided a bonanza of Rainbow plans through their filings, which became part of the public record. There were also numerous other filings for extensions of time that proved very useful ;)
 
bryan27 said:
Because they were rushed into operation.

The satellite frequencies didn't have a "stable" owner, until CableVision's Rainbow aquired them outright. There were two owners prior to Rainbow and the last one was a joint ownership of Rainbow & Loral.

Added to switching ownerships leaving the frequencies in limbo for years there was satellite redesigns delaying launch. A major delay was redesigning the satellite with 26 spotbeams and adding conus beams, the original plan was to offer niche service to 26 cities, and aquire the remaining EchoStar 61.5 frequencies after Dish and DirecTv merged (which fell apart).

The satellite launch was also delayed, and Rainbow had to start providing service by December 2003 or loose the 11 frequencies they had (Dish wanted those frequencies bad and was itching to get them). There was also delays getting a STB manufacturer, and a few weeks before the scheduled October "beta" launch there was no VOOM STB.

They didn't have much choice. It was either issue the buggy STB or never launch.
So what is the excuse now? 7-9 months later? How long does that excuse last? forever? Voom knew when their deadlines were on using the frequencies. This is not an excuse in my book. I cant believe someone would be reckless enough to plan a new company around an event that "might" happen like a merger.
 
bryan27 said:
Because they were rushed into operation.

The satellite frequencies didn't have a "stable" owner, until CableVision's Rainbow aquired them outright. There were two owners prior to Rainbow and the last one was a joint ownership of Rainbow & Loral.

Added to switching ownerships leaving the frequencies in limbo for years there was satellite redesigns delaying launch. A major delay was redesigning the satellite with 26 spotbeams and adding conus beams, the original plan was to offer niche service to 26 cities, and aquire the remaining EchoStar 61.5 frequencies after Dish and DirecTv merged (which fell apart).

The satellite launch was also delayed, and Rainbow had to start providing service by December 2003 or loose the 11 frequencies they had (Dish wanted those frequencies bad and was itching to get them). There was also delays getting a STB manufacturer, and a few weeks before the scheduled October "beta" launch there was no VOOM STB.

They didn't have much choice. It was either issue the buggy STB or never launch.

Then you wait or offer beta service with minimal charge until you get things right. Let's be honest if D*TV offered the same # of HD channels right now with their D*HD TiVo many (not all) would leave Voom today. Perhaps I should say that I would!!!
 
You mean like the early adopters who got months and months of programming for free, with only buying the receivers? And then getting a refund on those receivers when the prices dropped? Like that? Again, I consider the software issues relatively small and certainly not worth not launching for.
 
I had 5 installers over my house in a matter of a month, no locals for three months, and my box freezes up once a week now (a significant improvement). Don't get me wrong, I want Voom to succeed because if they do I will be a happy HDTV viewer. I am just stating that October is less than four months away, making it a year. That they still don't have at least locals working it's a hoot!!!

Because I want to stay with Voom and because I wanted PVR functionality and because it looks like it's going to be a while...... I just built a HTPC PVR last week. I used a $120 PC HDTV tuner card. I get more channels on that card than on my Voom box. Now I built this thing and I know a hell of a lot less than the engineers and consultants at Voom. Period.
 
No, they don't have YOUR locals working. I get mine just fine now that I got my upgraded antenna, mast, etc; which Voom paid for. Again, most of these issues are 1 offs. If your box really freezes that much I strongly suggest you bitch at them and get a new one. Because neither of mine do, ever.
 
madpoet said:
No, they don't have YOUR locals working. I get mine just fine now that I got my upgraded antenna, mast, etc; which Voom paid for. Again, most of these issues are 1 offs. If your box really freezes that much I strongly suggest you bitch at them and get a new one. Because neither of mine do, ever.
Ever? Mine freezes like once a month not often. Unless I hook up DVI. Then if the tv isnt on before the reciever comes on I get a DVI message and the system freezes and has to be rebooted. SO I use component. I just dont believe that there exists any voomer that has never had a lock up.
 
Do you guys remember when we thought this upgrade was coming on June 1? It's like looking at a Junior High yearbook photo of yourself and thinking "I can't believe I was that stupid." This STB is total crap. I have to tell my friends "don't change the channel so fast" when I have company over (I only relinquish remote sovereignty when I'm hosting baseball/poker night). Maybe they're rewriting the entire firmware from the ground up.
 
madpoet said:
If your box really freezes that much I strongly suggest you bitch at them and get a new one. Because neither of mine do, ever.
Thanks, they replaced the box 3 months ago. I had one of the originals, my install was Week 1, Dec 2003. I think that the software will fix the issue. My box will freeze if I go to a local channel with weak signal.

Regarding the antenna, I upgraded to a Channel Master 4228 with pre-amp much better, but I will know better after manual scan.

Tap Tap Tap. yawn.....
 
I've had several Motorola receivers. Motorola seems to get into markets it can monopolize, and then shut innovation down. An example would be C-band, where Motorola bought the Digicipher abd 4dtv technology and killed the other receiver manufacturers.

There has been next to no development of new product in the field since. Progress stopped. Any technological improvements were lateral in nature. Motorola is, literally, absolutely comfortable with waiting years for promised software updates. Think Microsoft without Linux.

That being said, I've never had a Motorola receiver give up the ghost on me. I guess you could say Motorola builds em to not work very well for a long, long time.
 

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